MIDI sync Logic to ProTools HD

[bassybass]

Hi,
I've asked this on some other sites---recording, Logic and PT specific, but either nobody knows an easy answer or it's such a noob question for those wizards they won't dignify me with an answer. So here goes:

I'm running Logic 7.2 on my MacBook Pro 15", OS10.4.11
I have a little Presonus Firebox audio interface for portable use.

I will be working in a studio running ProTools HD, on a G5. Unfortunately I don;t know the PT version, or his OS, but I THINK he's still on Tiger as well, and the version of PTHD is the latest or at least very recent.

I need to be able to connect my MBP/Logic rig via MIDI to his PT HD rig so the transport functions are sync'd. Either one could be the slave or master--whatever is easiest (though I'd like to know how to do both ultimately). Neither of us are super tech-savvy. Is it a fairly simple matter of connecting via a MIDI cable from my interface (the Firebox) to his HD rig, and selecting master vs. slave, and "voila", we're good to go? We will be working in the same sample rate, tempo, etc. etc.---I know about all that. I've just never tried to connect Logic to PT before!
The audio from my rig will be recorded into his PT rig, OR, I may wait and bounce down tracks later for him to import, but for our collaboration purposes, we need the two rigs to be talking to one another, simply in terms of MIDI sync for start/play/stop, etc. I won't be triggering any MIDI devices in his setup. It's simply for locking up the transports to one another.

Many thanks!

[chicago_mike]

Syncing PT and logic is the industry standard and has been for 10 years or so..good idea to get into it.

Okay, now to get dirty,

Set Pro Tools to SLAVE, I think even the HD3 system my dad has need to be synced as the slave device under MMC. I will assume you will use MMC and not try for MTC or MIDI Clock.

So obviously set Logic as master. Yes be sure both projects are 44.1/24 or whatever you have used.

MMC Device number : This sucks donkey nuts...you have to assign each mmc device its own number. I cannot tell you and its almost NEVER the same number twice. And no the master may not always be 1...its just life and mmc.

I love all the daw manuals on mmc.."please refer to the other manual as we dont know sh1t!"

Now, if you incoroprate hardware: Example:
MPC 3000 would set as mmc master midi channel 1 device 1
Logic would be slave device 1, BUT mmc channel 2
Nuendo or PT ( nuendo in my case) is slave 2 MMC device 3.

Trust me...this is so much easier than the days of FSK Sync.

IMportant: there will be a delay in the sync process...so delayt the LAST device in the chain in accordance with the delay. You do this by moving the project back a bar most of the time.

[bassybass]

Originally Posted by chicago_mike

Syncing PT and logic is the industry standard and has been for 10 years or so..good idea to get into it.

Okay, now to get dirty,

Set Pro Tools to SLAVE, I think even the HD3 system my dad has need to be synced as the slave device under MMC. I will assume you will use MMC and not try for MTC or MIDI Clock.

So obviously set Logic as master. Yes be sure both projects are 44.1/24 or whatever you have used.

MMC Device number : This sucks donkey nuts...you have to assign each mmc device its own number. I cannot tell you and its almost NEVER the same number twice. And no the master may not always be 1...its just life and mmc.

I love all the daw manuals on mmc.."please refer to the other manual as we dont know sh1t!"

Now, if you incoroprate hardware: Example:
MPC 3000 would set as mmc master midi channel 1 device 1
Logic would be slave device 1, BUT mmc channel 2
Nuendo or PT ( nuendo in my case) is slave 2 MMC device 3.

Trust me...this is so much easier than the days of FSK Sync.

IMportant: there will be a delay in the sync process...so delayt the LAST device in the chain in accordance with the delay. You do this by moving the project back a bar most of the time.

Fantastic--thanks! Now, if you don't mind, some more details . ..
I think it is an HD3 system---I've never touched the thing--I'm the "Logic guy" coming in and will just be handing him a MIDI cable. However, he's used to much more savvy programmers than me. Is it a pretty easy matter in PT HD to get to the "slave" setting for PT and the MMC?

Then, in my Logic 7.2, I'm now poking around in the manual and in the Syncronization panel, and Preferences.
In the Sync panel, under "MIDI" I see where I can select "Transmit MMC" and "Listen to MMC Input". The Logic manual makes it seem like I need to click these, but the Logic manual has been designed by sadists to make one's head explode.
Do you know how I should set the Syncronization panel up?

Thanks!

[king_xanadu]

Originally Posted by bassybass

Hi,
I've asked this on some other sites---recording, Logic and PT specific, but either nobody knows an easy answer or it's such a noob question for those wizards they won't dignify me with an answer. So here goes:

I'm running Logic 7.2 on my MacBook Pro 15", OS10.4.11
I have a little Presonus Firebox audio interface for portable use.

I will be working in a studio running ProTools HD, on a G5. Unfortunately I don;t know the PT version, or his OS, but I THINK he's still on Tiger as well, and the version of PTHD is the latest or at least very recent.

I need to be able to connect my MBP/Logic rig via MIDI to his PT HD rig so the transport functions are sync'd. Either one could be the slave or master--whatever is easiest (though I'd like to know how to do both ultimately). Neither of us are super tech-savvy. Is it a fairly simple matter of connecting via a MIDI cable from my interface (the Firebox) to his HD rig, and selecting master vs. slave, and "voila", we're good to go? We will be working in the same sample rate, tempo, etc. etc.---I know about all that. I've just never tried to connect Logic to PT before!
The audio from my rig will be recorded into his PT rig, OR, I may wait and bounce down tracks later for him to import, but for our collaboration purposes, we need the two rigs to be talking to one another, simply in terms of MIDI sync for start/play/stop, etc. I won't be triggering any MIDI devices in his setup. It's simply for locking up the transports to one another.

Many thanks!

Originally Posted by chicago_mike

Syncing PT and logic is the industry standard and has been for 10 years or so..good idea to get into it.

Okay, now to get dirty,

Set Pro Tools to SLAVE, I think even the HD3 system my dad has need to be synced as the slave device under MMC. I will assume you will use MMC and not try for MTC or MIDI Clock.

So obviously set Logic as master. Yes be sure both projects are 44.1/24 or whatever you have used.

MMC Device number : This sucks donkey nuts...you have to assign each mmc device its own number. I cannot tell you and its almost NEVER the same number twice. And no the master may not always be 1...its just life and mmc.

I love all the daw manuals on mmc.."please refer to the other manual as we dont know sh1t!"

Now, if you incoroprate hardware: Example:
MPC 3000 would set as mmc master midi channel 1 device 1
Logic would be slave device 1, BUT mmc channel 2
Nuendo or PT ( nuendo in my case) is slave 2 MMC device 3.

Trust me...this is so much easier than the days of FSK Sync.

IMportant: there will be a delay in the sync process...so delayt the LAST device in the chain in accordance with the delay. You do this by moving the project back a bar most of the time.

Originally Posted by bassybass

Fantastic--thanks! Now, if you don't mind, some more details . ..
I think it is an HD3 system---I've never touched the thing--I'm the "Logic guy" coming in and will just be handing him a MIDI cable. However, he's used to much more savvy programmers than me. Is it a pretty easy matter in PT HD to get to the "slave" setting for PT and the MMC?

Then, in my Logic 7.2, I'm now poking around in the manual and in the Syncronization panel, and Preferences.
In the Sync panel, under "MIDI" I see where I can select "Transmit MMC" and "Listen to MMC Input". The Logic manual makes it seem like I need to click these, but the Logic manual has been designed by sadists to make one's head explode.
Do you know how I should set the Syncronization panel up?

Thanks!

[chicago_mike]

Nice kitty.....ACHOO!

Now set MMC on logic to TRANSMIT..that means master. HD# should be set to recieve MMC.

I also would do this: Get a SPDIF cable. RCA connection style and connect your audio card SPDIF out to a SPDIF IN on the hd3. You dont have to record anything, but it helps just a little in syncing.

This is the best until someone actually makes an affordable clock that wont drift like grandpa on I90.

[bassybass]

Great--thanks for all the tips!

[chicago_mike]

let us know how it goes.

[bassybass]

Actually, one more question--please bear with me:

So I set Logic to Transmit MMC. Then the other MMC options I see in Logic are:

-Output ID (Transport) with a greyed-out checkbox for "All" and a greyed-out box currently showing "127"

-Input ID (Transport) with the same greyed out boxes as above. I assume they're greyed out 'cause I'm not connected to anything external currently.

So, when I'm connected to his PT HD, these boxes will not be greyed out, correct? Can I leave it set to "All", or is this where you're talking about the MMC Device number, and I have to work with him to set the device number in his PT? How does that correspond to the number "127" I currently see in there? He's even less tech-savvy than me, mind you
I appreciate all the help---there won't be much time for mucking around when I get in there, so I'm trying to go in as informed as possible!

[chicago_mike]

IF they are greyed out: what soundcard are you running for logic?

well....you can use ALL, its not advised, but you might be able to get away with it.

MMC numbers go from all wich equals zero, and 127. regular computer numbers. Youll have to set the computers up together. its the only way.

Yes you will NOT get it on the first try. Yes you not get it on the 5th try. Maybe the 9th youll get lucky.

[bassybass]

Originally Posted by chicago_mike

IF they are greyed out: what soundcard are you running for logic?

That's just me firing up Logic using the internal audio, w/o even my Firebox connected as I explore the Sync settings. I know, "duh"

I got a hold of a friend with a PT HD rig I can go and try this out with before I go to the real gig, so hopefully I can get it in just a few tries when the heat is really on!

[bassybass]

So,
I go to my friend's with PT HD7, and bring my little Logic/MacBookPro/Firebox rig, plug in a midi cable from his "out" the "in" on my Firebox, he hits Play in PT and "voila", the transports are sync'd. I noticed as soon as I opened a Logic file with the cable running between us, the blue external sync button as automatically illuminated. Worked like a charm, but as a result, I didn't really get my hands dirty! Hopefully it'll go similarly well at the session.
At least I feel a little more confident and informed overall. Thanks for all the advice.

[chicago_mike]

It was that easy???

I hate you.

Glad its all going well.

Im texting another bassist right now whos having issues with his mpc3000, Pro Tools, and some keyboards..THATS a mess.

[bassybass]

Ha!
Well, like I said, since it DID go so smoothly at the "test site", being the worrying type, I wonder what I'll be faced with at the other studio!

Fingers crossed the same planets align the same way . . .. .

[bassybass]

Yep. Got to the real session and, drumroll . . . . .
Didn't work. In fact we fiddled about for awhile and just gave up and I bounced down my stuff to import into PT instead.
Couldn't get my Logic to Slave to his PT no matter what I tried (whereas at the last studio all I did was plug in a midi cable and we were talking as I mentioned above).
But . . .we got something to happen---When I went OUT from my Logic to IN on his PT and hit Play, his transport would move, but it would stop.
I'm almost wondering if it's something like the frame rates didn't match. Does anyone know where in PT to find the frame rate setting? (my Logic is set to 25 fps). I just don't jack about ProTools.
What he did say was, when the last guy came over and connected a rig like that, he simply changed or clicked something in his PT transport and, boom, they were sync'd. But again, I just don't jack about ProTools.