Recording with GuitarRig2

Pearl_jammin · #1 04-30-2007, 01:57 PM

Hi there.

A bit of background, I have been using a Tascam DP-01FX for my recording up till now. It's ok I guess, but I personally find it lacks a lot of tone and really kills a lot of my basses natural mojo. I was about to buy a preamp for it, or maybe a Sansamp but now I'm looking to move towards Laptop based recording.

I have copies of Cubase SX and I'm getting GuitarRig 2 this week.

I'm likely to buy a Lexicon Alpha, as I have heard it is pretty good and cheap.

My question is, is anyone using a similar set up, or has anyone and can they give me some advice.

And mainly, how would I go about using GuitarRig? I have no experiance with it, or similar software.

My guess is it basically work like effects/modeling module that would take the input from my Lexicon, apply effects and amp modelling and then somehow output into Cubase?

My setup for recording should be like this...

GL Jazz>
Effects>
Ashdown Perfect Ten MiniRig (for use as preamp)>
Acer Aspire 5000 Laptop with Realteck AC97 Soundcard>
GuitarRig2 (Modelling, effects when recording guitar)>
Cubase

I'm pretty confused with how it will work, would appreciate any input/suggestions on improvements of my choice of gear/software.

manicbassman · #2 04-30-2007, 03:09 PM

well I do mine through my Zoom B2.1U

As well as the patches and effects pedal, it has a USB interface to record through via a PC or mac and also a balanced XLR DI connection.

The Zoom B2.1U comes with Cubase LE, a 'lite' version of Cubase, but that's useless to me as I use Ardour and/or Audacity on Linux.

http://ardour.org/

http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

the main advantage of the Zoom over guitar rig 2 is that it's easy to use the Zoom live... try driving guitar rig 2 whilst playing on stage... not to mention the fact you've got to have the PC/laptop up there with you as well...

the only true advantage that guitar rig 2 has is that you can record the bare clean bass line and then try different effects/amps/cabinets offline as it were. I can do something similar with VST plugins in ardour, but it's easier to chain things together in guitar rig 2.

i_got_a_mohawk · #3 04-30-2007, 03:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manicbassman

well I do mine through my Zoom B2.1U

As well as the patches and effects pedal, it has a USB interface to record through via a PC or mac and also a balanced XLR DI connection.

The Zoom B2.1U comes with Cubase LE, a 'lite' version of Cubase, but that's useless to me as I use Ardour and/or Audacity on Linux.

http://ardour.org/

http://audacity.sourceforge.net/

the main advantage of the Zoom over guitar rig 2 is that it's easy to use the Zoom live... try driving guitar rig 2 whilst playing on stage... not to mention the fact you've got to have the PC/laptop up there with you as well...

the only true advantage that guitar rig 2 has is that you can record the bare clean bass line and then try different effects/amps/cabinets offline as it were. I can do something similar with VST plugins in ardour, but it's easier to chain things together in guitar rig 2.

Thats what i do, with both guitar and bass now

Record clean (you can have guitar rig on giving you the sounds you want, but still record the clean side of it) and then you get to tweak all the settings after recording

seamonkey · #4 04-30-2007, 05:10 PM

Guitar Rig 2, and other packages like Ampeg SVX can be used standalone or as a plug-in. In standalone mode it's just like a preamp. You can plug in an amp or headphones and play and it sounds like you're connected to a full rig. It's live and interactive. It's up to your computer's power how much processing you can do before it bogs down.

As a plugin, it's like an "insert" into a mixer. In this mode you can do just about anything including stuff that would bog down your CPU. The host software Cubase should take care of the latency. This may not be real time depending on how powerful your CPU is.

I would recommend, that as you record, you send a direct raw signal to Cubase, and use Guitar Rig as a standalone just to add some tone that you hear. Like add some distortion or reverb.
Then later remix, and use Guitar Rig as a plug-in against the raw recorded track and record to another track. You can then refine your track sound as much as you like. This also lets you ride Guitar Rig and add some custom processing at different points in a song.

BTW the Lexicon new signal processors like the mx300 and such are very interesting. They are standalone hardware processors, but they also hook up to PC's and appear as VST plugins in Cubase. Very cool idea.

i_got_a_mohawk · #5 05-01-2007, 06:07 AM

I would suggest against adding reverb unless its solo play.

I think its best to add reverb from the same plugin to all the tracks (granted vary it from there). But it seems to help pull things together

Pearl_jammin · #6 05-01-2007, 07:00 AM

Thanks for the input guys.

I have had my eye on a B2.1U for a while so I might have to pull the trigger on one soon.

One slight concern, I have a copy of GuitarRig2 and I was just messing around my microphone on my computer headset - but the latency was about a second, and the quality was terrible.

The quality issue is obviously because I was using a crappy microphone, but will the latency decrease when I'm using a the USB input from the B2.1U?

hyperlitem · #7 05-01-2007, 07:23 AM

The zoom pedal, or any zoom pedal, is NOT the same or close to guitar rig 2. Guitar rig is a professional quality amp sim. Famous bands have recorded albums with those sims on tracks. I am almost positive no one has ever recorded a major label release with any zoom pedal on it. I worked for a company that owns zoom. Very very poorly made gear. If ease of use is your major concern then the zoom is probably easier to use. If you you want a professional sounding bass sound then use guitar rig or ampeg svx. I am not super impressed with guitar rig 2's svt sim. The svx sims are much better. Guitar rig is really for that, guitars.

i_got_a_mohawk · #8 05-01-2007, 08:23 AM

Just for additional info, Amplitube is also a really good amp sim, and i think its easier to use the GR2. Amplitube is made by the same guys who did the SVX sim.

Also, you dont really want to be using a mic for things like this, its best just to plus straight into the PC/board

manicbassman · #9 05-01-2007, 08:39 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Pearl_jammin

Thanks for the input guys.

I have had my eye on a B2.1U for a while so I might have to pull the trigger on one soon.

One slight concern, I have a copy of GuitarRig2 and I was just messing around my microphone on my computer headset - but the latency was about a second, and the quality was terrible.

The quality issue is obviously because I was using a crappy microphone, but will the latency decrease when I'm using a the USB input from the B2.1U?

you need to install Zoom's ASIO drivers to reduce latency from the Zoom interface...

http://www.zoom.co.jp/english/downlo...are/gba21u.php

there are also ASIO drivers for GuitarRig2. I seem to recall asio4all as being one of them I used for the microphone in when I was last messing with it.

seamonkey · #10 05-01-2007, 09:06 AM

There's a many topics on many boards about reducing latency.
The single biggest impact for me was tuning the OS. (Windows XP) msconfig very handy. A Mac wouldn't have this problem.

As Manicbassman points out - Use ASIO drivers for sure.
But also consider the sample buffer and sample rate. Also, I don't know about guitar rig, but Ampeg SVX defaults to high resolution mode, for normal monitoring low res is fine. Then on remix move to high res to process the raw track.

Pearl_jammin · #11 05-01-2007, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by manicbassman

you need to install Zoom's ASIO drivers to reduce latency from the Zoom interface...

http://www.zoom.co.jp/english/downlo...are/gba21u.php

there are also ASIO drivers for GuitarRig2. I seem to recall asio4all as being one of them I used for the microphone in when I was last messing with it.

Cool, I'll check it out. I'm conflicted now if I should get a Zoom or a decent USB interface, I really don't need any of the stuff in the Zoom to be honest so I think I'm swaying more towards buying something like a Lexicon Alpha, as from what I have heard it will provide better quality.

And manicbassman, you live in the same county as me! Cool.

Pearl_jammin · #12 05-01-2007, 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by seamonkey

There's a many topics on many boards about reducing latency.
The single biggest impact for me was tuning the OS. (Windows XP) msconfig very handy. A Mac wouldn't have this problem.

As Manicbassman points out - Use ASIO drivers for sure.
But also consider the sample buffer and sample rate. Also, I don't know about guitar rig, but Ampeg SVX defaults to high resolution mode, for normal monitoring low res is fine. Then on remix move to high res to process the raw track.

Thanks, how exactly do you tweak msconfig to do that?

seamonkey · #13 05-01-2007, 01:48 PM

Start here
http://www.musicxp.net/tuning_tips.php
and here
http://www.audioforce.net/component/...,16/Itemid,56/
And google "msconfig"
In msconfig - Turn off things you don't need in services and startup.

It may take a few tries. Don't worry about screwing up because you can always select "Normal Startup". Still it'd be a good idea to create a system restore point before tweaking:
http://www.microsoft.com/windowsxp/u...emrestore.mspx

TheButler · #14 05-01-2007, 01:56 PM

I am using GR2 extensively recently, it has LOADS of cool preset effects that will keep you going too

I use a very simple, cheapy device M-audio JamLab which is ASIO and has very low latency <2ms. It does everything i want it to do, so i can't complain. I use GR2 as a stand alone when mucking about but as a plug-in with SX3 when i am making tunes with it. If you need to ask any questions about GR2 i have a decent knowledge so try me

Pearl_jammin · #15 05-01-2007, 02:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheButler

I am using GR2 extensively recently, it has LOADS of cool preset effects that will keep you going too

I use a very simple, cheapy device M-audio JamLab which is ASIO and has very low latency <2ms. It does everything i want it to do, so i can't complain. I use GR2 as a stand alone when mucking about but as a plug-in with SX3 when i am making tunes with it. If you need to ask any questions about GR2 i have a decent knowledge so try me

Thanks a lot for the offer Butler! I might take you up on that soon!