Recording with two audio interfaces?

saustindavis · #1 08-30-2011, 11:55 PM

I want to start recording my band to send to venues and stuff, and have a small issue with the drums. I have a Lexicon Lambda, which I really like for the price, but it only has two inputs (mic pres). I know I could do the recorderman technique, or another spaced pair technique, but I would really like to add a kick mic and a snare mic. My drummer has an M-Audio audio interface with two inputs also, and my question is... Could we set up both of our interfaces, one on each of our computers, and record using two mics each and sum them later?

The mics I have are AT2020, AT 2021, Audix i5, EV Co9 (a decent SM58 wannabe), and some crappy mics that my drummer has. I would probably do the LDC/SDC as overheads, the i5 on the snare, and the Co9 in front of the kick (I know it won't get those really low frequencies, but it will add some...). I have a small mixer, but it doesn't have phantom power, and I don't have any budget for a new mixer or a phantom power supply (that means don't suggest it). Is there a way to use two interfaces at the same time on one computer?

DuraMorte · #2 08-31-2011, 11:48 AM

Trying to record with two interfaces on one computer (or even or two computers) is kinda like a threesome; looks good on paper, but doesn't really work in practice.
The best you could hope for is ASIO4ALL, but no matter what you do, there's going to be a kludge involved somewhere, and you'll probably end up with a lot of other problems (clock mismatches, etc).
If it were me, I would record the drums using the mixer, and use the L/R out straight into your Lexicon. Hard pan the channels in your DAW, and call it a day. You'll want to record a snippet, then listen back and tweak mic positions, levels, etc., but it's very possible to get a servicable drum track with nothing but a stereo input.
Alternatively, you could set up the overheads, have the drummer record just the cymbals, the set up the kick and snare mics and record those seperately. It takes a very capable drummer to pull that off well, but it can be done.
Lastly, don't overlook the possibility of mono drums; sure, most modern records sound like your head is hovering between the first two toms, but that isn't necessary for a good drum mix.

Charling · #3 08-31-2011, 08:04 PM

^^ yeah this

To expand on a point made, the clocks in interfaces are crazy accurate, but not perfect. Just like in the tape machine days if you try and record one source with 2 different unsynced clocks then the 2 devices will push and pull the audio a little out of time in comparison to the other device. The variations are tiny and unlikely to be heard when using a single device, but phasing and flamming will be heard when you put the performance together.

Were talking a millisecond or 2 at most, but thats enough to cause some bad side effects to the recording when you try and combine the 2.

If you want to go this way, you need to find a way to synchronize the clocks of the 2 devices. Ie set one as the master and one as the slave and transmit the clock info over some kind of digital connection (wordclock/spdif etc) then make sure the slave device is set to listen for clock on the input selected. That'll make sure the second clock wavers in the same way as the first!

saustindavis · #4 08-31-2011, 09:46 PM

Wow... The two mic technique is sounding more and more appealing.

**colcifer** · #5 08-31-2011, 10:00 PM

Two mics doesn't give you a lot of options mixing but it can sound great. Invest some time setting up the kit and mics and it'll be fine.

saustindavis · #6 08-31-2011, 11:38 PM

So should I go for two overheads, or would one overhead (most likely the 2020) and something on kick or snare be better? I looked up some YouTube videos on two mic techniques that sounded pretty good, and we don't need super pro quality yet, just something to practice to and send to venues looking for gigs. Maybe I will try to borrow a better mixer from someone and use more than two mics. I know that limits me because I will have to set levels before recording and live with them afterward, but it might be better in the long run. What do you guys think?

fokof · #7 09-01-2011, 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saustindavis

Is there a way to use two interfaces at the same time on one computer?

Aggregated devices

Go to Utilities in Application folder and open the "audio/MIDI configuration" application.

In the Audio window , press the little '+" in the lower left then mark wich unit you want to work together.
Give that 'aggregated device' a name so you'll see it in your audio software

Sorry if your on PC , that can't help......

saustindavis · #8 09-01-2011, 10:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fokof

Aggregated devices

Go to Utilities in Application folder and open the "audio/MIDI configuration" application.

In the Audio window , press the little '+" in the lower left then mark wich unit you want to work together.
Give that 'aggregated device' a name so you'll see it in your audio software

Sorry if your on PC , that can't help......

I am working on a Mac, so no problem there.

Will this still be effected by the issue of different clocks? I would hate to put in all of that work and have a screwed up recording.

brstma · #9 09-01-2011, 03:26 PM

Another option, besides getting an interface with more ins, is to get a cheap mixer with more mic inputs then run the stereo outs to your interface. You'll have to do some preliminary test recording to get the mix right but it works well.

Charling · #10 09-02-2011, 12:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saustindavis

I am working on a Mac, so no problem there.

Will this still be effected by the issue of different clocks? I would hate to put in all of that work and have a screwed up recording.

Ah, sorry, I thought you were pc based for some reason.

Yes aggregate devices still need to run off of the same clock, but its easy to set up as all the info is on one screen, you have your list of devices and simply tick the box for the one you want to be the master! Very cool.

Its not always flawless, and can be a real pain when doing complex setups but for running 2 or 3 cards at once its normally pretty solid!

Once you've set it up once you may need to choose 'aggregate device' from the DAW's driver selection box, what DAW are you on?

You can even use the inbuilt mic on the mac as well as the 2 soundcards for a kinda real crunchy room mic effect! That sort of things a secret to the drum sound on a lot of famous records!

saustindavis · #11 09-02-2011, 05:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Charling

Ah, sorry, I thought you were pc based for some reason.

Yes aggregate devices still need to run off of the same clock, but its easy to set up as all the info is on one screen, you have your list of devices and simply tick the box for the one you want to be the master! Very cool.

Its not always flawless, and can be a real pain when doing complex setups but for running 2 or 3 cards at once its normally pretty solid!

Once you've set it up once you may need to choose 'aggregate device' from the DAW's driver selection box, what DAW are you on?

You can even use the inbuilt mic on the mac as well as the 2 soundcards for a kinda real crunchy room mic effect! That sort of things a secret to the drum sound on a lot of famous records!

I'm using GB, and I've asked on another forum before if it's possible to run two interfaces at once and they said no. Maybe they just didn't know this little trick. I'll mess around with it when we actually get to that phase. Thanks for the info!

**colcifer** · #12 09-02-2011, 05:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by saustindavis

So should I go for two overheads, or would one overhead (most likely the 2020) and something on kick or snare be better? I looked up some YouTube videos on two mic techniques that sounded pretty good, and we don't need super pro quality yet, just something to practice to and send to venues looking for gigs. Maybe I will try to borrow a better mixer from someone and use more than two mics. I know that limits me because I will have to set levels before recording and live with them afterward, but it might be better in the long run. What do you guys think?

Do you want stereo or is mono ok? If mono, a single overhead and kick mic would be fine. You don't have to put a good mic on the kick, really. The lows will come in fine from the overhead so the second mic is just for the 'punch' in which case a dynamic will do just fine. Kick drums ruin mics anyway so using a robust and cheap(er) dynamic would be a good choice logistically. BTW, a classic two mic mono set up has the overhead next to the drummer's head (right side but left works too) and the kick mic on the drummer's side of the drum, by the pedal. Another one has an overhead (usually a 57 for this setup) a few feet above the center of the snare and the kick mic a few feet in front of the kit, getting room sound as well (this calls for a mic with a wider bandwidth). The point is, you have lots of options even with just a few mics which, in the end, may be your situation. What have you tried so far?