Neck dive question

Joe Nerve · #1 08-01-2006, 01:56 PM

Recieved a bass that was made for me yesterday, and as some of you who've seen it had predicted, it's suffering from some serious neckdive. Does the position of the strap-pegs affect this at all? They put them in very strange places.

Would moving either of the strappegs alleviate some of the dive, and if so could you please suggest where it might best be moved to? I don't wanna start poking holes all over this thing to figure out where would be best. Thanks.

thebassclef · #2 08-01-2006, 02:04 PM

That Short top horn isn't helping any, But maybe put them in similar locations like on a T-bird?

Greenman · #3 08-01-2006, 03:04 PM

Off topic but nice finish could you show the rest of the bass?

Joe Nerve · #4 08-01-2006, 03:24 PM

Just took pics.

Gonna resize, crop, and post now.

Joe Nerve · #5 08-01-2006, 04:20 PM

Here ya go...

http://www.talkbass.com/forum/showth...=1#post3217598

73jbass · #6 08-02-2006, 10:33 PM

I was under the impression that you should get the upper horn end as close to the 12th fret as possible. It make sense.I've gotten rid of several basses because of balance issues.

PaleMelanesian · #7 08-03-2006, 07:20 AM

Having a longer horn helps, but that's not much good in this case.

Changing the relative angle between the two strap buttons will help. Raise the rear button and lower the horn button toward the neck. Lowering the horn button will also move it out toward the head a tiny bit, which will help as well. (edit: hang it from just the upper horn button, and follow the vertical to where it crosses the centerline of the body. That's the center of gravity. If the new horn position is farther away from that line, the balance will be better)

You already have Ultralights, so no help there. You could try loading a stack of pennies in the control cavity as a counterweight. Or maybe a brass control cavity cover or something artistic like that.

Beautiful piece of work there.

pilotjones · #8 08-03-2006, 09:47 AM

As others have said, the neck-end peg would best be moved as close as possible to the 12th fret- in this case, that would be up unto the rounded "Tele bump." This also gets it closer to the centerline, which should help.

The bottom-end peg could be moved upwards, away from the centerline, as well as closer to the head end. This would help change the angle between the pegs. But just don't move it too far, or else it will negatively affect the position of your right forearm going over the body. However, your bass is so guitar-like in having the bridge far from the end of the body, that you could move it pretty far without problems.

The counterweight by the bridge idea could help also, although it obviously adds weight.

There are a few more ideas that might help that haven't been mentioned yet.

One is to add a post of some sort to the upper horn, bringing the attachment point up the neck. This has been done on Warwick Thumbs and G&L ASATs with success.

Another is to use a two-strap setup that some people use on the Series I & II Alembics. It works for people who have tried it. A TB or Google search on "alembic balance strap" will hopefully turn it up. It might be on Bunnybass.

Another is to use a Spinstrap, which is similar to what was built-in to some Steinbergers. http://www.wittman-spins.com/spinstraps.html

Your headstock is too pretty to even suggest chopping it off and converting it to a headless. Although that, along with moving strap buttons, would probably fix everything.

If it were a bolt-on, you could consider moving the neck, pickups, and bridge on the body. But no luck there. Plus you'd loose your upper fret access anyway.

PaleMelanesian · #9 08-03-2006, 10:31 AM

You could even put the upper strap button on the edge of the instrument, instead of the back. That would get you and extra 1/2-inch more movement. It would change the look, though, so you may or may not want to do that.

Keith Guitars · #10 08-03-2006, 11:08 AM

Hey,

I'd suggest (as an easy upgrade) changing the tuners
to Gotoh GB350s... they are the lightest tuners I've found
by far.

For reference:
-Standard Gotoh GB7: ~63g
-Hipshot Ultralite: ~53ish g
-Gotoh GB350: 35g (!)

For a bass with 5 machines, the weight reduction is 140g,
equivalent to removing about 2.2 tuners from the headstock.

This is the easiest and most non-destructive way to improve
balance that I can suggest.

I think AllParts carries the GB350s. They are not cheap by
any means, but it is well worth it.

Peace,
Martin

pilotjones · #11 08-03-2006, 11:34 AM

I hope you can get this working. Unfortunately it looks like Minarek made you a beautifully detailed version of their Lotus design, with no concept of bass ergonomics design.

PaleMelanesian · #12 08-03-2006, 12:09 PM

Good idea, Keith.

Can you confirm for me the weights of the different styles of Hipshots? I have 51g for the 3/8 post Y and 44g for the 1/2 post Y. That doesn't sound right, but I couldn't find another source to confirm.

Thanks.

Joe Nerve · #13 08-03-2006, 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotjones

I hope you can get this working. Unfortunately it looks like Minarek made you a beautifully detailed version of their Lotus design, with no concept of bass ergonomics design.

Yeah, they're basically a guitar company just starting to get into the bass end of things. This was a gift from them, so it's a little difficult for me to voice the problems it has - expecially since I already sent it back once. On the other hand I feel I owe it to them to tell them the truth. Sheeesh. Gonna use it in a band situation at tomorrow nights gig, and then make decisions on what to do. Thanks for the help eveyone. I'm going to start with stuffing the cavity with something heavy as it's the only thing that won't cost me anything, nor alter the bass in any way that's going to scar it. If that don't work I'm gonna shift the pegs. We'll see what happens. Thanks again.

Keith Guitars · #14 08-03-2006, 02:42 PM

Hi,

I got my weight spec on the Hipshots from my own gram
scale, and the number I got was probably from the 5/8" post
Ultralite key.

I have a handful of the GB350 keys here right now, for a
9-string bass we're doing at Veillette....they are extremely
light - actually, just holding them is kind of fun - it feels like
some kind of magic trick, like they're filled with helium or
something.

Swapping out the keys on a vintage Fender for these things
would make the bass feel headless by comparison.

Peace,
Martin

budman · #15 08-03-2006, 03:06 PM

I probably missed it, but what's the scale length on that bass?

PaleMelanesian · #16 08-03-2006, 03:23 PM

Ok, thanks.

PilbaraBass · #17 08-03-2006, 10:18 PM

i'm afraid that the bass will have balance problems no matter what you do...but ultra-lite tuners are a good first step...perhaps some metal behind the control cavity plate (try some lead tape for a test)

I dig the bass, awesome finish... but what's up with the weird string pull angles on the BEA side?

pilotjones · #18 08-04-2006, 09:35 AM

Maybe you could duct tape it to the front of a Bongo, and strap that on.

Joe Nerve · #19 08-04-2006, 09:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pilotjones

Maybe you could duct tape it to the front of a Bongo, and strap that on.

I'm afraid to put duct tape on the bongo. i laready thought of that one.

pilotjones · #20 08-31-2006, 01:23 PM

Any updates on this?