Norma Bass (acoustic build)

gnarlyopossum · #1 12-05-2010, 10:14 AM

The other day, I was shopping in a thrift store for an ugly Christmas sweater for an office party. As I was checking out, I spied an old classical guitar. No strings, missing two tuners, the top coming off, and a chip out of the top. Yep, this old guitar had seen a thing or two. I casually glanced at the price tag...$2. Went to pay for it, and the cashier told me everything was 50% off that day. Price = $1. Sold.

I'm planning on building an acoustic bass guitar with a short-scale neck. I'd like it to have a decent sound unplugged with the ability to have a nice bluesy growl plugged in.

I took it home and found out its name was Norma.

After some *cough* "negotiating", I managed to pull off the top, fretboard, braces, and bridge.

This left the back, sides, and neck.

Here's my plan: I want to use as much of the original guitar as possible. I want the back to be the top, keep the sides, use the bridge (modified, of course), and build a neck to use the fretboard (18 frets). I'd like to make a cutaway, install one pickup (a vintage humbucker or something), and build a tailpiece for the modified bridge.

A question for you all (y'all?): Is it even plausible to use a classical guitar fretboard for a bass guitar? I'm not sure if the spacing of the frets would be correct.

Thoughts and feedback are welcomed.

TomA1234 · #2 12-05-2010, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnarlyopossum

A question for you all (y'all?): Is it even plausible to use a classical guitar fretboard for a bass guitar? I'm not sure if the spacing of the frets would be correct.

Thoughts and feedback are welcomed.

If you are going to move the bridge for higher string tension then no, you will need a new fretboard. If you are leaving it then yes.

Grant Bass · #3 12-05-2010, 10:31 AM

if your gona want it to perform as acoustic and electric, get a piezo or some sort of soundhole pickup; cuz youll want acoustic strings on it, that a magnetic pickup wont read, i beleive

AltGrendel · #4 12-05-2010, 10:35 AM

I realize that this has nothing to do with your question.

You're also going to have to figure out the bracing for the increased string tension. The top will bow up if you aren't careful.

gnarlyopossum · #5 12-06-2010, 07:36 AM

Thanks for the feedback, friends! I'll be making the neck, too, then, to accommodate for increased string tension. Plus, then I could use a light colored fretboard to contrast the dark top. I'm assuming they were going for a mahogany look on the back, but it's really just a bad laminate job. I'll probably end up painting it before this project is through.

I think I'll probably go with a K&K bass piezo pickup. I saw some on eBay for around $60 or so, so that seems like a good, safe, relatively inexpensive option. Plus, that's fewer electronics that I can mess up. Any other good brands for a bass piezo or acoustic pickup?

As far as the bracing is concerned, I was wondering if using a tailpiece that goes all the way to the back would decrease the amount of tension on the top. I'm really not planning on having all the much stuff on the top. Probably just the bridge. Would it be smart of me to add a few blocks in the body to support the top?

As far as strings go, I really like the flatwounds I have on my jazz bass. Is there such a thing as flatwound acoustic strings?

Thanks, everybody!

Beej · #6 12-06-2010, 10:22 AM

There are a few good threads around here covering this type of conversion.

Classicals typically aren't great for this kind of conversion, mostly due to the bracing and lack of adjustability in the neck, but with all the changes you're introducing those will probably be moot. Its definitely advisable to use a floating bridge and tailpiece on this kind of setup. I would not recommend blocks or anything else to support the bridge, instead, redesign your bracing to support it if necessary. I think the tailpiece setup should reduce the string tension on the soundboard enough to keep you safe. If you block under the bridge, you'll deaden the sound it projects.

I'd also recommend against using flatwounds because they'll have a lot more tension than comparable roundwounds. Alt Grendel is getting at something there. Its actually a misconception that moving to four bass strings from six steel strings that tension will be increased. Four light guage steel bass strings are comparable to six steel guitar strings in tension. The difference here where Alt Grendel is correct is that classicals don't have as much bracing and are made of lighter, softer materials because classical strings are much less tension than steel guitar strings, so transferring this to four bass strings does result in quite a bit of increased tension.

This increased tension can really raise the likelikhood of a bowed top if the strings are terminated at the bridge. However, running them over floating bridge and terminating them at a tailpiece that's bolted to the tailblock will place most of their tension at the tailpiece and transfer much less over the bridge.

Check out the other threads on this for relevant discussion and ideas. That said, you've bitten off more in this project than others have chewed previously...

gnarlyopossum · #7 12-06-2010, 09:26 PM

Beej, thanks for the insight. I've never done a build like this before, so I've got the mindset of a first-timer on this. With what you're telling me, would it just make more sense to convert my build to a semi-hollow with a neckthrough? I could use the top and sides as wings and do a string-through design. Wouldn't that remove all stress from the top?

I really appreciate the help, guys.

Peace,
Bryan

gnarlyopossum · #8 12-12-2010, 09:07 AM

I've done some rethinking and I've decided to make Norma into a semihollow instead of an acoustic build. I've wanted to try my hand at making a neckthrough and now I've got a chance. I've had some time, yesterday, but no tools or wood, so I sat down and made a bunch of templates for just about everything I could think of. I made a mock up with the templates, which includes f-holes, pickup location (I've decided on going with a MM-style pickup), the cutaway, bridge and tailpiece placement, and knob placement.

Here's a quick glance at the mockup. Sorry about the bad resolution. I'm actually use a real camera on this picture, but the room is either too bright or not bright enough.

I also made a template for the headstock. It's a nod in the direction of Norma's former life as a classical guitar. I looked at Wishbass several times to see what he's done, because I liked his design, and then tried to emulate the classical guitar vibe a little more. I'll probably make one from something stronger than paper for the cutting, but I think this gives a pretty good idea.

I've talked to a friend of mine about getting wood for the back, neck, and fretboard. I've got to get the pieces for my tailpiece. I think I'll end up going to my wife's grandparents house for a weekend of woodworking, as her grandpa has tools and space galore.

Omnipharious · #9 12-12-2010, 10:16 AM

Wow. Just wow. That is going to look amazing.

I'm really glad to see people like you and Samantha bringing back awesome, custom acoustic basses.

gnarlyopossum · #10 12-13-2010, 03:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Omnipharious

Wow. Just wow. That is going to look amazing.

I'm really glad to see people like you and Samantha bringing back awesome, custom acoustic basses.

First-off: don't compliment me yet. I haven't done anything yet. Don't let me get a big head until I finish it and it sounds/looks good.

Secondly: I also took some ideas from a great build by Lon. Check it out by searching for "Lon" and "competition". I think you'll really like it. Check out the control cavity in that build!

Omnipharious · #11 12-13-2010, 04:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gnarlyopossum

First-off: don't compliment me yet. I haven't done anything yet. Don't let me get a big head until I finish it and it sounds/looks good.

Secondly: I also took some ideas from a great build by Lon. Check it out by searching for "Lon" and "competition". I think you'll really like it. Check out the control cavity in that build!

I can compliment anyone in any way I want, mister, and I can tell that this build is going somewhere awesome.

And I checked out Lon's build, and I see the inspiration there, but I wish I could hear how Lon's sounded.

gnarlyopossum · #12 12-17-2010, 01:28 PM

I know it's slow going on this build, but I've been trying to find stuff for cheap (or free, if possible), so I have to be patient. I do have some updates, however.

A friend of a friend owns a hardwood flooring and countertop business. I went to this friend of a friend and they gave me a 7' piece of white oak flooring. I plan on using this as much as possible. I definitely want to use it for the fretboard. I also thought about using it for the back but, alas, I do not have quite enough. I may end up going back there for another piece if they'll let me. Here's a picture. I tried to catch the wood grain on the camera. It's a pretty piece of wood, methinks.

Anybody know if white oak is a good wood for a fretboard?

I have also done some looking at bass bridges that pair with tailpieces and realized they all have slots for the strings. I would like to use the original bridge, just because I think it will look pretty cool and I already have it. I put the pieces from the old Fender bridge that I took apart to make the tailpiece.

Will this help keep the string from flopping around and potentially coming off the bridge? Or do I need to do some cutting to the plastic part?

gnarlyopossum · #13 04-10-2011, 08:36 AM

A long wait since last I wrote. I had to take a break for various reasons: time, resources, and space being three of them. Recently moved as well, so that's fun...

Anyway, I had to rethink my original configuration. I get a little too optimistic sometimes and, after taking a look at my tools, budget, and skills with tools, I decided that I'll need to build in a more "electric" looking fashion. No cutaway, no tailpiece, and no hand-built neck.

Instead I'm going to use pieces from a parts bass I built in high school. It's a Silvertone precision-style neck, EMG Special P pickups, and a nice bridge I ordered from Carvin. I really like that bass, but it's taken a back seat to my fretless jazz (and I loaned it to a friend who's had it for quite some time). It's not ideal, but at this point I just want to have it done. I've got G.A.S. and I want a new bass, pronto.

So, I fashioned a center block from 2 2x4s. One is pine, but the other one I'm not sure. I guess it might be pine, but it's much heavier, harder, and the dimensions are different 3.75" by 1.75" versus 3.5" by 1.5". I wanted to keep the braces in the guitar, because I figure that by not messing with them, it's one less thing I can screw up.

You're looking at the block (from left to right) as bridge, jazz pup, p pup, and neck. I left the end blocks in the body, so there will be more than 3 inches to mount the neck.

(Sorry about the cell phone pictures)

I took a hand saw and chisel to remove the neck, leaving a beautiful body.

The neck block fits nicely.

When I go to my parent's house next weekend, I'll get that bass from my friend and an old jigsaw. I need to cut the neck pocket, holes for the pups, the back of the bass, and a hole for electronics. Also need to cut down the body a bit so the back sits flush with the center block and the sides of the body.

Again, sorry for the bad pictures and shotty craftsmanship. By the way, I still have only spent $1 on materials. I bought a handsaw, chisel, and wood glue for $15. Not bad, I guess.