Oak?

[RRuud]

Hello everybody,

I was wondering if oak is suitable for making a body..
Because I got 2 fairly large pieces of oak for free, and I'm looking for a suitable wood to build my first bassbody.

Thanks in advance

[bassteban]

2 things to consider:
1. Oak is readily available, cheap & fairly hard.
2. It's very rarely used in guitars & basses.
There must be a reason for this...

[wilser]

There are a couple of basses that Fodera built necks for out of oak. Looked pretty plain, but I guess the effect is similar to that of ash in both sound and feel.

[Rodent]

early in my playing days I have a Peavey with an Oak body and bolt-on neck. all I can remember of about that bass it that it was H-E-A-V-Y

If you plan to utilize a figured top, you could always lighten things up a bit by adding a few chambers under the top

all the best,

R

[Dusty G]

I've heard oak isn't considered a tonewood because it doesn't absorb and leave the right frequencies to yield a good tone....or something.

[tplyons]

It's heavy. That's all I'm gonna say.

[andvari7]

Originally Posted by Dusty G

I've heard oak isn't considered a tonewood because it doesn't absorb and leave the right frequencies to yield a good tone....or something.

And I suppose Brian May just uses magic to get that tone out of the Red Special?

[Jumbotron]

I had a friend who made a 5-string body out of oak. Heaviest bass I ever picked up.

[Suburban]

Originally Posted by andvari7

And I suppose Brian May just uses magic to get that tone out of the Red Special?

He must have...

Oak is a very good wood for necks and fretboards. A fret free board might need some hard finish.

As a body wood, it is rare. I know of a few tries, whereof the May Red Special is the top note.
It is very similar to ash in most properties, but seems to have a rather different tone. More as if you'd mix ash and mahogany, or something. And other sources claim that it has a tinny, if not "tinky" sound. I guess it could be more sensitive to the properties of the plank than some other species?
But it is heavy, similar to hard ash or sugar maple, remember that when you do the design.

[Giel]

Oak makes any guitar or bass sound dead..
specially when you will play through a good amp, you will hear this.. At least that's what my luthier always says..

[DavidRavenMoon]

Wood is wood. Oak sounds fine, it's just very heavy and hard, but no more so than something like wenge or even heavy ash or maple.

Here's a LP Junior built by my friend John Gagliano, with a curly oak top on a white limba (korina) body. It has a poplar neck with EI rosewood FB.

This guitar sings! Has a very vocal tone.

[Geoff St. Germaine]

I have this coming:



Flamed Red Oak.

[Dusty G]

Originally Posted by andvari7

And I suppose Brian May just uses magic to get that tone out of the Red Special?

The tone of an electric guitar w/ overdrive has extremely little to do with the fretboard wood. Especially in that case, where the neck wood is so dense. Basically, you're not hearing oak when you listen to Queen.

[wilser]

Originally Posted by Dusty G

The tone of an electric guitar w/ overdrive has extremely little to do with the fretboard wood. Especially in that case, where the neck wood is so dense. Basically, you're not hearing oak when you listen to Queen.

so you're saying if it's oak you can't hear it, but if it's maple or rosewood you can? I don't understand.

[Wreck]

black oak that was dig up but was buried for 10years and more have similar density as an ebony and it is much better for fretboards than any other woods, of course axcept ebony

[DavidRavenMoon]

Originally Posted by wilser

so you're saying if it's oak you can't hear it, but if it's maple or rosewood you can? I don't understand.

You can absolutely hear the tone of neck wood. A mahogany neck guitar will sound different from a maple neck, and that's on clean and over drive settings. A hard maple neck with an ebony board sounds much different from a maple board, and both sound different from rosewood. And maple is hard stuff. From my experience I feel every part of a solid body instrument affects the tone (and that includes the shape of the body!). The harder and denser the woods, the less coloration they provide, and the more of the string's tone gets through. When you have softer lighter woods, they absorb some of the vibrations and color the tone by giving a warmer tone. There's less vibrations being reflected back to the string.

Now take bass necks. The stiffer the better. I like to use carbon/graphite rods in my necks. These not only help stiffen the neck, but they raise the resonant frequency up, so you get a very even response with no dead notes.

Also you can use softer woods with graphite reinforcement for a warmer tone, and still get good sustain and even response from having a stiff neck. I have a korina neck though fretless, and it has a great warm growl. I know from my other basses, that if this bass had a maple neck it would sound much different.

Now going back to the photo I posted. This guitar is made exactly like a Gibson, except for the choices of wood. The soft polar neck with indian rosewood FB gives a great full tone. The body is korina, which sounds about the same as mahogany. The oak top really brought out a nice midrange vocal tone in the guitar. It sounds much different from another guitar made by the same guy, but with different wood.

If body wood selection makes a difference, you better believe neck woods do too! Maybe more so.

[Giel]

Originally Posted by DavidRavenMoon

You can absolutely hear the tone of neck wood. A mahogany neck guitar will sound different from a maple neck, and that's on clean and over drive settings. A hard maple neck with an ebony board sounds much different from a maple board, and both sound different from rosewood. And maple is hard stuff. From my experience I feel every part of a solid body instrument affects the tone (and that includes the shape of the body!). The harder and denser the woods, the less coloration they provide, and the more of the string's tone gets through. When you have softer lighter woods, they absorb some of the vibrations and color the tone by giving a warmer tone. There's less vibrations being reflected back to the string.

Now take bass necks. The stiffer the better. I like to use carbon/graphite rods in my necks. These not only help stiffen the neck, but they raise the resonant frequency up, so you get a very even response with no dead notes.

Also you can use softer woods with graphite reinforcement for a warmer tone, and still get good sustain and even response from having a stiff neck. I have a korina neck though fretless, and it has a great warm growl. I know from my other basses, that if this bass had a maple neck it would sound much different.

Now going back to the photo I posted. This guitar is made exactly like a Gibson, except for the choices of wood. The soft polar neck with indian rosewood FB gives a great full tone. The body is korina, which sounds about the same as mahogany. The oak top really brought out a nice midrange vocal tone in the guitar. It sounds much different from another guitar made by the same guy, but with different wood.

If body wood selection makes a difference, you better believe neck woods do too! Maybe more so.

Carbon/graphite rods in neck will not give you a better tone..
Using a nice old piece of wood will, because there isn't so much tension in the wood you won't need to use graphite rods, and becuase of this, there is more wood in the neck..
More wood = more tone..
Ever heard a 1 piece wengé neck?

[NamelessOne]

more wood = more tone?

I've heard of aluminium bodied guitars, and we've all heard of graphite necks... I don't think wood necessarily equals tone. graphite rods will make a neck more stable, and possibly even out dead spots. wood can do the same thing. it's a different means to a similar end.

[DavidRavenMoon]

Originally Posted by Giel

Carbon/graphite rods in neck will not give you a better tone..
Using a nice old piece of wood will, because there isn't so much tension in the wood you won't need to use graphite rods, and becuase of this, there is more wood in the neck..
More wood = more tone..
Ever heard a 1 piece wengé neck?

Why would wood have tension? It doesn't. No wood (unless it's reaction wood*, and you don't use that for necks) has tension in it until you make a neck out of it and subject it to a lot of tension from the strings and truss rod! Any neck, regardless to what it's made out of, will sound better if it doesn't flex, and carbon/graphite rods are a good way to do this. You can use other material, but C/G has a great stiffness to weight ratio. Having a heavy neck is not such a good thing.

Old wood is seasoned, which means it will stop moving on you, but that has nothing to do with tension, and is more about its moisture content reaching equilibrium. It's as dry as it's going to get.

More wood=more tone? Based on what? It sounds good to say something like that, but what are you basing that on? And by more wood, do you mean a thicker neck? A thin neck has less wood, and still sounds fine. As far as it meaning less wood and more of something that's not wood, such as composite materials like carbon/graphite, that's just nonsense. I use phenolic fingerboards, and they sound just as good, if not better, than wood fingerboards, but they are more stable and durable. You can use them with a fretless with round wounds and don't need a protective finish. They have a very even tone... no dead spots.

Then look at an instrument like a Steinberger bass (the original ones), or even just graphite necks. They sound great. No lack of tone at all. Aluminum can sound very much like wood. It's all about the refractory qualities and modulus of elasticity. Wood is great stuff to work with, but it's not magic.

Wenge? Yeah... personally I can't stand the stuff. It's ugly wood, and it's too heavy to use as a neck in my opinion. No one just discovered that wood... it's been known in instrument circles for decades. You can find it on old Alembics. Notice no one used it for necks until Warwick? Not the best wood for a neck if you ask me. To heavy and hard. You want tone? Use a soft wood like poplar or mahogany, and stiffen it with C/G rods. Even Douglas Fur or basswood would sound better than wenge. Notice you don't see people making necks from ebony too often either.

My limba necked bass with C/G gets more tone than a heavy wenge neck.

Also you can make a more stable neck using laminates. This whole one piece necks sounding better thing is a myth. Make a bunch of necks and see what you get. Luthiers started laminating necks for a reason. Laminated necks are stiffer in general, and you can vary the grain direction to help with stability. You also get a chance to mix wood types to help raise the neck's resonant frequency.

That's my 2 cents based on building guitars for the past 35 years.

*Reaction wood is formed in response to mechanical stress, and helps to position newly formed parts of the plant in an optimal position. Reaction wood forms when a woody plant part is subjected to mechanical stress. This stress may be the result of wind exposure, excess of snow, soil movement, etc. There are two different types of reaction wood, which represent two different approaches to the same problem by these groups of plants:

In angiosperms reaction wood is called tension wood. Tension wood forms above the affected part of the plant, pulling it up. It is composed almost entirely of cellulose.

In conifers it is called compression wood. Compression wood forms below the bent part, pushing it up. Compression wood is rich in lignin.
As a rule, reaction wood is undesirable in any commercial application, primarily as its mechanical properties are different, also it responds differently to changes in moisture.

[DavidRavenMoon]

Originally Posted by NamelessOne

more wood = more tone?

I've heard of aluminium bodied guitars, and we've all heard of graphite necks... I don't think wood necessarily equals tone. graphite rods will make a neck more stable, and possibly even out dead spots. wood can do the same thing. it's a different means to a similar end.

Exactly... You said the same thing I did in a lot less words!