Odd Bass Build - The Hard Way

[SurferJoe46]

Well - I bought some bass parts from Guitar Fetish to see what they offer. I was thinking about the bass kit for a Precision, but they even recommend that one replaces the pots, wiring and the hardware with something more - er, substantial.

So I picked and chose some parts that I thought would be an upgrade and not buy a full kit.

I went for the vintage bridge and tuners and I had some 250 Ohm real Fender pots. I ordered the tort PG and the older-style Fender replica headstock - maple/maple.

The body is supposed to be some wood from the Far East, and it supposed to be very light.

Screws and some of their Vintage p'ups and a few other odds and ends and it arrived 5 working days after it was ordered.

They were shy a few parts in their warehouse - like the neck plate and the string tree - but I figured I can get them locally anyway.

Oh - I decided to go gold for the hardware - if that's OK with everyone.

Opened the box and found that the tuners were all in the same plastic bag and found they were all scuffed up from making the journey rubbing on each other- BAD MOVE, GUITAR FETISH!

The body had a couple of bumps on it - but they were passable if you realize they are on the back - ANOTHER BAD MOVE --- GUiTAR FETISH!



The neck was very nice - straight and nice maple figuring and very hard! I tested the truss screw and it was nice and free and would adjust I felt.

The wood of the body needs some talking about here - it's soft. It's also very light - but it's very soft!

My first move was to coat it with a home-brew sanding sealer. I mixed up some talcum and some butyl-nitrate aviation dope and put three coats on it. It dries clear and really sands smooth and super fills the pores on this very open grain wood.

This concoction also helps the sandpaper last a long time.



Let me stop here and tell what's going on though first.

I am going to build this bass just as it arrived to see how good or bad it is. Then I'll take it all apart again and see what I do to rectify any shortcomings in it.

Further installments to this mini article will reveal any situations I run into and what I need to do to get it into good shape.

[Thumpin_P]

Cool idea! I know not to shop from guitarfetish, though. Looking forward to phase 1 and phase 2 completed!

Thumpin_P

[HaMMerHeD]

Yeah, cultivated paulownia is very soft. And I can't say I care for their "routing" at all. Their parts and necks are pretty decent for the price, but their bodies are pretty sloppy.

[SurferJoe46]

In the test-fitting stage, I can see that the PG won't cover the routing very easily. The trench is HUGE!

OK - another point - the neck pocket is also too wide, although the other dimensions are good. I swear this body is made of balsa.

I decided to clear coat the neck except for the fretboard as I will be adding a custom head decal which will stay if I can get this to even look decent in the end. If I knock on the neck with a knuckle - it has a very nice 'tight' sound which I assume is gonna be OK.

I do NOT recommend sanding the body without a sanding block as it's too easy to cut into the softer veins of the wood and create furrows. This is making it hard to keep the round edges good looking, but I shall persevere.

More about the PG - half of the hold down screws are into voids in the route so I will have to add some extra material to those areas to get something for the screws to hold other than good wishes. This isn't gonna be pretty I think with wooden tabbed addons inside - but hidden - under the PG. Yuck.

BTW: super glue doesn't like this wood - it never fires off like it normally would on something with more real wood in it.

Decision time: keep going on this body or not? I decide to take a full-n00b approach and made believe I know no better and will blindly press onward.

Sanding until my arms fall off is next - I cannot trust a powered sander to not hack the body to pieces or just cut it too fast and it'll get away from me. At least if I hand-sand it, I can feel it going into ruination all by my own self.

Although the neck has a head-positioned truss adjustment, the PG is notched for a real Fender-type antique lower adjuster. Hmmmm. Just gonna live with that for now.

[ThatBassistDude]

So did the neck fit?

[ctmullins]

If your goal is to build an instrument that you'll enjoy playing after its completion, then I believe you should send the body back and make one yourself.

If, however, you're viewing this as an experimental "trial run", then by all means press on!

Personally, I can't believe they're charging money for a body that's that sloppy...

[HaMMerHeD]

Originally Posted by ctmullins

Personally, I can't believe they're charging money for a body that's that sloppy...

To be fair, it costs about 1/3 the cost of a proper P body.

[SurferJoe46]

Next update:

The pocket is OK - depth-wise, but like I said it's too wide and this'll play havoc with getting the neck set square to the p'ups and the bridge later on.

I found out something I never noticed before though: the dots on the fretboard will give you a pretty good center line to point to the screw on the PG right behind the p'ups.



Since the p'ups are prolly the last thing to go in after the PG is set in place, I can use that one central screw location to get the neck on at the right angle - or NO angle, really.





Then - continuing that line, I can also find the center screw for the bridge too as it is a 5-hole hold down.

At this point I planned where the 17-inches from the 12th fret to the center of the bridge will go - allowing for 50% intonation both ways for the adjusters - and I made a small grease pencil mark on the body.

Last night I got antsy and drilled the angled hole to ground the bridge - but I didn't want to go out to the shed to get my long drills, so I was just going to make a smaller, shorter hole with my Dremel at what I plotted to be the correct angle to drill it today.

Well - I pre-drilled the starter hole and I wanted to look at the angle I had by sticking a long 't-handled' allen wrench into it and I just got carried away and forced it to go the rest of the way, using it like a drill without any teeth or cutting edges --- it worked.

The wood's so soft that I only had one tough spot to push it through - but it came out right where I had planned it to.

PS: Don't tell a real luthier that I did this Fred Flintstone trick - but it worked for this soft wood easy enough.

Here now I have to show another flaw in the original shaping of the neck - it isn't the right shape at the pocketed end and actually has a slight angle below the last fret that (now) is very obvious.



I know I can fix this with a little belt sanding to the end of the neck - but now I'll leave it alone for reference and it'll make better 'before-and-after' pixs.

The pocket though has to be dealt with pretty soon and that might take another good idea.

I don't want excessive pressure on the neck plate with the screws pulling it through and crushing this soft body, not hard enough to quite hold the neck in place.

I need an epiphany right about now.

Confession time: I stayed up pretty late last night doing some tinkering and got a lot further completed on this than I wanted to.

I was using some 1500 paper on the finish and when it was done, I just waxed the holy snot outta it and it looks pretty good!

This very non-professional finish will be de-waxed later for a full poly-coated finish - but I am assuming a n00b won't have access to paint and an HVLP gun - so this is where the finish is, er - finished right now.

PS MODS ::: I am not getting E-mail notifications and I know my settings have not changed and are still correct.

[grisezd]

So, despite the crappy body and neck on this deal, I propose a new build challenge for the less-fortunate (shop-wise). How about a kit build-off? Maybe we could come up with a max retail price for the kit to allow us to pick from the various styles and brands up to that price. For fun, if it came in the kit it goes on the bass, the only exception is DIY replacement parts (no off-the-shelf bass parts), finish, and strings. Points for playability, appearance, and most clever work around for crap parts.

Interesting?

[SurferJoe46]

Well - I for one would NOT recommend a kit - at least from Guitar Fetish.

The odds of getting a body that you'd like are pretty slim if they are going to sell something akin to balsa wood.

The neck I can also understand if they don't have the right tools or talented-enough people to cut the bottom of the neck square below the last fret - accidents MAY have happened here but what are the odds of that?

I mean - if these are good accidents or even mediocre ones, then what about the poor guy who gets a real bad body and neck?

Now let me say here why I might hedge that warning a little bit - the hardware is pretty nice - not boutique - but nice.

If something in the metal finish or coating is gonna SHOW messed up or coated or painted or dipped badly - then a gold finish should show any problems in spades.

As it is (for the time being) I don't see any blemishes on the gold color (whatever the 'gold color' is, I don't know). This could all change tomorrow morning - so don't jump to a conclusion yet.

UPDATE:

I just couldn't wait for the string tree to arrive (ordered) and I still don't have the p'up screws since they were 'short' in the package from GF.

So-o-o-o .............. I went and put strings on it to see just what I have here for tone and sound quality ----------- and I am pleasantly surprised!

Those GF p'ups are nice - even if they aren't mounted to the body yet. --- a nice mellow growl with some Fender 7250 NPS MiI strings on it - rounds, not flats mind you - and they are really sounding nice on this bass.

Now - I am NOT one to believe in the wood fairy - but this very light body has a nice sonic 'feel' to it.

Even though I don't think it has proven anything to counter my opinion that the wood is just a place to hang a bridge and screw on a neck and controls - there is 'something' here that has a nice aural quality to it.

I believe that I found the classic dead spot on the 5th-6th fret, D string - so something went right if I can accomplish what real bass manufacturers do! Right?

Head dive is somewhat obvious though as the body is so much lighter, that the head by comparison is mucho heavier.

Of course it is - - but the balance and weight difference is super obvious with a slick nylon strap. A fuzzy, clingy strap would not be so obvious - but I'm trying to find fault here, not laud something that doesn't deserve it.

For the next day or so I'll let this neck settle down since this is the first time strings have ever been on it - but the height is pretty darned close to optimal (an accident, I swear!) and I still have intonation and a few other adjustments to make - but there are NO buzzes or rattles.

Hooray for that!

In the next 24 hours - after it holds some tension for a while - I'll recheck everything and make a report of my findings.

As of yet, the truss rod has not been touched other than testing to see if the nut turned - but that was a few days ago and I've not touched it or adjusted it since/yet.

Here's a semi-bottom line so far:::

If one wants to buy a cheap bass - this is not the way.

It actually costs more to build this when all the parts and strings are counted in - and you can buy a really nice Squier VM - (thinking of the new Hummer version), a lot cheaper.

At this point I have about $250.00 in it and that's not counting labor - which in this case was one I was willing to spend for my personal interest and to see if I could follow non-existent instructions by using just intelligence and instinct to put this together.

"At the end of the day my neck hurts from holding up this giant brain" - (Jethro Bodine)

There are NO instructions. Say that three times.

As an afterthought - the parts list includes (but is not limited to) the following:::

A Body
A Neck
A Bridge
Two Pots
A pair of Knobs
One set of Pickups
One Pickguard
Four Tuners
A bag full of Assembly Screws
An Output jack
One pint of Wood sealer/primer
Sandpaper - Lots of sandpaper
A few squirts of Buffing compound and a buffer
Some Urethane clear coat (not applied yet) OR: paint if you want a color other than wood grain

What I really recommend for tools as a minimum:

Power Dual-Action (DA) sander
Dremel tool with an assortment of bits/tools
Drill bits
Power drill
Elmer's Yellow Woodworking glue
Super Glue - thin and jell + kicker - this wood fights it going off!
Accurate flat edged tool for setting neck straight
GOOD Phillips and JIS screwdriver(s)
Hand file(s) for fret dressing/rounding the fret edges
Patience

Story and pictures at 9.

[Hopkins]

How was the fret work on the neck? I bought a neck from them from a project I'm working on, the frets were in terrible shape. I figured I would save some money over buying a mighty might neck but I wound up spending the savings on a fret leveling. Other than that it isn't to bad, I'm probably going to change the plastic nut out for a bone one.

[SurferJoe46]

Originally Posted by Hopkins

How was the fret work on the neck? I bought a neck from them from a project I'm working on, the frets were in terrible shape. I figured I would save some money over buying a mighty might neck but I wound up spending the savings on a fret leveling. Other than that it isn't to bad, I'm probably going to change the plastic nut out for a bone one.

The frets had a little roughness on the ends, but no appreciable overhang. They had some sharp spots though.

Level-wise they are nice and even and have no apparent problems unless they fall out or something weird like that.

I took a 10-inch file though and ran it down the sides, taking a little off the edge of the fretboard too and it feels pretty nice now. I heartily recommend that treatment. .

I think these fret wires are just a tiny bit taller than the 'medium-jumbo-types' on my VM or my Deluxe Jazz - so they aren't strange feeling to me at all.

The neck definitely has a thicker profile, and it is a 10" radius. Since I can readily switch from a Jazz to a Precision to a super-slinky SR500 and playing any of them with no real loss of control (I think so any way) - this isn't bad either for playability.

In twenty seconds, it feels normal and like I've been playing it all my life.

What I miss is the massiveness of a bass - this body is just so freaking light! It's kinda unnerving to hold something this light weight. I'm used to 8lb+ basses and I seriously doubt this is over 6.5 lbs.

The next consideration is that I put a fairly hard thin candy shell on a soft chewy center for a body and I feel this might make some very interesting dents in the future where a denser wood might just destroy anything but itself.

[Musiclogic]

Just out of curiosity, if you wanted a cheap P bass that the parts all fit on and would play decent and sound pretty good too, why didn't you just buy one of the $120 SAGA kits off Ebay. I have set up a couple for kids, and they are pretty decent, and can be made to play very nicely.

[A-Step-Towards]

Originally Posted by HaMMerHeD

To be fair, it costs about 1/3 the cost of a proper P body.

Well one could pick up a squier affinity P bass for 50-80$ used easy, that would supply a body way better and once you sell off the extra parts its probably will have cost you nothing.


Great review!

I have yet to see an in detail review of one of these. Its cool to see someone build one up and it looks pretty good.

As you said its not worthwhile if your looking for a cheap bass, because at the price a VM could be had new, but its the experience you learned that make it cool.


Looking forward to final pics

[SurferJoe46]

Originally Posted by Musiclogic

Just out of curiosity, if you wanted a cheap P bass that the parts all fit on and would play decent and sound pretty good too, why didn't you just buy one of the $120 SAGA kits off Ebay. I have set up a couple for kids, and they are pretty decent, and can be made to play very nicely.

Your logic is of course where the wheels fall off the whole idea.

But - and this is the prime motivator here - the idea was to try to build this as 1) either an experiment in terror or 2) to give an insight to what it might be like for someone who wants to just build something musical - in this case a bass guitar for themselves.

My honest-hearted intention was to show the possible pratfalls and potential failures of someone who might look at a 'kit' and try to come up with something that they would be proud to play or even just give them a sense of accomplishment in creating something that they could actually use for more than say: a wall hanging.

I sincerely do not recommend building this for the reason of trying to create a great yet low-priced bass guitar. It ain't gonna happen with this 'kit' at all.

The one thing I think I can pass on is that although the body leaves yards of desires unfulfilled, it can be brought into the area of something decent if all the supporting hardware is of better quality - which in this case, that's the fact.

Looks-wise, the body has a certain artsy charm and the grain is indeed bold and strikingly pretty in it's own offbeat way.

Please to remember that I have only used a sanding sealer of my own creation - but the grain indeed 'pops' and shows nicely. The final coat is just carnauba wax that gives a nice patina and is quite decent in and of itself.

The hardware is decent enough by somewhat mollified qualifiers and the neck (although having a problem in the lower shape) is straight, has decent fretting and is nicely grain detailed.

I feel it's only correct that the fret wires needed a little massage to get them to a nice shape on the ends, and that's totally within the realm of what someone with even very limited abilities has to understand. The neck will need some 'work' to make it right.

I however, consider this a normal situation and one that should not be a negative in the neck itself. It's kinda like: tuning your own strings - but that's another subject.

Please remember that my idea was to do this first as any person might who would want to build a bass with little-to-no previous bass building experience.

I tried to dumb down for the whole first build, and as it turned out, it is playable with certain restrictions.

To anyone considering this as a good way to build their own bass: the company that markets this product also states that a person should do some research into finishes and building techniques before attempting such a build and they say so in their own words.

What may sound like corporate weasel-words and building a fudge zone is indeed true and what I wanted to do was try to see this from a neophyte's eyes - which I believe I've accomplished.

Unfortunately, Guitar Fetish has not responded to my e-mail (via their server), to tell me what they are going to do about the badly marred tuners, dents in the body and the missing screws.

Perhaps I got the RW parts version here - but I feel that's just a cheap shot by them to not at least tell me to go to the Theological Establishment Of Eternal Punishment, and this lack of communication by them certainly modifies my thoughts about their service after sales attitude.

OK - so this leaves me with a week or two of working with what I have accomplished so far, and I'll get some pixs up and show the semi-finished product.

I still need a gold string tree and some #2 x 1.25" gold wood screws - but I'd settle for non-gilded if necessary.

This will be PART-A of a two-part story with PART-B being the modifications to- and the final disposition- of the finished product after some wood magic gets done by me.

I hope I can find my magic wand.

I've decided that I won't change out the body for a better one at this time, although that may be in the final part of my desires to make this project something that I can say is a really more decent bass - but for now I'll stick with this very light - and I assume: very damageable - body.

Maybe I'll call this my 'M&M Bass' since the thin candy shell has a soft, chewy center.

Still I am disappointed by Guitar Fetish's non-acknowledgement of my shipping shortages and damages in transit of their parts.

[Hopkins]

Originally Posted by SurferJoe46

The frets had a little roughness on the ends, but no appreciable overhang. They had some sharp spots though.

Level-wise they are nice and even and have no apparent problems unless they fall out or something weird like that.

I took a 10-inch file thought and ran it down the sides, taking a little off the edge of the fretboard too and it feels pretty nice now. I heartily recommend that treatment. .

I think these fret wires are just a tiny bit taller than the 'medium-jumbo-types' on my VM or my Deluxe Jazz - so they aren't strange feeling to me at all.

The neck definitely has a thicker profile, and it is a 10" radius. Since I can readily switch from a Jazz to a Precision to a super-slinky SR500 and playing any of them with no real loss of control (I think so any way) - this isn't bad either for playability.

In twenty seconds, it feels normal and like I've been playing it all my life.

What I miss is the massiveness of a bass - this body is just so freaking light! It's kinda unnerving to hold something this light weight. I'm used to 8lb+ basses and I seriously doubt this is over 6.5 lbs.

The next consideration is that I put a fairly hard thin candy shell on a soft chewy center for a body and I feel this might make some very interesting dents in the future where a denser wood might just destroy anything but itself.

Either you got lucky, or I got a bad one. Mine was completely dead on the A and G strings past the 13th fret. I also had to clean up the fret ends but it wasn't that bad.

After the fret job I have no complaints it seems pretty solid now.

[SurferJoe46]

I'm not sure that QC is first place in importance with their manufacturer - so if I got a good er one or you got a badder one - it's prolly just a crapshoot anyway.

Nice though is that I could get some decent fret cleaning on it, as there was sufficient material to work with - imagine if a fret or two were short!


Twenty-four hours later and the neck hasn't moved a bit! That's nice and I haven't had to adjust the truss either - yet.

I got a very good intonation adjustment and the height of the strings is ongoing at the moment.

Again - these are all adjustments that ANYONE would or should be able to make to personalize their bass to their own standards and in no way reflects any shortcoming by the wood or the originating manufacturer.

The factory - or ANY factory for that matter - can only get close to a setting that might work for a few people - but their crystal ball won't tell them what the settings for the person who eventually buys their gear would like or want.

No whining about that is appropriate in any situation.

Still - I wonder what 'cultured wood' of any kind means?

My kingdom for four screws and a string tree though. <sigh>

[SurferJoe46]

UPDATE::: the 'A-Build' is done for all intents and reasons

Still - I have no string tree or p'up hold down screws - but I've been playing it for a couple of days and the sound has grown on me. There's a nice old guy-era growl to it that I really like.

I got some Indonesian red silk'd 7250 NPS strings on it (thank-you to: you know who you are!) - and they just work so well. Amazingly well, I think.

I'll noodle it a while to see if it has any musical shortcomings for a couple of weeks whilst I think about what I'll do for the final 'B-Build' after a while.

For sure the body will get a heavy refinish, although the waxed wood is very smooth and warm in the hand playing it.

I have a totally bogus headstock decal on it, (it's a secret right now) - and it needs some clear coat sanding to get the decal outline to blend in and disappear and not have telltale bumps around it's periphery - but that's very easy to do later on.

Remember this was originally to be an 'out-of-the-box' assembly without much technical expertise required by the builder - I assumed a neophyte for my imaginary intended builder's the first time attempt.

As it is, it is very playable and it can hold against some store bought gear - if one closes both eyes and the lights are out in a bear cave at midnight. The low weight gives it away - too light to be what it's supposed to be and looks like.

I digress.

In working on a gold theme here for the M&M Candy Bass (a hard candy shell covering a chewy nougat inside) - I have what might be a surprise even to me - for the final clear coat.

Time will tell if it's successful - I know I can pull it off - but I wonder about the eye appeal afterward: it might be a little gaudy with all the gold on it already. We'll see.

Needed for the 'B-Build':::

1) Address the badly shaped neck below the last fret by squaring it off more logically. It's crooked and I can fix that easily enough I think.
2) The neck pocket will need some wood magic and I might need Tink (see below) to help here - but shims are the ongoing idea, stained to match the body.
3) Gold p'up cover
4) Still need the gold string tree and screws for the p'ups.
5) Gold Dunlop Dual Strap Locks
6) A really righteous leather strap
7) MAYBE a new bone - in bone, of course.

Pssssst! Am I supposed to hot-glue the p'up covers to the coils? They are fall-off-able right now and they are loose.





.....and - here's TINK!!!!

[Musiclogic]

this is a cool and informative thread for the budget minded newbs, good job Joe.

[SurferJoe46]

Latest e-mail to Guitar Fetish. Let's see what they do about a few things:::

I sent a note to you a few days ago about the screws missing for the pickups in the GFS T03 pickups and have heard nothing from you about replacing them or telling me to go to blazes --- or anything.

Can I at least get a return e-mail telling me what the remedy for this situation might be and if any parts are coming from you in the say ---> near future?

BTW: the tuners were very scratched up and marred from being shipped in the same plastic bag - loose - so they could collide with each other for the whole trip to my door.

I have a fairly comprehensive posting on an international website about the parts and the quality of those parts I bought that you can read here::: Odd Bass Build - The Hard Way

Thanks for ANY considerations that might be forthcoming.

jpv