Should pro-gun / anti-gun / gun control threads be confined to the Lobby?

[Mark Latimour]

It seems that in OT, gun control and gun discussion threads are the new political / religious threads of choice. Seeing as the Lobby discussion is pretty limited now, perhaps its time to move these into the Lobby to keep things from getting too heated in OT.

[Mark Latimour]

Wow...no one has any thoughts on this. They always seem to end so well in OT

[NJL]

i agree and i'm not even a paying member anymore

[tZer]

Sure, why not?

[mike_v_s]

Originally Posted by Mark Latimour

It seems that in OT, gun control and gun discussion threads are the new political / religious threads of choice. Seeing as the Lobby discussion is pretty limited now, perhaps its time to move these into the Lobby to keep things from getting too heated in OT.

The demeanor of OT is like water. It will seek the lowest point allowable. That said, I'm gonna go start a thread about the best way to train children under 3 to fight eachother.

Mike

[Mark Latimour]

Bumpage + general "Do a search N00b" all roundage!

[J.D.B.]

Maybe they could just go here(where they belong):
http://www.thehighroad.org/index.php?
Best gun forum on the net !
Josh

[mike_v_s]

Please see OT today for a great example on how thread like this gets shut down. The thread title clearly states that it is for a TB gun club. You'd think that people who don't like guns would avoid a thread forming a club about something they don't like, right? Right? Not exactly. I never joined the "Genitals in Bear Traps" Club because, well, you get the idea.

Mike

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by mike_v_s

Please see OT today for a great example on how thread like this gets shut down. The thread title clearly states that it is for a TB gun club. You'd think that people who don't like guns would avoid a thread forming a club about something they don't like, right? Right? Not exactly. I never joined the "Genitals in Bear Traps" Club because, well, you get the idea.

Mike

Or they could form an anti-gun club. I wonder if that would fly without the reverse occuring?

[mike_v_s]

Originally Posted by Mark Latimour

Or they could form an anti-gun club. I wonder if that would fly without the reverse occuring?

As much as I think forming anti-anything clubs is stupid, I would like to think that they could form that club without any of the same BS happening.

Mike

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by mike_v_s

As much as I think forming anti-anything clubs is stupid, I would like to think that they could form that club without any of the same BS happening.

Mike

Ideally, yes, but I think its fairly obvious that there are just as many trolls on the pro-gun side as there are on the anti-gun side. People just can't help themsevles, whatever side of the argument they are on (or even if they are in the middle, for that matter). It wouldn't necessarily have to be an "anti" club per se, I would imagine it would be more like a "pro-gun control club". Like you say, as funny as it would be, an "anti-mike_v_s" club would be assinine.

[mike_v_s]

Originally Posted by Mark Latimour

Ideally, yes, but I think its fairly obvious that there are just as many trolls on the pro-gun side as there are on the anti-gun side. People just can't help themsevles, whatever side of the argument they are on (or even if they are in the middle, for that matter). It wouldn't necessarily have to be an "anti" club per se, I would imagine it would be more like a "pro-gun control club". Like you say, as funny as it would be, an "anti-mike_v_s" club would be assinine.

I agree. In both situations, I say give the offenders 1 warning and then reward their tenacity with a vacation. It just seems like there are a select few from both sides who start and continue the crap in these threads. Why should everyone else have to lose the privilege of conversation because a few are incapable of controlling their impulses?

For that matter, an actual debate could be had with out the mudslinging. It's been a few years, but my ethic class used to hit on all the hot topics: drug policy, gun control, abortion, etc, etc, etc. After several days of overview on competeing philosophies, we were allowed to tear into it. The caveat was that "trolling" (we didn't call it then) would get you thrown out of the class. Terms like "baby killer" and "pro-life whack job" would get you tossed.

Mike

edit: there already is an informal anti-mike_v_s club. I've encouraged them to close in ranks and hand out numbers, but it seems most of them have me on ignore.

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by Mark Latimour

Or they could form an anti-gun club. I wonder if that would fly without the reverse occuring?

...and we have our answer. I wonder if the anti-gravity club would fly, given JT's comments in the shutdown, it looks like the anti-gravity club wouldn't get off the ground on TB. Excuse the pun!

[john turner]

like i said in the thread in question, folks are welcome to start whatever "pro-" club they want. there's no official talkbass policy on so-called "official" clubs of any kind, as long as they, just like every other thread and post here, do not purposely single out folks to derride.

folks purposefully trying to press buttons and test limits are not going to be appreciated, or tolerated.

mutual respect is not that hard a concept to grasp, folks. part of that "mutual respect" thing is having the self-knowledge to know when participation in a conversation cannot occur without disrespecting the original poster or the other participants in the conversation. most webbrowsers have built in tools to handle such instances. like the "close window" and "back" buttons.

as for moving any conversations to the lobby only, i don't think that's a good idea. to be honest, i think OT has become overly restrictive right now, and am trying to figure out a way to loosen the grip a bit, with the help of the other admins.

ironically, it was another "suggestion box" thread from you mark that helped reinforce the opinion i was already considering that OT had become too oppressive.

[Mark Latimour]

Originally Posted by john turner

like i said in the thread in question, folks are welcome to start whatever "pro-" club they want. there's no official talkbass policy on so-called "official" clubs of any kind, as long as they, just like every other thread and post here, do not purposely single out folks to derride.

folks purposefully trying to press buttons and test limits are not going to be appreciated, or tolerated.

mutual respect is not that hard a concept to grasp, folks. part of that "mutual respect" thing is having the self-knowledge to know when participation in a conversation cannot occur without disrespecting the original poster or the other participants in the conversation. most webbrowsers have built in tools to handle such instances. like the "close window" and "back" buttons.

as for moving any conversations to the lobby only, i don't think that's a good idea. to be honest, i think OT has become overly restrictive right now, and am trying to figure out a way to loosen the grip a bit, with the help of the other admins.

ironically, it was another "suggestion box" thread from you mark that helped reinforce the opinion i was already considering that OT had become too oppressive.

What is the purpose / role of the Lobby in TB now? It seems to have lost all real relevance.

[David Wilson]

Originally Posted by Mark Latimour

What is the purpose / role of the Lobby in TB now? It seems to have lost all real relevance.

good question. We plan on shortly permitting, on a trial basis, Political discussion in the Lobby.

We say 'trial basis' because if it turns into Tin Pin Alley Part Deux, then we'll stop it again.

We have some administrative things on our side to get sorted out before we can do this, so no "why would you vote for XYZ?" threads yet please

[thefruitfarmer]

Originally Posted by john turner

like i said in the thread in question, folks are welcome to start whatever "pro-" club they want. there's no official talkbass policy on so-called "official" clubs of any kind, as long as they, just like every other thread and post here, do not purposely single out folks to derride.

John...

The problem is that the decision to allow gun ownership in a country is a political decision, all be it one made 200+ years ago.

I am of the opinion that if you ban political and religious threads that you should ban the weapon threads as well, especially if you want to go international.

It's all very well to say it's okay to have any pro threads you want and no anti threads but the problem with weapons is that it is such an emotive and culturally located issue that I cannot help but think you would serve the international bass playing community better if you just deleted those threads where people are salivating over their weapons.

It appears to me, that by allowing "weapon appreciation" threads that talkbass is sanctioning their ownership and ultimate use. This will limit the membership of this forum to those who approve of such things and exclude those who do not approve, especially when you supress their opinions.

In short my opinion is that you have to go all or nothing here. You either allow unmoderated discussion and let people get on with it (which may create legal problems) or you delete all the inflamatory threads, which does include "weapon appreciation" along with political and religious threads, gay marriage, abortion etc etc....

At the moment the forum moderation is "half cocked" (pun intended).....

[Pacman]

Originally Posted by thefruitfarmer

It appears to me, that by allowing "weapon appreciation" threads that talkbass is sanctioning their ownership and ultimate use. This will limit the membership of this forum to those who approve of such things and exclude those who do not approve, especially when you supress their opinions.

Wow - that's one heck of a leap of logic there. That on a bass related board, if you allow pro-gun threads but not anti-gun threads, you'll limit the membership to only pro-gun members. How'd you do that?

[thefruitfarmer]

Originally Posted by Pacman

Wow - that's one heck of a leap of logic there. That on a bass related board, if you allow pro-gun threads but not anti-gun threads, you'll limit the membership to only pro-gun members. How'd you do that?

Simple.....

By excluding anti-gun threads whilst allowing pro-gun threads (which includes "weapon appreciation") you are sending a message to those that do not agree with gun ownership that they are not welcome here.

[Pacman]

That's the message you get, but that's not the message. I don't think for a minute that it will affect the membership numbers, either.