Rush - Subdivisions

[Kevinmach]

I pulled the trigger on a Rush tab book a little too soon, and it didn't have all the songs I wanted for the covers we're doing.

The free Guitar Pro Tabs are pretty good, but when I learning challenging material, I typically don't like to learn it the wrong way, as I have only been playing about a year and half and some of this stuff and take me a while to be able to play it well.

The book I ended up with is pretty accurate, it just doesn't have that song. Another book I saw after I bought it has that song AND a ton more, and I do plan to buy it- but, in the meantime, I having trouble with the two fast, flamenco style riffs Geddy plays before the chorus (I think there are only two, anyway).

Those of you familiar with the song will instantly know what I am referring to. The Guitar Pro Tab I downloaded is fairly accurate for the most part, but I am not sure those riffs are correct (and it could well be that it doesn't sound that way because I am just not proficient in them yet).

Can someone help me with the notation on these riffs, either by posting it or referring to a site with notation that they personally find to be relatively close?

Just a heads up- I know there are tabs out there for this song, and I have found them- what I am looking for here is the opinion of someone who's actually seen it or played it and found it to be correct (in other words, something a little more official).

Thanks!

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

Originally Posted by Kevinmach

what I am looking for here is the opinion of someone who's actually seen it or played it and found it to be correct (in other words, something a little more official).

Well, according to that premise, maybe you won't find my opinion interesting since it is not that "official", but anyway I'm pretty confident about my hearing skills. I can tell you that my transcription of those fills in the studio recording of "Subdivisions" is at least 99% accurate. Of course, the tablature staff reflects the fingerboard positions on which I play those notes (not necessarily the ones chosen by Geddy).



And, as a bonus, the fills during the guitar solo (which are pretty cool, too):



Hope this helps.

[Kevinmach]

Thanks so much, it's very helpful.

I hope I didn't come off as being snobby, it's not that it has to be official, I was just trying to save the trouble of someone directing to the half a dozen tab sites I've already been to (even the official tabs are often not entirely accurate, as very few books show them exactly the same).

I was looking for exactly what you gave me- the tab itself, along with the opinion of someone who's personally verified it to be reasonably accurate.

On two of the tabs I previously downloaded for this song, it just didn't sound right. Then when I watched him play it on the Rush in Rio DVD, his had position was no where near in the same place as what the those tabs showed it. Actually, just by glancing it, what you've shown me hear looks to be a lot more in the ball park.

Of course, I am still interested in seeing other interpretations if anyone else is willing to share them. But I will definitely give this one a try-thanks Alvaro!

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

My pleasure!

Originally Posted by Kevinmach

Then when I watched him play it on the Rush in Rio DVD, his had position was no where near in the same place as what the those tabs showed it.

Take into account that Geddy doesn't play live exactly the same lines he recorded in the studio. Haven't seen the Rio DVD in a long time, but I wouldn't be surprised to see/hear him play completely different fills.

[Kevinmach]

Take into account that Geddy doesn't play live exactly the same lines he recorded in the studio. Haven't seen the Rio DVD in a long time, but I wouldn't be surprised to see/hear him play completely different fills.

Which I find really interesting, because as far back as I remember, the band hung it's hat on the premise that they wanted the music to sound exactly the same way on the album as when they played it live, with no substitutions or improvising and minimum of pre-recorder/triggered material.

In fact, I heard this so many times from their own mouths, I might not have even believed that comment, if I hadn't seen it with my own eyes. On the very DVD I mentioned before, there is an extended ending to Red Barchetta that is clearly not part of the song-which I rather like, but was surprised to see.

I guess when you've been playing some of the same songs for 30+ years, you've got to switch it up a little to maintain your sanity, so I can't blame them

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

Originally Posted by Kevinmach

as far back as I remember, the band hung it's hat on the premise that they wanted the music to sound exactly the same way on the album as when they played it live, with no substitutions or improvising and minimum of pre-recorder/triggered material.

On the other hand, here's what Geddy said in an interview:

Originally Posted by Guitar School Magazine, march 1994, P. 36.

GUITAR SCHOOL: One of the heaviest, most recognizable bass parts in the Rush catalogue is the line from "Limelight". Part of its uniqueness stems from the persistent "three against four" feel during the intro and verse sections.

GEDDY LEE: The intro figure is a bar of 4/4 and a bar of 3/4, alternately. This is how I play the line now [see Fig. 1]; it has evolved a little over the years. And I play the riff in the 3/4 bar a little differently each time.

The second two-bar phrase of the verse [see Fig. 2, bars 3 and 4] goes form a bar of 4/4 to a bar of 2/4, which is the same number of beats as two bars of 3/4. I use octaves all throughout this section, as I do in the chorus [see Fig. 3], starting in bar 5, and in bars 9 and 10. I play the chorus a little differently now, too.

Some of the changes I've made have been unintentional, and I've funked up the chorus part a bit. I don't even know how I originally played it! Most of those performances [on record] from 14 years ago were "one-offs", anyway. Even during this year's tour, I didn't play the song exactly as it is on the record. Fourteen years later, songs mutate into something else. People don't realize how much of a record is made up of fortunate accidents, or spontaneous composition, like "Oh, he went to that cymbal there, so I'm gonna go with him".It's never a case of sitting down and writing it in stone.

[Kevinmach]

Which makes sense- the interview I specifically remember then saying this in was with Geddy in Alex on Rockline with Red Beard, which was a fairly famous one considering Rush's aversion to doing a lot of public interviews and appearances. But that interview (I couldn't find it to link it, sorry) was a good 4 or 5 years prior to that which you just posted.

In a nutshell, Alex and Geddy basically went on to say that there is almost no live improvisation (and there still may not be, it's probably a "planned" alteration, knowing how technical those guys are)- and that when they went to concerts as audience members, they felt "cheated" when they didn't get to hear what they had been listening to for years or months, when the band originally recorded the album.

I actually had that experience before and can identify with it- where the band decided to drastically alter a tune in a live performance. I was typically fine with it when it was a song I wasn't in love with, but when it's one you are really into, it can be a bit disappointing.

I don't think many of us can imagine what it must be like to play the same song over and over, literally 1000s of times, for 30 years. It really must be mind numbing at times.

Thanks for that article!

[steve66]

I haven't posted in a while. Here is a great tab sight for Rush

http://www.cygnusproductions.com/rtp/bass/bass.asp

[Kevinmach]

Awesome man, thanks.

What program do I need to view this file? I don't recognize the file format.

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

Originally Posted by Kevinmach

What program do I need to view this file? I don't recognize the file format.

Any text editor (Notepad, Word...) can open it. It's a plain text file.

[Kevinmach]

Thanks. I am an Information Technology guy, I should have know to try that before posting.

You'll be happy to know, Alvaro, that the parts you posted look almost identical to what the transcriptions on the website show.

Nice work!

[BassikLee]

Also, keep in mind that Geddy's playing, technique wise, is VERY choppy and inefficient! Take the solo section of Tom Sawyer, just as an example. The part that doubles the GTR/Key line. You can play that part without ever moving your left hand. Geddy moves his for every two notes. As such, the tabs might be correct, and also "wrong" if you see him play the part live, even if he IS playing the record version

[factorplayer]

Hey Alvaro that is a nice transcription!

It is way better than a book of Rush tab I got way back ago, from the Bass Superstar Series, which just sucked. the fingering for those licks was all in the first position and the author even messed up the name of the song ("Subdivsion")

[Kevinmach]

Take the solo section of Tom Sawyer, just as an example.

See, we cover that song, and I always thought he played that part pretty smoothly when I listened to it. Granted, I am a pretty crappy bassist, but it took me a while to get anywhere near his sound when playing it (and it's probably still not that close).

It is way better than a book of Rush tab I got way back ago, from the Bass Superstar Series, which just sucked.

No doubt, there are some books out there with some really shameful transcriptions. I could forgive this if it was something just posted on the Internet for free, but seriously- if you're charging money for this stuff, it better been 99% accurate (maybe not exactly *how* Geddy plays it in terms of position, but at least in terms of the notes being played).

For some reason, it's always easier to hear bass lines when you have ear buds on. I've listened to some of those Rush songs countless times when I was jogging, and could easily tell notes were being missed or were incorrect. Now after countless "re-learning" what I eventually found to be wrong, I am really disappointed how inaccurate some of them are.

[BassikLee]

I didn't say he doesn't play the parts smoothly. I said he uses his hands less efficiently than they could be used. If you watch him play, he is all over the neck, for things that COULD be played in one position. Even he says that. There is some footage somewhere, maybe a BP mag video interview or something, where they ask him about doing an instructional video. He is response is something to the effect of "why would anyone want to play the way I do?" and he was not referring to note choice, but more his "poor" technique. I am not anti-Geddy, at all. He is my favorite player on the planet. The only guy I ever figured out, note for note, when I was learning to play. Hell, I even arranged to share the same middle name with him, YEARS before I even knew he existed!

Lee

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

Originally Posted by BassikLee

There is some footage somewhere, maybe a BP mag video interview or something, where they ask him about doing an instructional video. He is response is something to the effect of "why would anyone want to play the way I do?"

I also have that mag:

Originally Posted by Bass Guitar Magazine, July 2007, P. 40.

When it's suggested that he could put a special video track on the next concert DVD called "Close-up on the Fingers", he laughs. "People keep bugging me to do my own instructional video, and I don't know. I find it hard to imagine myself in that environment, showing somebody the ridiculous ways I've learned how to play the bass. If I do it, it'll be called "Don't Try This at Home."

Considering the level at which he plays, it's odd to hear Lee mocking his own technique. But he tends to see his playing style more in terms of expediency than technique, and as such is a bit embarrassed to think that explaining how he plays could be considered educational.

"Why would somebody be interested in this?" he says. "It seems like a freak of nature, this whole style I've developed. But at the end of the day, it's the results, and I'm able to use it to create the kind of bass-scapes that I want to create, and I know a lot of people are interested in how I do that. So I guess it would be, at some point, appropriate to show someone".

Perhaps he could do it sports show-style, using close-ups and freeze-frames from concert footage.

"Right," he says, laughing. "Get one of those little marker things, and circle the fingers: 'Look at how terribly positioned my wrist is in this position. That's why I get tendonitis at the end of the tour.'"

[Kevinmach]

There is some footage somewhere, maybe a BP mag video interview or something, where they ask him about doing an instructional video. He is response is something to the effect of "why would anyone want to play the way I do?" and he was not referring to note choice, but more his "poor" technique. I am not anti-Geddy, at all. He is my favorite player on the planet.

He's my favorite too, even before I picked up a bass.

I didn't know if you were talking about the sound itself or the playing on Tom Sawyer, I will watch next time I see one of live DVDs though.

But Geddy is right-in another thread somewhere, I was commenting on how I have recently been paying a lot more attention to technique, and I happened to be watching a the Rush in Rio DVD and paying close attention to what he was doing. And strictly speaking, his technique was a pretty big departure from the norm in terms of basic dos and don'ts. I was really surprised.

But as my old baseball coach once about proper stance and hitting the ball, you are not gonna see a hitting coach tinkering with a guys stance if he's hitting .400 just because he's departing from some of the basic rules.

But this *does* answer the question of why I have never seen instruction videos with his name on it, I've actually wondered that before (I never really searched heavily for one, but never came across one either and never could figure out why). I thought possibly it was his more "humble" mannerisms that maybe made him uncomfortable with such an undertaking. In all the years I've seen Rush live, I've never heard him or Alex do a solo. Then again, I do recall Alex saying that they found solo's in general to be pretty boring, when maybe 25% of the average audience are musicians who really want to see it (though I suspect that is a lot higher at Rush concerts). I have to confess, even though I've played several instruments, I find solos rather boring myself.

Alvaro, seeing how you not only know everything about Rush but also seem to be sitting at the computer waiting to cite a article on command, do you have a link for this article too? Or maybe Geddy talking about his lack of bass solos?

[Alvaro Martín Gómez A.]

Originally Posted by Kevinmach

Alvaro, seeing how you not only know everything about Rush but also seem to be sitting at the computer waiting to cite a article on command, do you have a link for this article too? Or maybe Geddy talking about his lack of bass solos?

Sorry, man. I don't have any links. I have many guitar magazines (bass mags have never been available in my town) that I bought in the early 90s and there are some articles about Rush. The more recent issues (2) of Bass Guitar magazine I have were sent to me by a really nice woman from the U.S. who's a big fan of Geddy and dropped me a line telling me that she liked my videos and wanted to send me those mags (both with Geddy on the cover) as a present. I can scan the articles and post them here, if you like.