About stage presence...

[EnviroMetal]

just keep playing gigs and shows
the more ya play the easier it comes and more stage confidence ya build

[kennydakid]

Originally Posted by hibachiduck

Have you ever thought your frontman is just scared people won't have their eyes glued to him/her the entire show? I played with a frontman like that on more than one occasion. I've come to refer to it as "frontman syndrome" (FMS for short)

Sorry in advance for the long post

Maybe. Let me give a bit more info and back story to this (And sorry to the OP for hijacking this thread). I played with this guy in a previous band for 10 years or so (maybe longer, damn I am getting old). In that band I played drums and we were a 3 piece. Back in October of 2011 our old band broke up for a few reasons. He gave the old bassist the boot for missing a non paying gig hosting an open mic at a church (we played acoustic based pop/rock think everything from doors to dave matthews) We had one more gig scheduled so we played that with a fill in bassist to honor the gig and the band dissolved. I run a law practice and I basically told him that I did not have the time to start a new project. A few months went by (Jan 2012) and he was having trouble finding a bassist so he asked me if I was willing to learn the instrument to play in his new project a 4 piece rock band to get it off the ground. After a few practices it was obvious that the lead guitarist was not cutting it so we made a mutual decision to move on without him. We became the 3 piece you see in the videos. I started off as a temporary fill in until they found a replacement but they never found one so i took on the role full time.

As further background, I have never heard this guy ever say that a band playing on a bill with us was any good. He always finds something wrong with every band he sees and he is overly critical in general. He didn't really develop this until he went to school for music (he was a voice major). Every time we play, the first thing he does when we get off stage is go over our mistakes.

The drummer in this band is a classmate of his from UMass Lowell who studied Sound Recording there. I am the only one from a non music school background (as I said before I am a lawyer) and I've been playing my instrument the least amount of time (just over 1 year compared to at least 10 for the drummer and 15 for the guitar/vocals) I sent out a text when I got home from our gig friday night to the other guys in the band saying we need to talk about some things, performance wise. The drummer texted me back right away with some things. The vocal/guitarist has not, nor has he responded to my 2 calls on saturday or 3 texts.

I really like the music, and this guy has been a longtime friend of mine but, though I am a groomsman in his upcoming wedding and he was one in mine last october I really don't hang out with him outside of music anymore. I really just want to address my concerns with him at a band meeting, rather than 1 on 1 because I think these are really band issues rather than a 1 on 1 problem but I don't know what to do right now. I am tired of feeling like i am being judged and being concerned about what I need to do and act like and play like.

Thanks again for hearing me out and if he seems to stumble across this thread online I'm not that concerned because these are all things I plan on addressing to him.

[guy n. cognito]

Originally Posted by kennydakid

I got the never do that again talk from the frontman in my band (3 piece) tonight who told me I need to move around less on stage. Let me know what you think, here's a link to a video. By the way I am glad I saw this I was going to post about this after my show but I found this thread first. This is a video from about 2 or 3 months ago but this is basically what i do on stage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxphMLHcAHA

Nothing about your performance is over the top. You seem to be enjoying the music. "Frontmen" are often times very insecure people. He doesn't want to have any competition for the spotlight, so he wants you back in the shadows.

On your lack of experience: You are sharing the stage with these guys and seem to be holding your own. Mr. "I Went To Music School" needs to keep that in mind during your conversation.

[ThirtyOver]

seen enough guys jumping up on stuff and kicking stuff over. Want to see someone just go for it and come off stage and punch someone right in the face, spit on them and move on to the next person. Its about time that "feeling the music" brought about something besides:

a. kicking something
b. making over exaggerated faces
c. lighting something on fire
d. standing next to a guitar player while half humping each other in some odd show of your love for each other.
e. trip over a cord smash your head on a beer cooler and play through the bloody mess that follows.
f. piss yourself onstage for the warmth of it.

[JakeF]

Originally Posted by kennydakid

I got the never do that again talk from the frontman in my band (3 piece) tonight who told me I need to move around less on stage. Let me know what you think, here's a link to a video. By the way I am glad I saw this I was going to post about this after my show but I found this thread first. This is a video from about 2 or 3 months ago but this is basically what i do on stage.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UxphMLHcAHA

WTH? I'm going to second the earlier post that you have a band leader who feels insecure. Your movements are cool dude.

Of course in my band the bass player always ends up on top of his amp rockin out and I think my job verges upon a glorified male stripper at times.

Yeah. I'm THAT guy.

[mellowinman]

Originally Posted by kennydakid

Sorry in advance for the long post

Maybe. Let me give a bit more info and back story to this (And sorry to the OP for hijacking this thread). I played with this guy in a previous band for 10 years or so (maybe longer, damn I am getting old). In that band I played drums and we were a 3 piece. Back in October of 2011 our old band broke up for a few reasons. He gave the old bassist the boot for missing a non paying gig hosting an open mic at a church (we played acoustic based pop/rock think everything from doors to dave matthews) We had one more gig scheduled so we played that with a fill in bassist to honor the gig and the band dissolved. I run a law practice and I basically told him that I did not have the time to start a new project. A few months went by (Jan 2012) and he was having trouble finding a bassist so he asked me if I was willing to learn the instrument to play in his new project a 4 piece rock band to get it off the ground. After a few practices it was obvious that the lead guitarist was not cutting it so we made a mutual decision to move on without him. We became the 3 piece you see in the videos. I started off as a temporary fill in until they found a replacement but they never found one so i took on the role full time.

As further background, I have never heard this guy ever say that a band playing on a bill with us was any good. He always finds something wrong with every band he sees and he is overly critical in general. He didn't really develop this until he went to school for music (he was a voice major). Every time we play, the first thing he does when we get off stage is go over our mistakes.

The drummer in this band is a classmate of his from UMass Lowell who studied Sound Recording there. I am the only one from a non music school background (as I said before I am a lawyer) and I've been playing my instrument the least amount of time (just over 1 year compared to at least 10 for the drummer and 15 for the guitar/vocals) I sent out a text when I got home from our gig friday night to the other guys in the band saying we need to talk about some things, performance wise. The drummer texted me back right away with some things. The vocal/guitarist has not, nor has he responded to my 2 calls on saturday or 3 texts.

I really like the music, and this guy has been a longtime friend of mine but, though I am a groomsman in his upcoming wedding and he was one in mine last october I really don't hang out with him outside of music anymore. I really just want to address my concerns with him at a band meeting, rather than 1 on 1 because I think these are really band issues rather than a 1 on 1 problem but I don't know what to do right now. I am tired of feeling like i am being judged and being concerned about what I need to do and act like and play like.

Thanks again for hearing me out and if he seems to stumble across this thread online I'm not that concerned because these are all things I plan on addressing to him.

I would address with him that his own lack of charisma is appalling.

You might want to phrase it more delicately than that.

[hibachiduck]

Originally Posted by ThirtyOver

seen enough guys jumping up on stuff and kicking stuff over. Want to see someone just go for it and come off stage and punch someone right in the face, spit on them and move on to the next person. Its about time that "feeling the music" brought about something besides:

a. kicking something
b. making over exaggerated faces
c. lighting something on fire
d. standing next to a guitar player while half humping each other in some odd show of your love for each other.
e. trip over a cord smash your head on a beer cooler and play through the bloody mess that follows.
f. piss yourself onstage for the warmth of it.

Ever been to a hardcore show? Sounds like you'd enjoy it .

I agree with mellowinman. You seemed way more entertaining than the frontman was.

Don't sweat the experience on instrument thing too much. It's all about how much you want it. The first band I played bass with I went from not even having my own bass our first practice (I'd never even touched a bass before then) to being the one everyone came up to after the shows to compliment. I'm trying to say that in the least conceited-sounding manner, as I'm not bragging about it, just stating an observation. Experience doesn't mean talent and time spent on an instrument doesn't mean time spent in the practice room. I'd spend over 8 hours a days the first 3 months I picked up bass just trying to get near the same level as the other musicians (the guitarist was formally trained in jazz guitar and had been recording since he was about 12. One of the best guitarists I've ever met; so it took a lot of work to just to hack it with the band). You seemed to be doing what you needed to be doing and that's all that matters.

[foxxiroxx]

Hey hey! I'm an introvert too! But when I perform (band or dance- my other hobby) I don't at all mind being center of attention. Nice to meet someone else who sounds like a paradox like me. :-)

Anyway - as to your question.... I think it could be both about stage presence and song selection. Are you playing what your target audience wants? Another way to frame tht question is - are you playing places where they want your type of music?

I used to get into debates. "Being in a band is about visuals as much as it about sound" - said my old guitar teacher. I disagreed, but after taking some time off and going to see lots of local bands - I think he's probably right. Though granted what he meant as likely - being in a covers band, playing bars.... etc.

[two fingers]

Originally Posted by ThirtyOver

Want to see someone just go for it and come off stage and punch someone right in the face, spit on them and move on to the next person.

You are obviously nowhere near me geographically. Around here that would get you beaten and left for dead right in front of the stage. And "nobody saw nothin' officer".

[LiquidMidnight]

+1 to what everyone has said about Kenny's front guy. It seems like he wants to be center of attention, but doesn't have the charisma for it. Plus, the way you guys are set up on stage is just goofy for a three-piece. I understand that some stages necessitate less than traditional stage plotting, but it seems like you and the drummer are purposefully being stuck in the background.

[topo morto]

Originally Posted by two fingers

OK I'm gonna lay another cold, hard fact on you. There is virtually NOTHING in that set list that ANY girl/woman would want to hear.

+1, that was my first thought. Doesn't mean you can't throw some of those in, but see if you can stomach a few of these : http://www.mobilebeat.com/top-200/

[pklima]

Originally Posted by LiquidMidnight

+1 to what everyone has said about Kenny's front guy. It seems like he wants to be center of attention, but doesn't have the charisma for it.

Yeah, I know I'm just piling on at this point, but the guy has a music education, has been at it for ten years, but it seems he's just not good at being popular and marketable. I mean, most of the views on the band's official Youtube channel come from TBers in this thread, don't they?

If it wasn't for the wedding business, I'd be all "cut and run and find a band fronted by a hot chick".

Originally Posted by topo morto

+1, that was my first thought. Doesn't mean you can't throw some of those in, but see if you can stomach a few of these : http://www.mobilebeat.com/top-200/

Yup. I've done several of those and I can confirm they all work. Well, all the ones I've done have been from the past few years, but I'm sure the classic ones would work, too.

[kennydakid]

I've talked to him about stage set up. I will say that most of our stages are goofy and tough to set up. The first video I posted was shot at an angle, the side of the stage that looks empty was inhabitable, but he could have probably moved over about 3 feet and thats it. I still think the stage set up would have looked better in if he moved over. The other video the stage was barely big enough for a drumset. He set up by one corner of the stage and gave the drummer the rest of it.

I am going to address this again at our next band meeting but he doesn't seem to listen to me on anything music or "stage" related. If the Drummer brings it up he at least considers it, I think its because our Drummer went to school for music.

We didn't have any video from our show on friday but here's a picture from the show. The stage was funky so we basically had to set it up this way

[dudethatscrazie]

My $.02 on the subject is that I get 45 minutes, maybe once or twice a month, to act like a total and complete rock star. I will absolutely make use of that opportunity. My band plays original music in the vein of alt. rock/indie, so of course I'm not breathing fire or doing back flips. But I find if I can play my bass with authority and not look at the fretboard for the majority of the show, rock star status will be achieved. Ultimately, I'm trying to have fun while looking like I'm having fun to the audience.

[Bunk McNulty]

Originally Posted by two fingers

You are obviously nowhere near me geographically. Around here that would get you beaten and left for dead right in front of the stage. And "nobody saw nothin' officer".

LOL! Yup, that's life in the Carolinas! (Someday gotta tell the story about the large gent who walked into the club drunk and waving a taser...)

[petrus61]

Originally Posted by two fingers

You are obviously nowhere near me geographically. Around here that would get you beaten and left for dead right in front of the stage. And "nobody saw nothin' officer".

That would get you beaten mercilessly just about anywhere, lol

[ThirtyOver]

Originally Posted by two fingers

You are obviously nowhere near me geographically. Around here that would get you beaten and left for dead right in front of the stage. And "nobody saw nothin' officer".

Same would happen here too. All Im saying is that maybe someone could think up a different standard for what "feeling the music can look like. We have seen bands that throw blood, rock around and break stuff, beat themselves up onstage, kick stuff, smash their own stuff, go out in the crowd, damn near make love to each other onstage, fall on their heads and keep playing like the fact their eyeball is hanging out doesn't phase them...

Think its time for people to either go all the way and just start attacking people or something "different"

[kennydakid]

I dont know, on bar rescue last night the band on stage was named miscarrage, you can imagine what their stage show included and it wasnt a live birth

[pklima]

But if you start punching audience members then the hipsters will say you're just a GG Allin ripoff. And nobody wants to be called that.

[ThirtyOver]

Originally Posted by pklima

But if you start punching audience members then the hipsters will say you're just a GG Allin ripoff. And nobody wants to be called that.

damn. guess it's time to get a mask. always seems to work