Am I alone here by hating unnecessary hi-hat clicks?

LiquidMidnight · #1 08-14-2006, 05:05 PM

Latley, I've been seeing a lot of drummers (including our own) do something that sort of grates on me. I see a lot of drummers do unnecessary hi-hat clicks in the middle of songs, especially cover material, and I think that it detracts from the overall presentation of the band. I find a band that doesn't have this clicks in songs to sound tighter. I can understand having a click in a long interlude just to keep the dancers on the floor interested, but I'm talking about one and two bars where the drummer is doing clicks to keep everyone in time. Or I'll see a drummer do a click on the four right before everyone comes in.

I can feel a one pretty easily. It's very natural. If I can't feel my way through a song, then I do what everyone should. I count! I'm not saying that there are times when a hi-hat count in a song wouldn't be good, but I find that 9 times out of 10 they are unnecessary; and the band will always sound tighter without them.

Thoughts?

Edwcdc · #2 08-14-2006, 05:47 PM

The hi-hat click has been around for many years my friend.
It was first invented in the 1960's to keep guitar players and singers in time. We bassists don't need the clicks but we must live with them.

basses5 · #3 08-14-2006, 06:23 PM

Hi hat clicks are not cool, usually the sign of an inexperienced drummer.

20db pad · #4 08-14-2006, 06:32 PM

I'm personally ambivalent.....I'd probably slice hi-hat clicks out of a recording if I felt it detracted from the overall end product, but they don't truly bug me live.

I've heard and/or played with many great drummers that use hi-hat clicks during a performance. I wouldn't dismiss the use of them as an indicator of a lack of skill or abilty. YMMV.

Matthew Bryson · #5 08-14-2006, 06:39 PM

Well, just yesterday I listened to 2 of my best friends (who play in a band together) spend about 45 minutes complaining about their drummer and this very issue - I'd say: No, you are not alone in this.

Der Bluten Kat · #6 08-14-2006, 06:42 PM

it's chill sometimes like if the music is slowly getting less interesting but not all the time.. i know a drummer who's very talented but does that funky hi-hat stuff way too much it's so irritating

**smperry** · #7 08-14-2006, 06:43 PM

I love a drummer who's skilled with the highhat...not just straight eights of course. That's called a metronome.

Marshall

slap_happy · #8 08-14-2006, 06:47 PM

I love it when drummers do funky stuff on the highhat. This is not something to keep others on time though I expect that what your talking about and what I'm talking about is somewhat different. Even better is double bass rolls and such. Drummers are our friends guys.. let the funk flow freely. Guitar players are the ones to hate..

Peter Squire · #9 08-14-2006, 08:37 PM

If the drummer is just using clicks to keep the rest of the band in time, then it's an issue for every member of your band.

I believe that every musician should be able to count and keep time without the drummer baby-stepping them through it. Perhaps it's just something that the band need to practice.

Joey3313 · #10 08-15-2006, 09:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by basses5

Hi hat clicks are not cool, usually the sign of an inexperienced drummer.

And this post was a sign of an amateur player.

Ever great drummer (save for solo-ers) use clicks to keep time, and it's a good idea they do. Guitarists especially pay little attention to time, and bassists come in a close second (the only difference is they'll deny it to the death).

It is the only viable option aside from in-ear monitors, which are kinda costly for a bar cover band (and pointless, your audience is so drunk they could usually give a ****).

I say they are a necessity.

Although, for the record, that sort of time keeping should be done with the hi-hat pedal and not just "clicks" as you call them...but whatever.

msquared · #11 08-15-2006, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Joey3313

And this post was a sign of an amateur player.

Ever great drummer (save for solo-ers) use clicks to keep time, and it's a good idea they do.

+1.

That said, taste is always important.

Dkerwood · #12 08-15-2006, 11:28 PM

From a (psuedo) drummer's perspective:

It's not necessarily a timekeeping thing as much as a time PLAYING thing, at least for me. Yes, there are places to lay out completely, but usually (IMHO) a piece can quickly lose its drive and forward motion without something percussive pushing the tune along.

Personally, I like hi hat clicks on 2 and 4, perhaps with some lighter other stuff around it, perhaps not. It's something I've developed from listening to pro players from all genres. Jazz players do it all the time. Hard rock players do it with a semi-open hi hat. From country to emo, turn on the radio and you'll hear drummers doing this. Obviously, they can't ALL be amateur players, can they?

What bugs me is when hi hat clicks come out of time - ie, the left foot just starts bouncing and the hi hat starts making noise. It took a little while to break my drummer of this habit. I've personally gotten in the habit of "splashing" 8th notes on the hi hat if I'm doing a big loud fill. Sometimes it's great, sometimes it's overkill.

Anyway, be grateful for the hi hat click. It a sign that the drummer is right there with you, in the moment.

badstonebass · #13 08-16-2006, 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by basses5

Hi hat clicks are not cool, usually the sign of an inexperienced drummer.

Heh heh. That's why you see them used in major acts in front of thousands.

Don't like the clicks? Get rid of them. However, if you ever are doing a show where it requires any choreograpy or syncing of special effects they are necessary.

If SABBATH, KISS and RUSH use High Hat clicks what makes you guys think they are amateur. I let Neil Peart know how you feel.

keb · #14 08-16-2006, 09:28 AM

Funny that...

When I program MIDI for playback through a software drum sampler, or a drum machine, or whatever, I'll add in some hi-hat clicks in appropriate places to add that sort of "drummer's authenticity" to the sound. Go figure. (But I guess the key word is "appropriate" -- I put on my drummer hat and think and approach it like a drummer when I do this stuff.)

SnoMan · #15 08-16-2006, 10:29 AM

Yeah, that high-hat tapping is for suckers.

Whatcha need are BLAST BEATS!

lol

McHack · #16 08-16-2006, 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by smperry

I love a drummer who's skilled with the highhat...not just straight eights of course. That's called a metronome.

Marshall

I agree, Marshall... I always thought Steve Gadd was great at this.

Diggler · #17 08-16-2006, 12:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by SnoMan

Yeah, that high-hat tapping is for suckers.

Whatcha need are BLAST BEATS!

lol

Like the bass drum hits towards the end of Aerosmith's "Livin' on the Edge"...

... But I'd rather be hanging on... BOOM BOOM BOOM Livin' on the edge!

SnoMan · #18 08-16-2006, 01:01 PM

err....

Not was I was referencing.

I'm talking about in those super heavy metal bands where the drummer will apparently hit the snare as hard as he can on every beat.

That's what I mean by Blast Beats. I hate them.

If used very sparcly(I don't think I spelled that correctly) they can contribute well to the song, but far too often I hear them used nearly throughout an entire song and they just ruin it.

Bottom Feeder · #19 08-16-2006, 01:21 PM

Sabbath-War Pigs is probably the best example I can think of. 4 complete bars of clicks for your listening enjoyment between the signature D-E hits. I can't see how every member would keep the time for 4 bars without it. Not to mention the lack of some kind of percussive forward momentum.

Kronos · #20 08-17-2006, 03:22 AM

Nothing like Ozzy singing A Capella. I'm sure War Pigs would've been a great song had it been done without those hi hat "clicks". I think they help build tension. It's a buildup to the "Hooo lord yes!"-and the rest.

I guess the Pink Panther theme should just cut out the use of the triangle at the beginning of the song, as well, and just get to the sax...or just have dead air until the sax joins in...

Remember, hi hats and cymbals are more than just time keepers, they're musical instruments.