(Another) Legal question...

finalrequiem · #1 09-13-2011, 08:22 AM

How does a person go about finding a REPUTABLE entertainment attorney? Shoot- How do you know where to look for a lawyer period? Just go with whichever firm has enough money to advertise on T.V. or who has the most syllables in their names?

The problem is that I'm Oklahoma City and we're very insulated from any kind of "scene" and it isn't particularly lucrative for people wanting to practice that kind of law here. I'm not looking for anyone to tell me who to use, but I've never had to find an attorney before and I'm not sure how to start. I manage an HVAC service company and I understand the how hard it is for people to know where to start looking when you're shopping for a "service" when you don't already know the business...

Jason P Bass · #2 09-13-2011, 08:29 AM

1) Don't be intimidated by attorneys. You can call their offices and start asking questions just as easily as you can call UHaul and ask about truck rentals.

2) Ask questions. Ask for credentials. Ask them who they have represented (they might not be able to answer, but it won't hurt to ask). Almost any court proceedings will be public record - ask them if they have won in court, when, where, and how?

3) Ask for references, exactly like you're doing right now.

busmandan · #3 09-13-2011, 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finalrequiem

How does a person go about finding a REPUTABLE entertainment attorney? Shoot- How do you know where to look for a lawyer period? Just go with whichever firm has enough money to advertise on T.V. or who has the most syllables in their names?

The problem is that I'm Oklahoma City and we're very insulated from any kind of "scene" and it isn't particularly lucrative for people wanting to practice that kind of law here. I'm not looking for anyone to tell me who to use, but I've never had to find an attorney before and I'm not sure how to start. I manage an HVAC service company and I understand the how hard it is for people to know where to start looking when you're shopping for a "service" when you don't already know the business...

Aren't the All-American Rejects from OKC? If so, contact their management and find out who they used when they were getting started (probably not who they have now).

finalrequiem · #4 09-14-2011, 02:59 PM

Thanks for the advice!

(I might be secretly hoping Music Attorney sees this thread lol)

Music Attorney · #5 09-25-2011, 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finalrequiem

Thanks for the advice!

(I might be secretly hoping Musiclawyer sees this thread lol)

Sorry. Been busy ............... thankfully ;-)

What kind of “entertainment” lawyer do you want? Music? Film/TV? Books? What do you want/need them to do?

Are you looking for someone to “shop” your band to a label (i.e., help you get a record deal)?

Are you looking for someone to simply handle transactional matters you bring to them (e.g., look over a contract between the band and a manager)?

Are you looking for a litigator?

As a threshold matter, I would not recommend the approaches suggested by Jason P Bass. Those are things to certainly address at some point, but it’s not the first conversation I’d have with your prospective attorney.

I highly recommend the approach by busmandan and, depending on your responses to the questions above, I would recommend expanding that concept (i.e., contacting representatives of artists that might have a circle of resources well suited to what your doing -- i.e., they'll "get" you) to other key cities (e.g., NY, L.A., Nashville, Atlanta, etc.). I represent (and have represented) clients from all over the world. Your lawyer doesn’t necessarily have to be local and, in your case, it may be more advantageous if they aren’t.

Best,
MA

finalrequiem · #6 09-26-2011, 02:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Music Attorney

Sorry. Been busy ............... thankfully ;-)

What kind of “entertainment” lawyer do you want? Music? Film/TV? Books? What do you want/need them to do?

Are you looking for someone to “shop” your band to a label (i.e., help you get a record deal)?

Are you looking for someone to simply handle transactional matters you bring to them (e.g., look over a contract between the band and a manager)?

Are you looking for a litigator?

As a threshold matter, I would not recommend the approaches suggested by Jason P Bass. Those are things to certainly address at some point, but it’s not the first conversation I’d have with your prospective attorney.

I highly recommend the approach by busmandan and, depending on your responses to the questions above, I would recommend expanding that concept (i.e., contacting representatives of artists that might have a circle of resources well suited to what your doing -- i.e., they'll "get" you) to other key cities (e.g., NY, L.A., Nashville, Atlanta, etc.). I represent (and have represented) clients from all over the world. Your lawyer doesn’t necessarily have to be local and, in your case, it may be more advantageous if they aren’t.

Best,
MA

Thank you! I can appreciate being busy since I manage a HVAC service company.

I'm not really SURE what I need exactly, outside of the fact that it's music related. I just really don't know how to get started as far as publishing, making a band an actual business entity, trademark issues, copyright issues (although I think I have most of that part solved). I'm just needing to get things started the RIGHT way, right off the bat, instead of getting in to trouble.

Just figuring out who to contact and ask for is daunting in and of itself, to be honest. I really appreciate the advice!

EDIT: Oh, and sorry for botching your name.

MNAirHead · #7 09-26-2011, 04:15 PM

Joey..

Until you can articulate it - don't waste their time or your money.

Chances are as a separate set of questions we can walk you through the basics.

Tim

finalrequiem · #8 09-27-2011, 09:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MNAirHead

Joey..

Until you can articulate it - don't waste their time or your money.

Chances are as a separate set of questions we can walk you through the basics.

Tim

Thanks Tim!

Here: The Jason Scott Band

(this was all recorded in a "home studio" with a little 2-channel Focusrite preamp. I didn't record the bass parts, Jason did. The harmony on We Resound is my wife. All the lyrics and recordings are finally protected and I'm pulling Stealing Cinderella soon because it hasn't been properly credited)

I am basically managing and playing bass for my best friends project. My primary concern is his well-being and protecting his interests, musically and legally. Even if a label came calling, I'm not even certain I would tag along (if they'd even let him keep his musicians) because I have a wife and toddlers, etc. Trying to get him off the ground safely is my primary concern.

Can he even use "The Jason Scott Band" to sell music and perform under?

If so, should it be trademarked?

Should I start a publishing company to "keep the publishing"? I'm not even 100% sure what that entails.

He wants to get the music available for purchase, digitally. Anywhere better than another to do that?

ASCAP? BMI?

He's discussed wanting to actually be a "band" with me as a partner as opposed to a solo project thingy (not even sure what to call this). Wouldn't we have to create a business entity for that? Would it be best at that point to get an attorney involved? CPA?

God help me if somehow a label did ever get interested. What then?

Basically, between managing a company, being a husband, being a dad, amateur (as you can see) web design, blogging, school, practicing, etc I've ran out of resources and time. I need help, helping him. I've researched and read and read and read some more and I'm not certain that I know any more now than I did before. I have a greater appreciation for the value of attorneys who have to constantly keep abreast of all this stuff and do it the right way. My hat is off to you guys...

mrpackerguy · #9 09-27-2011, 08:00 PM

I might start with the Oklahoma state bar and see if they have a lawyer referral service which in Wisconsin is almost free. It's a start. I'd ask maybe generally for an "entertainment" attorney name or two. The nice thing about these services is the initial consultation is usually free or minimal (in Wisconsin $20). An attorney in the field can narrow for you what you need, and may even have referrals for you if the initial contacted attorney cannot do the work. Good luck.

finalrequiem · #10 09-30-2011, 10:00 AM

I appreciate all the advice! Anyone else?

Edit: It looks like the lawyer referral service is in Tulsa, which isn't out of the question but I"ll have to plan it ahead of time and take a day off of work, since it's a couple of hours away. As far as contacting other acts and their management, I'm not sure what to do. I probably seem really helpless but- Do I start with their label and work backwards, towards them?

busmandan · #11 10-14-2011, 10:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by finalrequiem

I appreciate all the advice! Anyone else?

Edit: It looks like the lawyer referral service is in Tulsa, which isn't out of the question but I"ll have to plan it ahead of time and take a day off of work, since it's a couple of hours away. As far as contacting other acts and their management, I'm not sure what to do. I probably seem really helpless but- Do I start with their label and work backwards, towards them?

You're not that far away from me, so use the resources of the Texas Music Office.

I'm sure some of the 251 attorneys listed there are also licensed in OK.

finalrequiem · #12 10-15-2011, 07:04 AM

Thanks!

Mokebass · #13 10-19-2011, 02:13 AM

Obviously time to bring in mandatory blood testing for all bass players, before they get to pick up their bass.

finalrequiem · #14 10-19-2011, 03:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mokebass

Obviously time to bring in mandatory blood testing for all bass players, before they get to pick up their bass.

I'm thoroughly confused. Care to explain?

radley · #15 10-21-2011, 02:30 PM

hey fellas and fell..ettes, I know it's an old thread but I couldn't resist.
I'm part of a up-and-coming firm called LegalShield, basically what we do is provide top-notch legal services for next-to-nothing.(sounds too good to be true I know, but for real this **** is in****ingcredible)
We're covered in all fitty states and a few provinces up north here, so PM me if you're in need and I can find someone in your area to hook you up.

shameless self promotion as it might be, it's still too cool to not share.

Music Attorney · #16 10-21-2011, 04:16 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by radley

I'm part of a up-and-coming firm called LegalShield

Is this part of Prepaid Legal Services, Inc.?

Quote:

Originally Posted by radley

PM me if you're in need and I can find someone in your area to hook you up.

What experience or knowledge do you have that you believe should make someone on Talkbass comfortable with your recommendation of a "top notch" music attorney?

Is there a single, full-time, transactional music attorney (not just an entertainment attorney) employed by your firm (either directly or as a consultant)? Is so, whom?

Thanks.
MA

**TRichardsbass** · #17 10-22-2011, 08:25 AM

forming a band is nothing more then forming an LLC or incorporating, so any competent attorney who helps businesses incorporate or form will work there. Key is to get the business set up correctly according to your state laws and making sure you have the proper federal tax issues covered.

Then, copyright your stuff. Don't need an attorney for that. Sign up with one of the major performance rights societies (BMI, ASCAP or SESAC) and register your copyrighted material.

Now, at that point, go find an attorney for better knowledge of setting up the publishing company. I don't mean setting up the company, as you can call yourself anything you want. However, there are fees with the performance rights societies for registering as a publisher, and after that you need someone who understands the nuance of publishing and contracts. Synch rights? All in? Limited time? Master session recording or re-recorded?

I agree with MA, especially when you get to the nitty gritty. Just any attorney doesn't cut it, and reduced fee, legal zoomy type services will not cut it. Like I said, for just forming the LLC, yes, they will. But the daily contractual and transactions? Nope.

**TRichardsbass** · #18 10-22-2011, 08:32 AM

By the way, I just purchased some real estate lease products from legalzoom that were supposed to be state specific. I decided for the first time in my life to lease a home I own since I'm never using it anymore. What I got for the price was okay, as it came with some forms other products didn't, but it was just their normal generic with my states name incorporated in it.

I printed out a copy of the National Association of Realtors lease agreement from the NJ group and it was better and was more state specific then LegalZoom, and it was free. The Legal Zoom package did not allow me to modify their lease at all. Everything is .pdf, and I don't own Acrobat writer.

To give you an example, the legal zoom lease did not include anything on requiring the leasee to have renters insurance, nor did it have any clauses in there indemnifying the landlord from things the people who lease the property may cause to harm someone else. that is normally standard in any lease i've ever had, in any state. And I couldn't add it.

So, I'm not going to doubt the poster, but again, generic services are just that, generic. You can get good representation or products, but not detail or the specific nuance you need.

In music, if you are thinking about protection and money, you can't go generic.

fhm555 · #19 10-22-2011, 08:42 AM

The Alabama bar association has a free referral service. Call and tell them what you need and they will give you a list of lawyers who can hook you up.

Do all state bar associations not offer this?

Music Attorney · #20 10-22-2011, 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRichardsbass

forming a band is nothing more then forming an LLC or incorporating, so any competent attorney who helps businesses incorporate or form will work there.

I don’t agree with that. While the “technical” formation of the entity is relatively simple, there are many business nuances and issues specific to running a band that should be explained and considered by a band forming an entity together. I would argue that you need someone familiar with those issues to help walk the band through them when setting up the entity. Although it’s by no means complete, below is a link to some of the issues I’m talking about.

band member contract...

There now. Doesn’t it feel better to be on opposite sides again? ;-)

Quote:

Originally Posted by TRichardsbass

I agree with MA

Now why’d you have to go do that …

Best,
MA