Asking for tips/Tip jars at formal gigs?

[Kwesi]

So our band was contacted for possibly playing some lady's family reunion and we're pretty excited about it. The problem is that she just shot me an email saying that she would like to pay $200 for our 5 piece group to play for 2hrs. That's $40 a piece for 2hrs! She says she's organizing and paying for the reunion almost entirely by herself and respect that. I can also understand, even sympathize with her trying to save a bit of cash here and that with the current economic situation but I still think it's REALLY cheap.

The price isn't final but I don't think we're going to get anywhere near our asking price of $500 and I really would like to do the gig because she says she's an event planner and that she can and is willing to hook us up with more gigs which would be awesome. So my question is would it be cool to (as hobotastic as it sounds...) request tips, or even have her kindly suggest that her guests/family tip us for our service?

It would be nice to squeeze a little more juice from this orange but I don't want to be rude, inappropriate or anything else that could prevent us from getting more business form her.

[rockdoc11]

Opinions will vary widely on this, with there being some strongly held thoughts on this.

As for me, I personally think a band asking for tips, or putting out a tip jar, is in most cases terribly tacky. I'd never do it.

However, I respect that others see it differently.

In this case, since the gig might lead to bigger and better things, I'd pass on the tip jar, and just do the gig for the $200. I'd consider it an investment that might pay off in the future.

Good luck!

[Dogbertday]

yeah just do the gig and maybe have the understanding that you usually as for $500 and any further gigs you will charge that

[phatbass]

If you agree to the pay, don't do the tip-jar thing. It implies that the hostess is too cheap and miserly to pay you properly. That may or may not be true but it's a bit of an implied insult (in my opinion).

Also, and not knowing the lady in question, it seems she is using the old "think of the long term benefit" ploy to get you to play for peanuts. I'd do this one gig if you've already implied that you will, but be very, very wary when the next gig she gets you is "this is a very important client and the potential for more gigs is huge so you'll do it for peanuts again won't you?".

Yes I am cynical, and she may be totally well-meaning, but I personally don't go for this crap any more.

[jruberto]

$200 is really really cheap. Especially if:

- the band is any good
- they expect you to play requests
- they have other requirements (attire, you have to bring lights)
- you have to travel to get there

There is nothing disrespectful, rude or inappropriate about sticking by your guns on the rates. Do be wary of the "do this one cheap and it will lead to more work" bit.

The agency band I'm in wouldn't touch that gig for much less than $2000. But... it's a full on production, a band full of pros (in tuxedos if you want) with a book 800 songs deep, 20-song medleys, great equipment, so on and so forth.

Now, based on the rates, your questions, your reluctance to ask for $500 and since you've said your band is "pretty excited" to play "some lady's family reunion" I'm going to go ahead and assume that you guys are kind of new at this. No offense. There are just some things that are specific to this kind of gig that you'll only get with experience doing this kind of gig. Hopefully I can help you over some of the low hurdles...

The up-front communication is the key. Get straight on all the details *now* and make absolutely sure there are no surprises (for you or for the client) on gig day: Are they going to feed you? (no? dang, that's harsh! costs extra.) Do they have lights for when it gets dark or do you need to bring a light rig? (costs extra) What kind of music do they want to hear? Will you have to play requests or special tunes for them? (costs extra) Can you have the requests in advance so you can learn them? Is there ample electricity at the site? Is it outside? If it's outside & it's summer & it's daytime you need cover: playing two hours in direct sun is awful. What if it rains? Do they have tarps to cover equipment or do you need to bring them? Are they expecting you to play CDs when the band is on break? (costs extra) Do you get a break? Do they expect to use your PA for announcements and such before/after the show? (costs extra) On and on and on..... You would be absolutely shocked at how different your assumptions on this stuff might be from the client's. (and when i say costs extra i mean it potentially costs *you* extra)

Now, after all those questions, are you still excited to do this gig for $200? Especially if you have to have a few rehearsals just to learn the requests...

No matter how much or little you charge, you have to be super pro, especially if you want to put your best foot forward in hopes of getting more gigs (i.e. be on time, don't ever make the PA feed back, don't get drunk, don't play blasting loud, don't dress like slobs even if the client doesn't have a dress code for you, don't noodle between songs, don't spend 5 minutes between each song trying to decide what to play next, don't train wreck any song, don't ****-talk on stage near open microphones, play to the audience, be nice to everyone, so on and so forth...)

And unless it's agreed to beforehand, no tip jar. If you guys are really good and really cool, you'd be surprised at how generous people can be of their own accord, especially at a fun event such as a family reunion.

Good luck!

[lonote]

Either she can afford you or she can't. As others have said, don't buy in to the "I can get you work in the future" spiel. If you do, she knows that you'll play for $200 so that's what you'll get. I wouldn't budge on the price if it was me, even $500 is cheap for a gig like you describe.

[Phil Smith]

Originally Posted by Kwesi

So our band was contacted for possibly playing some lady's family reunion and we're pretty excited about it. The problem is that she just shot me an email saying that she would like to pay $200 for our 5 piece group to play for 2hrs. That's $40 a piece for 2hrs! She says she's organizing and paying for the reunion almost entirely by herself and respect that. I can also understand, even sympathize with her trying to save a bit of cash here and that with the current economic situation but I still think it's REALLY cheap.

If you can't do the gig for $200, ask for more money and if more money isn't possible don't do the gig.

The price isn't final but I don't think we're going to get anywhere near our asking price of $500 and I really would like to do the gig because she says she's an event planner and that she can and is willing to hook us up with more gigs which would be awesome.

If she's on the level this could work out in your favor. A bird in the hand is worth two in the bush, but sometimes you give up a little to get more.

So my question is would it be cool to (as hobotastic as it sounds...) request tips, or even have her kindly suggest that her guests/family tip us for our service?

If you get ideas like this often remember to say to yourself over and over, NOT A GOOD IDEA.

It would be nice to squeeze a little more juice from this orange but I don't want to be rude, inappropriate or anything else that could prevent us from getting more business form her.

If you did this, you'd be all the things you don't want to be.

[Mo'Phat]

I'll go the other way and say that it's perfectly acceptable to leave an open guitar case at the front of the stage or just offstage. It's very bohemian and doesn't necessarily scream "TIPS" like a mason jar. It's something people are used to seeing, and probably won't take offense. Just don't tell the hostess what you're planning to do.

You can always do the gig and have your guitarist 'accidentally' leave his case open. You'd be surprised how many people will casually drop cash in there.

Don't be a dork and drop seed money in there beforehand, though. Tacky.

[Phil Smith]

Originally Posted by Mo'Phat

I'll go the other way and say that it's perfectly acceptable to leave an open guitar case at the front of the stage or just offstage. It's very bohemian and doesn't necessarily scream "TIPS" like a mason jar. It's something people are used to seeing, and probably won't take offense. Just don't tell the hostess what you're planning to do.

You can always do the gig and have your guitarist 'accidentally' leave his case open. You'd be surprised how many people will casually drop cash in there.

Don't be a dork and drop seed money in there beforehand, though. Tacky.

IMO, doing that is TACKY as well.

[Kwesi]

Thanks for the help everyone. I kinda figure this would get a pretty big "No" but I figured that I would ask just to be sure. We've decided to do the gig in hopes that it'll lead to more but, I like many of you, am pretty weary of the "play cheap this time and I promise..." deal so I plan on being cautious approaching this.

@jruberto - We are pretty new at organizing our own gigs but we've been playing together for 3 years. Most of the time others (parents, teachers, friends) have set stuff up for us so all we had to do was go in and play, lol. We're excited for every gig but we've never had someone offer to help us find more so this one is something of a special case which is why we didn't push the $500, though we did tell her when we had first met. Thanks for the the tips too, a lot of that stuff I hadn't even thought of.

[Zooberwerx]

Hell, do it for $200 but make sure you get fed / watered. Think of it as paid rehearsal.

Riis

[Dom Phenom]

Originally Posted by jruberto

Get straight on all the details *now* and make absolutely sure there are no surprises (for you or for the client) on gig day: Are they going to feed you? (no? dang, that's harsh! costs extra.) Do they have lights for when it gets dark or do you need to bring a light rig? (costs extra) What kind of music do they want to hear? Will you have to play requests or special tunes for them? (costs extra) Can you have the requests in advance so you can learn them? Is there ample electricity at the site? Is it outside? If it's outside & it's summer & it's daytime you need cover: playing two hours in direct sun is awful. What if it rains? Do they have tarps to cover equipment or do you need to bring them? Are they expecting you to play CDs when the band is on break? (costs extra) Do you get a break? Do they expect to use your PA for announcements and such before/after the show? (costs extra) On and on and on..... You would be absolutely shocked at how different your assumptions on this stuff might be from the client's. (and when i say costs extra i mean it potentially costs *you* extra)

+1000

great advice. it's constantly surprising to me how much stuff someone who is just trying to throw a party doesn't think of in terms of the needs of a band (power, cover from the elements, etc). when ever you are not playing a venue that you are not familiar with, all this stuff has to be worked out before the gig is finalized.

[Jeb]

Originally Posted by rockdoc11

Opinions will vary widely on this, with there being some strongly held thoughts on this.

As for me, I personally think a band asking for tips, or putting out a tip jar, is in most cases terribly tacky. I'd never do it.

However, I respect that others see it differently.

In this case, since the gig might lead to bigger and better things, I'd pass on the tip jar, and just do the gig for the $200. I'd consider it an investment that might pay off in the future.

Good luck!

I agree with rockdoc, tacky as all get out. But I do it anyway. It works, and pays for flyers and stuff like that. I'm more practical than pure when it comes to this kind of stuff. Well, with anything actually.

[rodl2005]

When we get a situ like this - sometimes we "recccomend" that the organisors ask ppl for a $5- $10 cover charge to 'HELP-pay 4 the entertainment' which IS for all. I see how a reunion like this MIGHT be harder to do.... BUT - how about a negotiation w/ the hirers- go for say $60ea -better'n $40 hey?? or whatever- start at $90 ea & work down ;-)

[Steve]

A couple of thoughts off the top of my head,

If she's and event planner, she knows exactly how much a real band costs.

If she's an event planner, she knows that a live band is normally a real PIA at a family reunion type event where it's all about everyone talking to each other. THAT, is a DJ / Karaoke gig (barf).

You go in cheap and all her other gigs will have some excuse as to why you need to go in cheap again.

[BigOldHarry]

If she's a friend, great.

If not, skip it. $200 is an insult.

[two fingers]

I THIS case you may have stumbled onto an exception. If you clear it with her first, you may be OK. Just say something like "Well.....we usually don't play for that amount but....I tell you what, we can do it if you let us put out a tip jar and mention it a couple of times." I wouldn't think a family reunion is QUITE as formal as a wedding or other private party. Just be gracious about it and don't mention it between every song. Once at the end of the first set and once in the middle of the second should do it. If it's like most family reunions I've played over the years, they will be offering you money to keep playing at the end anyway. They always get going really good just about the time you are done! Good luck!

[Kwesi]

Originally Posted by Steve

A couple of thoughts off the top of my head,

If she's and event planner, she knows exactly how much a real band costs.

If she's an event planner, she knows that a live band is normally a real PIA at a family reunion type event where it's all about everyone talking to each other. THAT, is a DJ / Karaoke gig (barf).

You go in cheap and all her other gigs will have some excuse as to why you need to go in cheap again.

I was thinking the same things actually. I've run into my fair share of managers, promoters, and planners that didn't know squat about their job but hopefully this isn't another one of them. A DJ is normally what you would hire but some people like the interactive experience of having a band. We'll see how it turns out I guess.

[meta]

they sit at the bar and put bread in my jar and say man what are you doing here?

[synterx]

If I had a dollar everytime I heard " so and so knows so and so, you'll get more gigs". Oldest trick in the book. I would simply say no.