Auditioned, didn't get the gig due to lack of vocal ability.

[Pat C.]

The first audition in 15 years that I didn't get the gig after auditioning. Feels kind of weird, because any other project I've auditioned for asked me to join right away. And not because I'm a spectacular bass player, but I'm solid technically with good gear and a present but unobtrusive tone, and I am prepared and a fast learner with an ear for what is right for the song. Or so I think.

This was a classic/southern/bluesy rock band, with vocals, guitar/backing vox, drums.

Anyway, the the feedback I got from the band is that they liked my playing, and we seemed get along real well, but the player they selected is a strong vocalist which puts the group in a position to pursue more vocal-harmony oriented material, a direction they spoke about at the audition.

Unfortunately I am not a natural singer. I can (and have) done some back-up vocals in the past, but I need a lot of prep time and some vocal rehearsals to make it work, in addition to the time spent learning to sing and play the parts together. So I didn't attempt any vocals at the audition, and when asked if would be able to cover a part that the guitarist couldn't quite sing I declined since it was way out of my range.

I guess the real point of my post is actually a question: Is there anybody out there who built up a strong (or even decent) vocal ability despite not being a naturally good singer?

I'm considering taking vocal lessons, although I'm not sure I can afford it since I'd like to start taking bass lessons again as well. Maybe there is a way for me to work on this on my own, a sort of self-directed method of vocal training. FWIW I have had some minimal "vocal" music training (sight-singing, college choir, etc.) but it's been a while and I'd really like to focus my specific weakness (whatever they are) and get to applying them fairly quickly.

Any direction/advice/appropriate-links that can be offered is appreciated. Thanks in advance.

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by Pat C.

The first audition in 15 years that I didn't get the gig after auditioning. Feels kind of weird, because any other project I've auditioned for asked me to join right away. And not because I'm a spectacular bass player, but I'm solid technically with good gear and a present but unobtrusive tone, and I am prepared and a fast learner with an ear for what is right for the song. Or so I think.

This was a classic/southern/bluesy rock band, with vocals, guitar/backing vox, drums.

Anyway, the the feedback I got from the band is that they liked my playing, and we seemed get along real well, but the player they selected is a strong vocalist which puts the group in a position to pursue more vocal-harmony oriented material, a direction they spoke about at the audition.

Unfortunately I am not a natural singer. I can (and have) done some back-up vocals in the past, but I need a lot of prep time and some vocal rehearsals to make it work, in addition to the time spent learning to sing and play the parts together. So I didn't attempt any vocals at the audition, and when asked if would be able to cover a part that the guitarist couldn't quite sing I declined since it was way out of my range.

I guess the real point of my post is actually a question: Is there anybody out there who built up a strong (or even decent) vocal ability despite not being a naturally good singer?

I'm considering taking vocal lessons, although I'm not sure I can afford it since I'd like to start taking bass lessons again as well. Maybe there is a way for me to work on this on my own, a sort of self-directed method of vocal training. FWIW I have had some minimal "vocal" music training (sight-singing, college choir, etc.) but it's been a while and I'd really like to focus my specific weakness (whatever they are) and get to applying them fairly quickly.

Any direction/advice/appropriate-links that can be offered is appreciated. Thanks in advance.

I have lost auditions 3 times since July because of no vocals. All 3 were represented by good agencies and were making good money.

I have ben taking vocal lessons and practicing vocals with a small start up project.

[jive1]

I'm a horrible singer. I'm not a natural, even though I've had a vocal coach and others tell me so. It just doesn't feel natural to me, even when I'm "on". Even though I've been singing in bands for almost a decade, I'm still not fully confident doing it, and find that there's still a bunch of songs I have no business singing.

I find that I'm a better lead singer than a harmony singer. So sometimes someone hears me sing lead and they think I'll be a great backup vocalist, but I have to put in even more work to nail the harmonies because I naturally lean toward singing in unison. Harmonies don't feel natural to me.

You can read my sticky thread at the top of this forum. It'll give you some tips from a guy who sucks at singing, but for some reason his bandmates want him to sing leads on certain tunes, people in the audience foolishly give him compliments once in a while, and doesn't get booted from the bar when he sings lead on all tunes for an all-niter.

But, I will say, as someone who sucks, know your limits. They don't need to know how much you suck. The only way to stretch your limits is to practice. When you sing lead, know the songs that are in your range, and the keys you are comfortable in. When you do harmonies, don't go for the high harmony when you know you can't hit it. Go unison, fifth down, or octave down instead. Don't sing 5 songs in a night when you only have endurance for 2 or 3.

And the most important thing: SING IN PITCH!!!
Nothing else matters if you aren't in tune, nothing.
That is how crappy singers like me get by.

[bassbully]

Originally Posted by jive1

I'm a horrible singer. I'm not a natural, even though I've had a vocal coach and others tell me so. It just doesn't feel natural to me, even when I'm "on". Even though I've been singing in bands for almost a decade, I'm still not fully confident doing it, and find that there's still a bunch of songs I have no business singing.

I find that I'm a better lead singer than a harmony singer. So sometimes someone hears me sing lead and they think I'll be a great backup vocalist, but I have to put in even more work to nail the harmonies because I naturally lean toward singing in unison. Harmonies don't feel natural to me.

You can read my sticky thread at the top of this forum. It'll give you some tips from a guy who sucks at singing, but for some reason his bandmates want him to sing leads on certain tunes, people in the audience foolishly give him compliments once in a while, and doesn't get booted from the bar when he sings lead on all tunes for an all-niter.

But, I will say, as someone who sucks, know your limits. They don't need to know how much you suck. The only way to stretch your limits is to practice. When you sing lead, know the songs that are in your range, and the keys you are comfortable in. When you do harmonies, don't go for the high harmony when you know you can't hit it. Go unison, fifth down, or octave down instead. Don't sing 5 songs in a night when you only have endurance for 2 or 3.

And the most important thing: SING IN PITCH!!!
Nothing else matters if you aren't in tune, nothing.
That is how crappy singers like me get by.

Right here^ this is great advice and somewhere where I am. I am told i am a pretty good singer. I am a better singer alone with my own music I write in my range than say someone elses.
But in a band its not always like that. I sing backups in my band and do pretty well ..I guess. Its still a struggle and agree with Jive, find your range and dont go above or below and know where your at with it. I love singing and always try to improve. I hope by this time next year to be performing my own songs w/guitar at small venues etc and am always working on my singing. It is huge if you can add this along with good simple bass playing.You will be in demand fo' sure.

[hrodbert696]

I have an auditioning coming up with a band that has made it clear that backing vocals are a part of the job. I'm nervous about it because although I can sing OK, I have a hard time finding the right harmony and keeping track of my bass line at the same time. It does seem like bands should make clear whether they're looking for a bassist who can throw in some backing vocals or a backup singer who can play some bass.

[ThudThudThud]

My vocal ability is limited in range, but I can sing in key. I've been asked to provide harmonies in my new band and I'm a bit daunted since the singer's got quite a powerful voice and sings in quite a high register. I don't want there to be too much of a disparity between his pitch and my baritone. We'll see. The other thing is that I can sing and play a guitar, or I can record a song on bass and sing over the backing track, but I find it very awkward to play melodic bass lines and sing a counter melody. Luckily, I was taken aboard the band solely on bass playing so I can get away with things.
Always been in awe of those who play bass and sing at the same time.

[Richland123]

My suggestion would be to become a good harmonizing backup singer since you don't feel you have the lead singer albility. This would make you much more valuable to a band and these days bands are looking for people who can do more to make them more marketable and avoid hiring more people. The less mouths to feed the better.

It seems you not only have already addressed an issue to get you more gigs but are willing to put in the work to do it.

Good luck.

[klokker]

Maybe I'm assuming more than I should, but from what I read of your post, I might just look for a band that doesn't need vocals.

If you really enjoy singing and want to learn, that's great......go for it, but if you're sort of starting from scratch and don't sight sing etc., that sounds like a lot to learn when you'd enjoy yourself more just "playin" bass".

You're not in the worst position. What's really bad is people who think they can sing, but can't.

[lousybassplayer]

Have you tried putting your finger in your right ear and closing your eyes while you sing?

[CTbass613]

Originally Posted by lousybassplayer

Have you tried putting your finger in your right ear and closing your eyes while you sing?

hahah, not sure if this is a shot of sarcasm or not...but plugging your ear actually will help you hear your voice louder in your own head, it is actually the best monitor you could ask for. I started singing back up out of neccessity in my first band, no one stepped up, i was terrible at it. Started tinkering on acoustic guitar, and began picking up harmonies and vocal strength because i was just singing songs i liked on guitar. I am now a fairly strong vocalist and sing lead on my own projects, but can offer backing vocals to bands i am playing bass with. I play with an Ear plug in my right ear the entire gig when singing and playing is required. I can hear the band and hear my voice to make sure I am nailing the harmony. I also spend alot of time taking songs i know how to play bass on, singing the lead line while i practice to get used to playing lines and singing along. Vocal lessons may be an option, but first and foremost is to start singing in general, voice lessons teach you how to breath and support notes, while in the long run that will help you be a strong singer, if you can't hit a pitch going into the lesson, its going to be a long process.

[jwbassman]

Singing and playing bass and singing in general both require practice. The more you do it the better you will get at it. Your voice is an instrument and should be treated as such. Meaning take care of it, exercise it and practice using it and it will improve over time.

I play and sing both back up and lead. I've been mostly doing harmony vocals in a country band. Also I'm assistant music director at my church, which has helped my singing tremendously. It has made my ear for picking out harmonies on the fly much, much better. I can basically harmonize almost any melody on the fly now. 8 years ago when I started there I couldn't do that. But playing at 2 church masses every weekend year round has given me plenty of practice LOL.

Also when the Director is out of town I have to step up and lead the group. All the vocal responsibilities, plus the song choices, arrangements, etc.

So practice, practice, practice.

One helpful thing I would recommend is to listen to music in the car on your commute to work and try to sing only harmonies to what you hear. This will help improve you ear.

hrodbert696 good luck with the audition!! One NH bassist to another!

[Audiophage]

It sounds like you'll get more out of the vocal lessons than bass lessons.

[billhilly66]

Originally Posted by hrodbert696

I have an auditioning coming up with a band that has made it clear that backing vocals are a part of the job. I'm nervous about it because although I can sing OK, I have a hard time finding the right harmony and keeping track of my bass line at the same time. It does seem like bands should make clear whether they're looking for a bassist who can throw in some backing vocals or a backup singer who can play some bass.

I'm thinking that's a false dichotomy. Why wouldn't they want the bass player to do both well?

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by hrodbert696

I have an auditioning coming up with a band that has made it clear that backing vocals are a part of the job. I'm nervous about it because although I can sing OK, I have a hard time finding the right harmony and keeping track of my bass line at the same time. It does seem like bands should make clear whether they're looking for a bassist who can throw in some backing vocals or a backup singer who can play some bass.

Me too, when I was with NWR, they let me sing lead on one song which was wrong, but I learned from the experience. I sucked but at least I tried.I can't separate playing bass from singing for *&^%.

[bassbully]

Originally Posted by lousybassplayer

Have you tried putting your finger in your right ear and closing your eyes while you sing?

While playing bass?

[Stumbo]

You can always work on ear training, no downside to that. Here are some links. Practice vocalizing the intervals. Being able to hit the 3rd or 5th in tune above (or below) a note w/o by mentally "hearing" the note, IMO, is the main skill to work on. Especially when you have 9th chords and such being played as the rhythm.

~Ear training
Goodear.com
Test your ear
Free downloadable ear trainer (basic/advanced) Solfege. Xlnt program
Trainers/tutorials. Music theory, ear training, read music, chords, intervals, etc.
Online Visual Beginning Theory, ear trainer
Discussion of Solfege

As far as singing and playing bass, for myself, it's the different rhythmic structures of the vocals and bass lines that need working on. Try slowly playing quarter notes on the bass and sing eighth notes in unison. Then reverse it. Then sing the 3rd, then 5th. Then 16th notes, etc. Add more complex bass lines and vocals to get up to speed.

Also, sing along with simple songs, even children's songs. Add your own harmony. Record yourself to hear how you are doing.

If you can play keyboard or guitar, play some songs (chords only) and see how you do.

Don't forget, you'll have to memorize lyrics as well!

It's been slow progress for me but I keep plugging away. Some day are better than others.

Keep at it and you'll make progress. Practicing every day seems to be one of the best things to do.

A program like BestPractice-PC based, free, easy to use, slow downer/pitch shifter/looper/vocal remover/bass isolator/ backing track maker may help since you can remove most vocals on songs.

[delta7fred]

Just my 0.02 in no particular order except as I think of them.

1. Practice, practice and then do bit more practice. I used to drive 45 minutes each way to work every day. I would sing along to my cassette player (anyone remember those) for the entire journey. I would sing the lead part, then try and find all the harmonies that were within my (limited) vocal range.

2. Record yourself and be ultra critical of what you hear, then work on putting it right.

3. Simplify bass parts down until you can sing and play. Only you and maybe the occasional bass player in the audience will notice. The band certainly won't.

4. If you have an audition concentrate on what you are good at, Don't try singing any parts you don't think you will hit. Better sing nothing than something wrong.

5. If the lead singer is missing notes and your (correct) harmonies are clashing with his lead part then stand back off the mic but still keep singing. It will sound better with just the off key lead voice than a mixture of wrong and right voices.

6. Sing with confidence. If you are doubting yourself and holding back then it will show in your vocal performance as weak and uncertain.

This is what I have discovered over the last 40 years of singing, originally backing but in the last few years I have taken the lead roll more. YMMV.

I play a bit of solo delta slide blues, when I was learning and practising the songs one day my son was home. He said that my guitar playing was 'pretty good' but the singing sounded like my heart was not in it. I recorded myself and he was right. There was no conviction in it so I set about correcting it. Now I sing lead on about 10% of the songs in our band. I give him credit for this by pointing out the fact that my lead vocals sucked!

[jive1]

Originally Posted by billhilly66

I'm thinking that's a false dichotomy. Why wouldn't they want the bass player to do both well?

Of course you want someone who can do both well, but sometimes that option isn't readily available to you. Where the priority lies is, whether you'd take a great player with average vocals vs a great vocalist with average bass chops, or whether you'd even go with an amazing player who can't sing at all.

[marmadaddy]

Lots of good advice here. I've gotten some good gigs where the deciding factor was my being a half decent singer on top of being able to play, having good equipment, etc...

Learning to sing is like learning any instrument. With the exception of a few naturally gifted people, no one is good at first. It takes time and work. You just have to do it and consciously work to improve. A few voice lessons from a good teacher can be very effective.

I always tell kids learning to play that they should learn to sing at the same time, even if it's only with the intention of being able to sing backup vocals. It frequently does mean the difference between being in the band or the audience.

[mboogiemanusa]

Singing takes lots of practice and in many cases a natural aptitude and talent for it. It can be developed to some point but maybe not enough to beat out the other bass players with a highly developed vocal ability and are naturals. Not all background singing requires 3 parts harmonies. Many songs just require shout alongs in the background that give the appearance of you being a vocalists. What you might want to do is be the bass player that brings other intangibles to the table to make you more valuable then the other "singing" bass players. A couple of suggestions......own a van, have a place to practice, invest in a gig-able P.A. system and learn to be a soundman, do the promotions and book the shows, write songs and lyrics, create the band flyers and mailing lists, myspace/facebook ages etc etc. Demonstrate that you are valuable and can do all the extra band stuff while working on your vocal talents. You would be surprised how many bands would want your services if you have a nice PA and a place to jam regardless if you can sing or not.