Band members who have mentally quit and are waiting for an "out"

pkmoor · #1 07-09-2011, 01:17 PM

I'm in a wedding band. Last year our female vocalist at the time (married, mid-30's) started to get flaky. She started to question everything and made a fuss that we weren't paid for showcases (we didn't know she was having financial issues at the time). The bandleader eventually brought in a 2nd female vocalist because he was afraid she was going to bolt soon and she actually quit over it.

New vocalist did great for the next year (single, early-20's). A few months ago she got a boyfriend and now it feels like the same thing all over again. This one hasn't given us a full practice in months - she either can't make it or has to leave early. She's been complaining about how other members goof-off or talk between songs during practice, while she has done nothing to curb her texting or phone game-laying when she's not singing.

She's also been whining about a gig we did a few weeks ago where we played a 7-hour reception at a private residence. It was supposed to be a 1 hour cocktail (usually done by our guitard and sax player) and a 5-hour reception (full band), but since it was a private residence (and we knew they would tip well) we gave them an extra hour. We also did the cocktail as full band because everything was all in one place. Now she's crying that it was very unprofessional to have her do 7 hours. She never complained before when the guitard would do 7 hours (ceremony, cocktail and 5 hour reception). I'm also annoyed that she's bantering about the word "unprofessional" when she was a 35 minutes late arriving for our road-trip to the gig (holding everyone up). She also disappeared for another half hour at the end of the gig (again, holding everyone else up). She also got fairly lit while performing (although not to the point where it impacted her ability perform, but you could tell on the way home she was drunk).

Anyone else have to deal with a similar situation? The bandleader is basically the one in charge since he handles all the financing and he's too afraid to do anything for fear she'll leave. As a performer, she's the finest we've ever had, but I feel she's already gone and is waiting for something to quit over. I just hate dealing with all the drama while waiting for them to straighten up or leave.

rouge127 · #2 07-09-2011, 01:25 PM

I hear ya. There is ALWAYS someone in my band that is flaking out at one point or another. When that person gets back onboard...another one flakes out. It's an endless cycle.

Catbuster · #3 07-09-2011, 02:06 PM

yes, and because she was flaking pretty seriously, and I've run the vast majority of band's I've been in, I was completely (though it may have been brutal for the person in question) honest, explained the sitiuation, and told her "good luck on your other ventures."

pkmoor · #4 07-09-2011, 03:10 PM

It's a shame too, because if we make it to the beginning of August it will be one year with the same people in an 8-piece band.

thudfromafar · #5 07-09-2011, 08:27 PM

7 Hours is more time for a singer than for an instrumentalist, except a trumpet player or something, or maybe a drummer. Not questioning everything else but just throwing that out there.

I'll be honest here and put it from a different perspective, which may or may not relate to your specific situation. Most bands I've been in, I've wanted out after a short amount of time. I still put in the effort while I was in, and wouldn't be late to gigs or anything, but if you really tried... you could tell I didn't want to be there. Maybe she just doesn't want to do it anymore? Idk. I'll stop before I turn this into my own bitter rant about how I can't find the right group to play with.

pkmoor · #6 07-09-2011, 08:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by thudfromafar

7 Hours is more time for a singer than for an instrumentalist, except a trumpet player or something, or maybe a drummer. Not questioning everything else but just throwing that out there.

She's not the only vocalist. We have a male vocalist, plus the bandleader, the guitard and myself also do lead vocals. We also do several instrumentals prior to when dancing begins. There were many times she was able to sit off to the side of the stage while I was up the whole time with a 12 pound anchor about my neck.

faulknersj · #7 07-09-2011, 08:46 PM

A good old fashioned band meeting seems to be needed. This will allow band members to voice grievances and most importantly, for policies to be agreed upon and put into place to keep everything on track. I am also a band leader of an extremely busy 9 piece working band. We have had similar issues and have agreed that it is best for the band as a whole that policies be put in place to address rehearsal requirements, and tardiness issues. Any member that is not setup ready to go at the required soundcheck time, or downbeat time for a gig is automatically docked 25% of the evenings pay. Nobody is late any more. We have 3 singers, and I schedule material to be rehearsed in a way that focuses one one vocalist per week. Sometimes, all 3 are required to attend of the harmony parts are extensive. This shows respect for and maximizes their time. Like any functional business, clear rules and guidelines must be set and adhered to. This prevents resentment by preventing any one member from receiving special treatment. This is my suggestion based on experience and the positive results gained from that experience.

MysticMichael · #8 07-09-2011, 11:23 PM

Reality Check Time: First of all, does the singer have a valid point re: any of her complaints? For example, other band members screwing around during rehearsals? If so, the band leader should already have nipped that stuff in the bud. And if he hasn't, he should do so. Immediately.

Secondly, if the singer's irresponsible behavior has already been going on for months (did I get that right?), then why hasn't someone - and I mean the leader - already dealt with it? This is inexcusable. And as a result, the relationship with your singer may already have passed the point of no return. Maybe.

Thirdly: No member of a band is ever indispensable. The fact that your singer has been treated that way represents a gross failure of leadership on the part of your leader, IMHO. Irresponsible behavior - such as that alleged on the part of your singer - must always be addressed just as soon as it rears its head, and resolved just as quickly and thoroughly as possible. Always. The fact that it has not been done in this case has probably allowed your singer to develop a "diva complex" - something which her pride now may not allow her to abandon, since it's already gone on for so long.

Hope it all works out for you. But if not, let it be a lesson - for everyone involved - on how to not run a dysfunctional band...

MM

walterw · #9 07-10-2011, 12:52 AM

slightly OT; my band has played a few weddings but we're not a "wedding band", and i've never heard of any cover band playing an "unpaid showcase".

Munjibunga · #10 07-10-2011, 02:18 AM

In my last band, the drummer and keyboardist's excuses for missing practice got increasingly lame to the point that I disbanded the band.

Febs · #11 07-10-2011, 03:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by walterw

slightly OT; my band has played a few weddings but we're not a "wedding band", and i've never heard of any cover band playing an "unpaid showcase".

It's very common for wedding bands to do unpaid showcases for prospective clients. We do them at our regular rehearsal studio during our regular rehearsal time and they typically take up about 1/2 hour to 45 minutes of a 2 hour rehearsal.

pkmoor · #12 07-10-2011, 06:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

Reality Check Time: First of all, does the singer have a valid point re: any of her complaints? For example, other band members screwing around during rehearsals?

The band itself has been together for 3.5 years, so there might be some friendly chit-chat during a pause, but nothing disruptive. She never complained about these things until the boyfriend came into the picture.

Quote:

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

Secondly, if the singer's irresponsible behavior has already been going on for months (did I get that right?), then why hasn't someone - and I mean the leader - already dealt with it?

The only thing that has been going on for months has been the part where she wants to leave practice early or has some excuse and can't make it. Unfortunately, both singers have gotten into a rut where they want to leave as soon as we're done going over the songs that feature them. It's not our usual way of working and the bandleader has not yet adapted to this organizationally so that we usually have stuff we've missed that is only realized after the singer is gone.

Here's the way I see it. The band has not suddenly changed, but she now has a new boyfriend and a full-time summer job (she's a college student). She's lost a lot of the free time she previously had and she's trying shorten the amount of time the band cuts in to it (did I mention we only practice once a week from around 9-11 pm?). The long gig she was complaining about was also 3 hours away, so it was an all-day affair (we travel together on those).

I don't think she really wants to leave. She's trying to complain to make the band's time frame fit her new lifestyle or make her feel justified that she's been forced out.

**travep** · #13 07-10-2011, 07:46 AM

Sounds to me like she's doing the same time mgmt thing we all do...short one activity to allocate to another. Unfortunately, it sounds like maybe this 20 yo hasn't learned to respect others time. Unfortunately for you guys, this may be her training ground. Anyone of maturity eventually learns how to operate in groups or they don't have jobs, families or friends.

Sounds like you've got a couple of choices...the leader can talk it out with her and try to help along her maturation process or start looking for someone else. The only recommendation I would really make is to leave her boyfriend out of it. You mentioned it a couple of times. We all know what that's like & for those of us that are older, we know that these relationships can be more temporary at that age. However, this is her personal life. I wouldn't respond too positively if someone indicated that the band was more important than my family stuff. Even if changes on my part were required to keep the gig. I guess I'd want to let her know what's required but not to detail your observations of what she needs to change in her personal life...just my opinion...

armywalaby · #14 07-10-2011, 08:16 AM

There's a lot of good advice here. Bandleader definitely needs to step up and rules need to be defined about missing practice, etc. If she wasn't singing for seven hours, I don't see what the problem was. Maybe she needs a tambourine to smack around when she's not singing?

pkmoor · #15 07-10-2011, 08:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by travep

Sounds like you've got a couple of choices...the leader can talk it out with her and try to help along her maturation process or start looking for someone else. The only recommendation I would really make is to leave her boyfriend out of it. You mentioned it a couple of times. We all know what that's like & for those of us that are older, we know that these relationships can be more temporary at that age. However, this is her personal life. I wouldn't respond too positively if someone indicated that the band was more important than my family stuff. Even if changes on my part were required to keep the gig. I guess I'd want to let her know what's required but not to detail your observations of what she needs to change in her personal life...just my opinion...

Bandleader and I both have wives and 2 kids and full-time day jobs - we're not asking her to pick band over relationships. But we do need to practice and considering we only ask 2 hours once a week, we're obviously not killing her. All-day gigs like the one mentioned before are not very often, but they do happen. I think it goes back more to your statement on maturity.

Bass Mule · #16 07-10-2011, 11:25 AM

Personally, I don't see a problem with your singer leaving rehearsal early if all the songs she's a part of are done. There's absolutely no reason for her to just hang out "just in case" you guys decide to work on something that includes her. Rehearsals should be organized enough where you know the order of the songs you're practicing. This is especially important when you have a large band.

When my band is just using rehearsal time to record, if I'm done with my bass parts, there is absolutely no reason I should have to stay, especially if we're running late into the night. There's no need for me to sit there, my gear already packed away, if we're only recording drums or vocals.

I know we're not hearing the whole story here, or at the very least, both sides of the story. I'm not trying to take the wind out of your sails, as I'm sure your concerns are valid. But if you take a step back and try to look at all sides (and set aside your own personal paradigms when doing so), and if you still think your concerns are valid and warrant action, then just fire her and be done with it.

Stumbo · #17 07-10-2011, 12:00 PM

She's got a new job and boyfriend. Her life has changed. Instead of being upfront about what she time she has for the band, she's being passive-aggressive about.

+1 on the band meeting to workout details of time management/committment with her. What's not acceptable is her ongoing complaining about other band members and making up/changing the rules as she goes. Either you work it out with her or she's done.

The BL's excuse for not handling the situation is bogus. Actually the BL is the problem, not her. He's created the situation. The situation may get to the point where other members quit. Imagine if all the band members acted as she does. What that be acceptable?

4StringShooter · #18 07-10-2011, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pkmoor

I'm in a wedding band. Last year our female vocalist at the time (married, mid-30's) started to get flaky. She started to question everything and made a fuss that we weren't paid for showcases (we didn't know she was having financial issues at the time). The bandleader eventually brought in a 2nd female vocalist because he was afraid she was going to bolt soon and she actually quit over it.

New vocalist did great for the next year (single, early-20's). A few months ago she got a boyfriend and now it feels like the same thing all over again. This one hasn't given us a full practice in months - she either can't make it or has to leave early. She's been complaining about how other members goof-off or talk between songs during practice, while she has done nothing to curb her texting or phone game-laying when she's not singing.

She's also been whining about a gig we did a few weeks ago where we played a 7-hour reception at a private residence. It was supposed to be a 1 hour cocktail (usually done by our guitard and sax player) and a 5-hour reception (full band), but since it was a private residence (and we knew they would tip well) we gave them an extra hour. We also did the cocktail as full band because everything was all in one place. Now she's crying that it was very unprofessional to have her do 7 hours. She never complained before when the guitard would do 7 hours (ceremony, cocktail and 5 hour reception). I'm also annoyed that she's bantering about the word "unprofessional" when she was a 35 minutes late arriving for our road-trip to the gig (holding everyone up). She also disappeared for another half hour at the end of the gig (again, holding everyone else up). She also got fairly lit while performing (although not to the point where it impacted her ability perform, but you could tell on the way home she was drunk).

Anyone else have to deal with a similar situation? The bandleader is basically the one in charge since he handles all the financing and he's too afraid to do anything for fear she'll leave. As a performer, she's the finest we've ever had, but I feel she's already gone and is waiting for something to quit over. I just hate dealing with all the drama while waiting for them to straighten up or leave.

I'm dealing with the same thing on TWO planes at the same time. We are a Dance Band/Celtic/ Oktoberfest Band. Very diversified on music types. Normally, we are a 4 pc Band, but grow to 5 when doing the Oktoberfest thing (I know it sounds corny, but pays VERY big )
Our Sax player came from an Orchestra setting, and I've been working with him to " Combo-fy " him.
Lately, our Drummer, and the Sax player have not been giving any " dedication " as I call it, to the Band. When we rehearse, I will lay a list of rock tunes WE need to learn.I will then tell them they need to " listen, and jam along" with recordings of said songs. When they show up the following week for practice, They don't know ****. I'm growing very frustrated with things, And I'M ready to" Bail".

S.

skwee · #19 07-10-2011, 12:33 PM

I'm agreeing with the sentiment that rehearsal organization should be worked out so no one has to stick around. I also agree that it's time for band meeting, and the above concerns should be voiced for sure. I can vouch for the fact that a seven hour gig for a vocalist is completely out of the question, and personally wouldn't allow it to happen on my throat (and I've been doing this for a living for a decade and a half). Your vocalist does need to come clean about the lateness and attitude, but I'm confident that you can work it all out. Just give everyone a chance to calmly state what they think the issues are, and then come up with solutions. Good luck, y'all.

pkmoor · #20 07-10-2011, 01:03 PM

Thanks all, for the feedback. Since the bandleader basically owns the band, it's not a band meeting type situation, so he'll just have to address the situation with her. He doesn't want to have to replace her (since clients are most concerned with the vocalists he doesn't want to make a change if he can avoid it) so he's willing to try to work to get her straightened out. Thanks to all the back and forth here I was at least able to make sure he has a clear picture of the issue to work toward a resolution (he and I have played together off an on for almost 18 years, so he usually asks me for input).