band relations and newly-married members

[led3]

Originally Posted by Flyingfrets

We've all been married so long, our wives are glad to be rid of us for a few hours a week!

this is a good point as well. we do practice in his basement. perhaps this adds to his distraction at times. (and the wife has only ever bothered us one time, and that was because she was baking... a welcome distraction in my opinion.)

would it make sense to suggest a move in rehearsal venue?

[Factor88]

Originally Posted by led3

No, I do not set other people's priorities; however, I do feel that it is necessary for other people to honor commitments outside their first priority when they commit to them without duress.

So, this guy actually had a verbal or written agreement with the rest of you to book x gigs per year, host x rehearsals per year, practice x hours per week on his instrument, and write or help write x songs per year?

[led3]

Originally Posted by Factor88

So, this guy actually had a verbal or written agreement with the rest of you to book x gigs per year, host x rehearsals per year, practice x hours per week on his instrument, and write or help write x songs per year?

you're just being argumentative, so i will not even dignify this with a proper response.

[johnson79]

It sounds like you guys are on point by having a conversation about it. Getting things out in the open and getting everyone on the same page is a good move.

Who knows, you guys may just need to reschedule things, or work differently for it to work out. There's nothing wrong with that.

Good luck!

[two fingers]

Originally Posted by longfinger

That sounds like normal growing up. Did the two of you do the same thing when you got married and did not notice? Perhaps, now it's his turn?

Now that you're all married, it is time to think of the band not as a young man's fantasy, but of as mature man's reality. The 'band experience' has to change and grow up to so that it is still relevant to you all now. It won't be the same experience as it was 10 years ago. That's no longer relevant.

Get together, the three of you and talk about it. Find out what you all really want and need right now. (What you want, and what you really want, are not often the same.) Then work with that.

Very VERY well put. This is a perfect answer to me. It's the grownup way to handle things. Just sit and talk it out. Just let the guy tell you what's on his mind and the other two of you will just have to decide if you can live with that.

[led3]

Originally Posted by johnson79

It sounds like you guys are on point by having a conversation about it. Getting things out in the open and getting everyone on the same page is a good move.

Who knows, you guys may just need to reschedule things, or work differently for it to work out. There's nothing wrong with that.

Good luck!

thanks. so far we have had a very productive conversation on the matter and have already taken a couple of steps to rebalance priorities among all members and have set up another time in the next week to fill in goals for this year (and beyond) and set up responsibility areas for all members. a positive experience so far...

[the yeti]

Originally Posted by Factor88

Are you saying that him getting married is no excuse for his priorities to change, because you and the other members are married and found a way to manage band and personal priorities? If so, read on (if not, my comments don't apply):

YOU do not get to set priorities for other people. Just because you and a couple others managed to have married relationships that did not affect the band, does not mean that someone else should be judged for not following suit. His change in priorities may be negative in terms of its effect on the band, but might be positive in terms of the overall effect on his own life.

taking this at face value, i think that makes great sense but consider this: if his change in priorities have a negative effect on the band it is certainly within the rights of the band to say "you are negatively impacting our agenda, either modify your current course or let's seperate". fwiw i'm all for the guy's happy married life, but not at the groups expense.

i do think there's a decent chance he's not even aware he's changing. well, just read the post about talking with him so clearly i have no clue what i'm talking about...

[wideload]

Relax. Wait two years. He'll be back. And then you will find out if his wife is supportive of her husband's talent, or if you have a lot of new songs centering on bitterness and resentment.

[johnson79]

Originally Posted by wideload

Relax. Wait two years. He'll be back. And then you will find out if his wife is supportive of her husband's talent, or if you have a lot of new songs centering on bitterness and resentment.

Have you read the posts? The dude didn't leave, nor is the wife ragging on him.

[Factor88]

Originally Posted by the yeti

taking this at face value, i think that makes great sense but consider this: if his change in priorities have a negative effect on the band it is certainly within the rights of the band to say "you are negatively impacting our agenda, either modify your current course or let's seperate". fwiw i'm all for the guy's happy married life, but not at the groups expense.

I don't disagree at all. What I was getting at in my first response was objecting to at least what I percieved as some smug sense of superiority on the part of the OP that other members of the band could maintain a "commitment" (whatever that means, but apparently the OP believes there can only be one interpretation of the word) while being married at the same time. If the OP and the rest of the band want to make an issue of it, or even fire the guy, it is perfectly within their rights. But it don't make them any better than the guy who merely decided for himself that he has more important things in his life now.

[led3]

Originally Posted by Factor88

I don't disagree at all. What I was getting at in my first response was objecting to at least what I percieved as some smug sense of superiority on the part of the OP that other members of the band could maintain a "commitment" (whatever that means, but apparently the OP believes there can only be one interpretation of the word) while being married at the same time. If the OP and the rest of the band want to make an issue of it, or even fire the guy, it is perfectly within their rights. But it don't make them any better than the guy who merely decided for himself that he has more important things in his life now.

"smug sense of superiority?" interesting... you couldn't be further off the mark. if i possessed this so-called "smug sense of superiority", i would not have required any opinions or any other validation from complete strangers. (and i'm not a lead singer, so i don't need the attention in the first place (snare hit) ).

the intent of this post was to get a broader understanding from other members who may have gone through a similar transition or have constructive opinions on the subject. one thing that was hit upon here is communication. in this particular case, this was the missing piece. without going into any details, things have already improved tenfold as a result of proper communication (yes, in less than 24 hours).

to factor88 only: i'm not certain why you feel the need to troll me on this board. i haven't done anything to you or started any beef with you and even agreed with you to a point before the ad hominem attacks (i.e., asking inflammatory questions about contracts; definition of "commitment", "smug sense of superiority".) i was looking for help and advice because i wanted to keep our band together. this situation has happened ever since there were bands and i wanted perspective. i asked a simple question and looked for advice. i didn't ask to be trolled. so, respectfully, find another bridge or choose to be a productive participant in this discussion. thanks.

[wideload]

Originally Posted by johnson79

Have you read the posts? The dude didn't leave, nor is the wife ragging on him.

If he's not as "bought in" to the group as he was before he found true love, then he's "gone". Not left, just not as committed, which seems to be the main concern. Just for fun, let's revisit this in two years and see if I'm right. Have an excellent day!

[mellowinman]

Being in the scene as long as I have, I've known a number of "band women" who have this curious habit:

They are very attracted to men who play in bands. They see a man acting like a big star on stage, playing his instrument, singing, whatever, and they just HAVE to be with him. Then, the very next thing that happens is, they don't want him on that stage anymore, so they can have him all to themselves.

Warning to young players: NEVER get involved with one of these women! There is something seriously wrong with them.

Here is my secret, and don't think I'm saying you want to be like me, at all, because you probably don't, and you didn't ask, and this will probably bore you but:

I only date women who are involved in creative pursuits such as music, art, etc, or at least make sure that I start dating a woman BEFORE she has ever seen my band, or even tell her I'm in one.

Because those "band women" can be scary, man.

SCARY.

[MarkMgibson]

Originally Posted by mellowinman

Being in the scene as long as I have, I've known a number of "band women" who have this curious habit:

They are very attracted to men who play in bands. They see a man acting like a big star on stage, playing his instrument, singing, whatever, and they just HAVE to be with him. Then, the very next thing that happens is, they don't want him on that stage anymore, so they can have him all to themselves.

Warning to young players: NEVER get involved with one of these women! There is something seriously wrong with them.

Here is my secret, and don't think I'm saying you want to be like me, at all, because you probably don't, and you didn't ask, and this will probably bore you but:

I only date women who are involved in creative pursuits such as music, art, etc, or at least make sure that I start dating a woman BEFORE she has ever seen my band, or even tell her I'm in one.

Because those "band women" can be scary, man.

SCARY.

Very good advice in my opinion. Those sort of chicks, very scary indeed.

[mjac28]

Originally Posted by longfinger

That sounds like normal growing up. Did the two of you do the same thing when you got married and did not notice? Perhaps, now it's his turn?

Now that you're all married, it is time to think of the band not as a young man's fantasy, but of as mature man's reality. The 'band experience' has to change and grow up to so that it is still relevant to you all now. It won't be the same experience as it was 10 years ago. That's no longer relevant.

Get together, the three of you and talk about it. Find out what you all really want and need right now. (What you want, and what you really want, are not often the same.) Then work with that.

+1 best advice

[Kmonk]

Originally Posted by bluewine

I agree that marriage is now his priority.

Man, I am lucky. All spouses are integral part of my band.

One spouse sets up runs sound and light's, the other spouses do all of the marketing and sell merchandise and pay us. The spouses have been at every gig for the past year. And were a busy band.

I've never seen anything like it.

I'm the only single one in the band. No way could I ever meet a woman that support me that way.

Blue

You're lucky that having spouses involved is working for your band. My experience has been that when a band member's spouse is involved things get ugly very quickly. I prefer to not have anyone's spouse involved at all.

I am lucky that my wife is very supportive and enjoys the fact that I play. Even when I do tours and am gone for several months she has been fine with it. She knows that I enjoy playing and is happy as long as the mortgage and bills are paid.

[hernameisrio]

I dumped a jealous, possessive, controlling boyfriend in part because he always seemed to think that I would someday leave him for the drummer. It's always the drummer. Yeah, I don't know either. :-P But worse yet, he truly felt threatened by my successes and abilities in general. If HE had something to do with it, fine, but otherwise...forget it! The funny thing is, he bought a bass and can't play worth a $&@!. In hindsight, this explains a lot...

[ShoeManiac]

Wow. I'm just a bit taken aback by a complete lack of personal consideration for fellow bandmates in this thread.

People's lives change. Whether it's relationships or kids, or family concerns, etc. And sometimes there are things that trump music. I just finished taking paternity leave from my band for the past few months. I was upfront about it with the band, and still played some recording sessions for them. But I told them that for any gigs between early October and the beginning of 2013, I was on leave and wouldn't be available. They still played a few shows, but got a sub to take those on.

So, to the OP, I pose this question: would you ask for the same level of consideration from your bandmates if you were getting married, having kids, or the like? Or would you make your family feel like they're a secondary consideration?

[led3]

Originally Posted by ShoeManiac

Wow. I'm just a bit taken aback by a complete lack of personal consideration for fellow bandmates in this thread.

People's lives change. Whether it's relationships or kids, or family concerns, etc. And sometimes there are things that trump music. I just finished taking paternity leave from my band for the past few months. I was upfront about it with the band, and still played some recording sessions for them. But I told them that for any gigs between early October and the beginning of 2013, I was on leave and wouldn't be available. They still played a few shows, but got a sub to take those on.

So, to the OP, I pose this question: would you ask for the same level of consideration from your bandmates if you were getting married, having kids, or the like? Or would you make your family feel like they're a secondary consideration?

I'm not certain how much of the thread you actually read to get to this point. To be fair, I'll make an allowance for it and move forward.

Correct. People's lives change. In fact, when we started the band, all 3 members were single. The member in question from above was the 3rd member (of 3) to get married in the band. In fact, I was the 2nd member to get married, so I was in that exact situation. We missed exactly two rehearsals and then it was business as usual. This was communicated well in advance and we even squeezed in an impromptu show right before I got married. My wife understood; this is who she married and is completely supportative of my endeavors (and I am of hers).

The fact of the matter is, based on what you mentioned in your situation above, is that you communicated this upfront and often and worked through the change with minimal disruption. I clearly think that you did the right thing. In our case, it had nothing to do with him actually getting married (since we all are), it had to do with him not pulling his weight in the band as a result. Had he communicated that he needed time off or a rebalance in responsibilities, it would have easily been granted. Should the kid question come up (as I'm sure it will eventually), it will have to be handled via communication and proper balance of accountability.

I hope this answers the question for you.

[kjpollo]

Originally Posted by led3

I'm not certain how much of the thread you actually read to get to this point. To be fair, I'll make an allowance for it and move forward.

Correct. People's lives change. In fact, when we started the band, all 3 members were single. The member in question from above was the 3rd member (of 3) to get married in the band. In fact, I was the 2nd member to get married, so I was in that exact situation. We missed exactly two rehearsals and then it was business as usual. This was communicated well in advance and we even squeezed in an impromptu show right before I got married. My wife understood; this is who she married and is completely supportative of my endeavors (and I am of hers).

The fact of the matter is, based on what you mentioned in your situation above, is that you communicated this upfront and often and worked through the change with minimal disruption. I clearly think that you did the right thing. In our case, it had nothing to do with him actually getting married (since we all are), it had to do with him not pulling his weight in the band as a result. Had he communicated that he needed time off or a rebalance in responsibilities, it would have easily been granted. Should the kid question come up (as I'm sure it will eventually), it will have to be handled via communication and proper balance of accountability.

I hope this answers the question for you.

Great resolution here. You guys are handling this like mature adults-trying to get everybody on the same page, reassessing the way things used to be done vs how they will need to be modified.