Bands...Work Ethic...Guitar Player..Want Opinion

Already In Use · #1 11-09-2012, 06:41 PM

Here's the deal. I am in a position in a band where I am the one who knows the most about music(Thanks TB!). The drummer has put us together. We have a 49 year old guitar player who is just getting into it. He plays using tab. Doesnt know any theory, chord structure, notes on his fret board, etc...Cant play from fake chord sheets.

Over the last month I have been offering him help so we can play songs(currently cant). I told him we would work with him as long as he does the work...Unsuccessfully offered my time and music room to him to help. No real luck.

So tonight he comes out and again cant play anything...all of which was pre arranged via email with links to the tunes and attached lyrics allowing the vocalist to set the key. No Go. He tells me he'll look up the tab and be ready next time...same as the last 4 weeks. We told him he needs to be able to understand the music, chords and progressions so we can all be on the same page.

Said guitar player says he doesnt show up for music lessons and will do what he likes. That keeps us from playing music...he can play Wild Thing and Louie Louie. So I went off and feel bad about it now...But how much is enough?

I load a van with PA...bring the other guitarist/vocalist and drive 80 miles RT. The 3 of us left played for 4 hours on and off and had a great time after he left.

Being new at band leader, is it OK to go off on somebody that wont do the work and holds everybody else back?

Thanks...Confused a bit and feeling crummy.

Peace

jondog · #2 11-09-2012, 07:04 PM

It's ok, just fire him and audition replacements.

lowfreq33 · #3 11-09-2012, 07:47 PM

Yes it's ok... If it was my band he wouldn't have made it past the second rehearsal. Inexcusable to waste people's time like that.

bassgod0dmw · #4 11-09-2012, 07:54 PM

I wouldn't play with him at all.

Winfred · #5 11-09-2012, 09:10 PM

You shouldn't have "gone off" on him, just my opinion, but there's never a reason to do that. You do have to let him go though.

Guitar players are everywhere, and 90% of them are bad musicians. Start looking, and you'll find another one. Just turn over any rock...

Good luck!

Kmonk · #6 11-09-2012, 09:12 PM

No reason to "go off" on him. Just let him go in a professional manner and find a replacement.

Violen · #7 11-09-2012, 09:16 PM

Some free advice:

1. He who owns the van, runs the band.
2. He who owns the PA, Runs the band.
3. He has had plenty of time. Fire him and find someone else.

Corbeau · #8 11-09-2012, 09:53 PM

I wouldn't bother with that guitarist. If he's not prepared to apply himself in the same way as everyone else, then he should be let go.

bluewine · #9 11-10-2012, 02:48 AM

Give him a call and let him know it's not working out ( he already knows that ) and the band is going in a different direction.

Question, why would your drummer bring someone in that's learning to play guitar at 49 years of age, no band experience, doesn't seem to know how to be in a band with poor work ethic?

blue

Akami · #10 11-10-2012, 03:27 AM

I think if you find a decent guitar player (or any other band member), they may or may not be worth some extra effort. However, this guy who can only learn songs by looking at tabs and can only play Wild Thing and Louie, Louie (variations of the same type of chord sequence), is not a guitar player - he's a wannabe who owns a guitar.

Get a guitar player and stop hanging out with this time wasting air guitar hero.

Flyingfrets · #11 11-10-2012, 08:47 AM

When we were putting this band together (July/August 2011), we were very specific with the material (Beatles covers).

We didn't expect those auditioning to know the entire catalog, but we did expect them to know 5 - 7 songs (a couple from each period). We took (and take) what we do seriously & expected the same of prospective members. Only remember one guy showoing up totally unprepared. Said he'd "wing it." Decent guitar player, but we weren't looking to play "shred" versions of classics. He knew and we didn't even need to tell him it was a "no sale." We finished the run through & he said, "well, that was different...but that's not what you're looking for, is it?"

If you're looking for more than some jam band fun with friends & have real goals for this band, you already know he's holding you back.

Oh, and FWIW, one of our guitar players (also our vocalist) doesn't read a note of music (but he does know his way around a guitar). He only needs to hear something once or twice to play it almost note for note. But in fairness, guys like that are fairly rare.

tycobb73 · #12 11-10-2012, 08:55 AM

For me, work ethic forgives a lot. But if he doesn't have work ethic....

Already In Use · #13 11-10-2012, 08:58 AM

Thanks everybody. I do feel bad about going off..I'll chalk that up to a learning experience. We did have another player who can play and sing and a good lead on a 2nd experienced guitarist. I must temper my reactions to folks and behave in a professional manner. To answer the question above regarding the drummers choice..They like each other and are friends. We'll be back at it next week! Peace!

obimark · #14 11-10-2012, 09:17 AM

You can have 1-2 people in a band who are a little better playing level than the others, but when you try something that is grossly mismatched it will never work.

Sort of like these guitards who think they can take over on bass, since A: It's Easy. B: They already know guitar.

Anyone too far above, or too far below the average level of the band will spell disaster most times.

sobie18 · #15 11-10-2012, 10:10 AM

I would can him. Hurry up and cut your losses...

However, with the holidays coming up, I would buy him Guitar Tab White Pages as a stocking stuffer...

RustyAxe · #16 11-10-2012, 12:56 PM

I have to ask ... did the guitarist get the position simply because he owned a guitar? A band member who doesn't even know his instrument is like tits on a bull ... useless. Either resign yourselves to giving free music lessons every time you play, or find someone who plays guitar. Failing that, find a new band. Really.

Even when I was a kid I wouldn't waste my time with people who liked the idea of being "in a band" (hey, it's cool) but had little to no musical training or talent. As an old coot (I'm 58) I'm still of the mind that one learns one's instrument BEFORE joining a band.

As for being a band leader, well it's self descriptive. There's no need for "going off" on anyone. Make your expectations clear, as well as the consequences of not meeting them. Then dispassionately do what needs to be done.

Already In Use · #17 11-10-2012, 01:18 PM

You make very good points Rusty. Thanks...make loads of sense...I like the application of the term....dispassionately. Peace!

Already In Use · #18 11-10-2012, 01:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by obimark

You can have 1-2 people in a band who are a little better playing level than the others, but when you try something that is grossly mismatched it will never work.

Sort of like these guitards who think they can take over on bass, since A: It's Easy. B: They already know guitar.

Anyone too far above, or too far below the average level of the band will spell disaster most times.

Right on!

Peace

bluewine · #19 11-10-2012, 01:32 PM

If I have this story strait, it was the drummer that brought this guitar player into the band. Bringing someone in with no experience is questionable.

Have you had any thoughts where this might not be the right band for you?

What are you looking for in a band?

Blue

Already In Use · #20 11-10-2012, 01:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bluewine

If I have this story strait, it was the drummer that brought this guitar player into the band. Bringing someone in with no experience is questionable.

Have you had any thoughts where this might not be the right band for you?

What are you looking for in a band?

Blue

This project is a side bar for me. A place I can play rock, blues, jazzy blues. A fresh start up.

What am I looking for? Players that are willing to work to make decent music and are having a ton of fun doing it.

I am also looking to build on my experience and move forward, both as an individual and as a group. I do recall experienced players helping me along the way. When faced with that I want to offer help. I dont want to waste time with players that wont make progress.

I'm in a trio. The band leader gives us homework/study material, etc..We are expected to do the work. NP as far as I see it.

As noted in previous posts by me, band associations have been laborious, frustrating and time consuming. I am trying to learn how, what and when to and when and what not to.

The drummer was the 1st one to ask if we should let this guitar player go. I was the one suggesting more time until this past session on Friday.

Having this resource is extremely valuable. Thanks a bunch for your replies.

Peace!