Bands...Work Ethic...Guitar Player..Want Opinion

[Already In Use]

Just to clarify...sorry...

We had the tab talk..I dont care as long as a player can play from/ or convert to tab our fake chord charts until they learn the tunes. Before our last session, charts were emailed to all. I also printed copies for everybody. This guy did not bring tab, did not bring the charts, would not take the ones I printed and also denied the use of others reading glasses because he "forgot" his. He is the one who opened up with a rant about our sessions being music lessons for him.

He could have brought his tab and played along..Sorry for not including all the back door drama. Thanks for the reply!

I agree that despite what others say and do...I own my behavior and should not have gone off. The drummer has spoken to this guy. He wont be back.

Peace! Play on.....

[Akami]

Originally Posted by Already In Use

I agree that despite what others say and do...I own my behavior and should not have gone off. The drummer has spoken to this guy. He wont be back.

Peace! Play on.....

You most definitely had a right to go off and everyone here also has their point at which they'll do the same. For some it may be low, like he's late and for others it may be high, like he's hitting on your girlfriend or steals your bass to buy crack.
No need to apologize for getting upset with someone who lies about his abilities and won't apologize for wasting everyone's time and also refuses to put in any effort.

Reminds me of some conversations with drummers over the years. Back when drum machines first came out a few drummers mentioned to me that they'd soon be out of work as a result. None of the drummers who ever said that lacked for work because of drum machines, but thankfully the ones that did lose work were the ones who really weren't drummers in the first place.

This guy is out because he's not a guitar player and he has no care in the world that will make him fulfill his responsibility to apply himself in a team situation. Good riddance.

[MarkMgibson]

I've dealt with band members who were drunks (I was guilty of that myself for a time), addicts, egomaniacs, dictators, AC/DC fans, and the list goes on. I could never abide laziness though; it's the single most infuriating trate to deal with in a band. No matter how good they are, if you know someone is going to stuff you about, save yourself a lot of grief and get rid of them.

[gordon5377]

Originally Posted by lokikallas

Practice is what you do at home to learn the songs. Rehearsal is getting it down as a band. If someone isn't willing to practice they shouldn't bother to show up to rehearsal.

Really. Like. This.

[bluewine]

I point my finger at your drummer.

I'm sure he knew the guy wasn't a fit.

Blue

[Already In Use]

Originally Posted by bluewine

I point my finger at your drummer.

I'm sure he knew the guy wasn't a fit.

Blue

You're correct...IMO. Cant hide the obvious too long.

In the Trio I play in our guitar player/vocalist has been playing for decades...knows zero music theory aside from how to play chords off of fake chord charts or by ear. He's good..it works very well. That band leader has a masters in music and she schools both of us every session...we listen and improve..must practice...do homework...etc.

Thanks yet again for the encouraging observations as this situation is new for me. Impartial feedback is very helpful from the been there done that folks!

Peace!

[MarkMgibson]

Yeah, the amount of theory someone knows or doesn't know isn't really important. So long as they are prepared put the effort in. Best of luck finding a replacement, and with the band in general.

[Already In Use]

Thanks man! This second project is a "just for fun" release to play tunes my trio isnt doing..Next GTG is this Friday. Should be much better. Peace!

[jandscotten]

This is the major reason why I won't join a band, at least not for a while. I'm in the current guitarist's shoes, sort of. I just can't do much more than the very basics. I'm returning to playing after a 2 decade layoff, and wasn't that good to begin with.
What gets me is the "gift" you've offered him...man I'd be soaking up every "free" lesson I could get...

[Akami]

Originally Posted by jandscotten

This is the major reason why I won't join a band, at least not for a while. I'm in the current guitarist's shoes, sort of. I just can't do much more than the very basics. I'm returning to playing after a 2 decade layoff, and wasn't that good to begin with.
What gets me is the "gift" you've offered him...man I'd be soaking up every "free" lesson I could get...

You're obviously not the same as that guy, as you already know your shortcomings, which those guys were willing to deal with if he'd at least try.
You shouldn't hesitate to look for a situation because there's plenty of need for bass players and as long as everyone understands each others ability going in, it's a plus for everyone involved.

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by jandscotten

This is the major reason why I won't join a band, at least not for a while. I'm in the current guitarist's shoes, sort of. I just can't do much more than the very basics. I'm returning to playing after a 2 decade layoff, and wasn't that good to begin with.
What gets me is the "gift" you've offered him...man I'd be soaking up every "free" lesson I could get...

You could probably get some really good experience if you could find a " just for fun " band or "start up" originals project.

Blue

[MarkMgibson]

Originally Posted by jandscotten

This is the major reason why I won't join a band, at least not for a while. I'm in the current guitarist's shoes, sort of. I just can't do much more than the very basics. I'm returning to playing after a 2 decade layoff, and wasn't that good to begin with.
What gets me is the "gift" you've offered him...man I'd be soaking up every "free" lesson I could get...

Or look for people who just get together for regular jams. In the 35+ age group, there's lots of people who just play for fun due to work and family commitments.

[Already In Use]

Originally Posted by jandscotten

This is the major reason why I won't join a band, at least not for a while. I'm in the current guitarist's shoes, sort of. I just can't do much more than the very basics. I'm returning to playing after a 2 decade layoff, and wasn't that good to begin with.
What gets me is the "gift" you've offered him...man I'd be soaking up every "free" lesson I could get...

Get out and play! I've found that most players will help if you do the work and have passion. Dont be turned off by this example. Most folks would jump at the chance to improve..this one guy was the lone one out, wandering thru the musical wilderness.

This site alone will get you up and running pretty quick. It worked for me as I returned to music about 4 years ago after many years away from it.

Play...play ..play and play some more..Before you know it folks will be seeking you out! Peace...

[two fingers]

Originally Posted by lowfreq33

Yes it's ok... If it was my band he wouldn't have made it past the second rehearsal. Inexcusable to waste people's time like that.

This. Your mistake is not going off on the guy. It was working with him to begin with. You don't have a band. You have a few guys who hang out every week or so. Until you get rid of him and get a real guitar player, you WON'T have a band. End of story. You can convince yourself otherwise and that may make you feel better, but the fact (you don't have a band) still remains.

[Already In Use]

Thanks Two..this is a morphing project that is not an official "band" per say..but is heading in that direction. It may or may not develop..the no worker is gone...the new guy is good. I may have casually used the term band in prior posts. Curious? Is the term band subjective or is it clearly defined? When is that group of a few guys/gals hanging out a few times per week become a band? Peace!

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by Already In Use

Thanks Two..this is a morphing project that is not an official "band" per say..but is heading in that direction. It may or may not develop..the no worker is gone...the new guy is good. I may have casually used the term band in prior posts. Curious? Is the term band subjective or is it clearly defined? When is that group of a few guys/gals hanging out a few times per week become a band? Peace!

" Band" is a relative term it can mean anything you want it to mean.

A band can be a full time working "play for pay" business operation or guys jamming in the basement once a month for fun.

Blue

[Stumbo]

Originally Posted by Already In Use

Here's the deal. I am in a position in a band where I am the one who knows the most about music(Thanks TB!). The drummer has put us together. We have a 49 year old guitar player who is just getting into it. He plays using tab. Doesnt know any theory, chord structure, notes on his fret board, etc...Cant play from fake chord sheets.

Over the last month I have been offering him help so we can play songs(currently cant). I told him we would work with him as long as he does the work...Unsuccessfully offered my time and music room to him to help. No real luck.

So tonight he comes out and again cant play anything...all of which was pre arranged via email with links to the tunes and attached lyrics allowing the vocalist to set the key. No Go. He tells me he'll look up the tab and be ready next time...same as the last 4 weeks. We told him he needs to be able to understand the music, chords and progressions so we can all be on the same page.

Said guitar player says he doesnt show up for music lessons and will do what he likes. That keeps us from playing music...he can play Wild Thing and Louie Louie. So I went off and feel bad about it now...But how much is enough?

I load a van with PA...bring the other guitarist/vocalist and drive 80 miles RT. The 3 of us left played for 4 hours on and off and had a great time after he left.

Being new at band leader, is it OK to go off on somebody that wont do the work and holds everybody else back?

Thanks...Confused a bit and feeling crummy.

Peace

IMO, if you "go off" on someone, you've waited too long to make a decision.

IME, if you're factual/logical based on your goals (always let your goals drive you ), set reasonable boundaries/limits/deadlines that people verbally or otherwise agree to ahead of time, and you stand by your decisions based on the outcome (rather than a personal agenda or power play), that's all that can be asked of a good BL.

If you haven't already, you may want to check out:
If I only knew then...

and more from my collection of links:
~Band management
Intro
Books
Book - "Bandalism"

How to handle a big band
Playing in a band w/o rehearsing
If your significant other is a non-musician
Democracy/dictatorship?
"Leading" a band
Band "funds"?
Why many bands fail

Originals Band "paying dues" playing for free
Is playing for "free" really "free"?

[Already In Use]

Cool thread Stumbo...Thank you...I'll work on reading through it...just got in...peace!

[bigswifty1]

Omg a guitarist, wherever will you find another one ?

Sack 'im

[kingmusicism]

Less crummy than firing someone for there personality. Really good players have been let go for not learning material as promised forever.