Doing your homework...

JazznFunk · #1 10-26-2008, 03:48 PM

Sorry gang... I need to vent to folks who will listen and understand. I've always prided myself on being a professional who does his homework in getting things done for a gig. I get (or make demos), write charts, and help with arrangements, and practice as much as possible on my own to get things worked out. I try to leave as little to chance as possible. Case in point... I recently started working again with a lovely singer/songwriter that I recorded a CD with last year. She did the Nashville thing for a while and has a great work ethic as well... we work well together and play well, and I have learned the quirks of her writing and style. She always wants to have other folks play with us on the gigs to fill out the sound, which I am all about, but I'm getting tired of folks being picked that can't deliver the goods and who fall short of the expectations I have for an ensemble player when they come highly recommended. I don't want to be a control freak, and I have trust in others to find acceptable players for a group, but I have found that in this particular situation unless I pick the musicians, the element of surprise is always there for something to go wrong. I'm tired of her picking musicians who are supposedly great players and then finding that they can't remember arrangements once the gig comes along, and who don't practice the tunes between rehearsals. I went to the trouble of writing charts, lugging my gear to record rehearsals, and then RE-RECORDING my bass parts on the demos of the tunes in question so that everyone would have something solid to learn from on a CD... and it made no difference except for ME learning the songs and making sure things were tight. If it had just been she and I doing the gig, it would have been great, but the wandering, aimless drumming on the gig ruined the vibe and there was no connection onstage. Does anyone have any advice, other than putting my foot down and insisting I pick the musicians for the project?

invader3k · #2 10-26-2008, 04:19 PM

Maybe try to approach it like you're trying to help her? Explain that since you play bass, you need musicians you can connect with onstage to help make her sound good while she's singing...offer to find players for the next gig, and see how it goes. Other than that, I'm not sure what to suggest.

fretlessman71 · #3 10-26-2008, 04:26 PM

First off, ask her if she was happy with the way the band sounded the last gig. If she says "sure", you're not going to get far with her, I fear. But if you can find a way to get her to agree that there's a problem, and then pose a solution, you might be able to simply suggest that you handle the musician hiring.

**Stumbo** · #4 10-26-2008, 04:30 PM

Why is she asking different musicians to fill out the sound. Why not just get a band together?

JazznFunk · #5 10-26-2008, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fretlessman71

First off, ask her if she was happy with the way the band sounded the last gig. If she says "sure", you're not going to get far with her, I fear. But if you can find a way to get her to agree that there's a problem, and then pose a solution, you might be able to simply suggest that you handle the musician hiring.

She wasn't happy with the way the band sounded, and she made it known to me afterward. She said that she wished she had done the gig with just the 2 of us instead of trying to have another person come in... but hindsight is 20/20. The fact is that he wasn't prepared, but the hope was that he would be.

JazznFunk · #6 10-26-2008, 06:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stumbo

Why is she asking different musicians to fill out the sound. Why not just get a band together?

That's the idea, but getting enough folks together for a steady band situation is difficult, especially when many folks are in many different bands. A steady lineup is hard to hang onto around here, but the professional guys can pull off a gig in the time we had... that's the point.

fretlessman71 · #7 10-26-2008, 07:23 PM

At least you know who not to hire now. If you've got charts, tunes, and lots of other things to make sure the people you hire are ready for the gig, really you've done all you can do other than being a little more involved in the hiring process.

peter6725 · #8 10-27-2008, 09:41 AM

China called, they want their wall back

JazznFunk · #9 10-27-2008, 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peter6725

China called, they want their wall back

If you're trying to imply that I'm attempting to assert too much control in this situation for the sake of being a heavy-handed dictator, please review the thread more closely. The last gig was crap because of this drummer's ill-preparedness. We have done gigs in the past where I have recommended and hired the musicians that I knew to be well-practiced and on top of things, and the gigs were great. That wasn't the case in this situation, and I'm tired of her picking musicians that can't cut it for her music or the performances in question, though I know she is a good musician herself and she knows what she wants to hear in her band's performances. I want the band to sound good and I know I can help make that happen... how does that make me a dictator? Shall I continue to sit back and let the gigs sound like crap when I know I can help the situation? Is that what you'd do?

fretlessman71 · #10 10-27-2008, 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peter6725

China called, they want their wall back

Igor called; he wants his brain back!

JK dude. Just where WERE you going with that?

invader3k · #11 10-27-2008, 11:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by peter6725

China called, they want their wall back

What an odd and out of place comment.

DERECOLA · #12 10-27-2008, 12:59 PM

You can join my band,I need more people like u....

DERECOLA · #13 10-27-2008, 01:08 PM

You can join my band,I need more people like u....

Jazzman23 · #14 10-28-2008, 01:00 AM

man up and tell her

JazznFunk · #15 10-28-2008, 01:01 AM

Follow up... we had a great conversation about the gig today and she agrees that the next gig will be different... different (or no) drummer, and a guitarist of my choice who I play with in another project already. She's no dummy... she wants the band to sound great, and she was on the same wavelength as I was for sure. I love it when people want to work together to make things the best they can be.

**Stumbo** · #16 10-28-2008, 01:06 AM

How about hiring only drummers that you've heard before (live or otherwise)?

Slax · #17 10-28-2008, 01:09 AM

Great to hear!

Hopefully you can find a drummer and guitarist to join in the for the long term and then not have to worry about bad and flaky musicians.

JazznFunk · #18 10-28-2008, 01:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Stumbo

How about hiring only drummers that you've heard before (live or otherwise)?

That's what I was trying to get at with the original post... I'd never heard this guy and she hired him based on her knowledge of his playing. I placed the trust in her evaluation of him that he could cut it. Unfortunately, he didn't meet expectations, on my end or on hers. :-/

Munjibunga · #19 10-28-2008, 01:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JazznFunk

Does anyone have any advice, other than putting my foot down and insisting I pick the musicians for the project?

You answered your own question and didn't even know it.

fretlessman71 · #20 10-28-2008, 09:04 AM

What was it Chet Baker used to say about drummers again...?