Drum machine live?

nsmar4211 · #1 03-30-2008, 08:07 PM

So my band is having a heck of a time finding a committed (to a group) drummer.......and thus can't get as many gigs as we like. My guitarist made a suggestion that my first thought was to trash... that we program a drum machine and play with that.
My first instinct was, I'm not playing with stock drum loops. Then he tells me he has an input pad...and if I wanted to I could program the parts I want......

But, isn't that against the whole idea of doing it live? He made the point that the audiences we'll play for (in clubs/bars) aren't musicians, they don't care where the drum sounds come from.... What do you guys think? Anyone do it?

ImaStupidBaby · #2 03-30-2008, 08:12 PM

Ween did it for years, and they got pretty popular with just two guys.

It can be done, you just have to rock extra hard because you're lacking a drumar

bassplayinggirl · #3 03-31-2008, 04:49 AM

Our new drummer, after sitting in with us for one session, has asked to listen to us rehearse with a drum machine set for the sound we like (more or less) so he can get a feel for what we want. We've been an acoustic trio for years, and were always afraid to perform with electronic drums, even though we usually sound better when we use them. I believe it's mostly a matter of stupid pride.

infamousxtopher · #4 03-31-2008, 09:55 AM

i was in a band that did it for years, we never had one complaint. now we have a drummer but play to a backing track with some electronics and synth parts that we don't have enough people to cover live, there's no shame in it, and it can really fill out the sound. just rock out and no one will care.

Drifta · #5 03-31-2008, 10:01 AM

I gigged witha guitarist and a drum machine he was running sampled loops off some vinyl he recorded into his MPC. it was pretty dope, we just had some sick break-beat drum samples and were jamming out. It was on a whim and we pulled it off nicel.y

roberthelpus · #6 03-31-2008, 11:44 AM

Did it in the mid 80's and thought it was great for a minute,and then got really tired of being so constricted by it.

lefty · #7 03-31-2008, 12:16 PM

i play with a piano player and he loves his drum machine, and i hate it. i think when we do latin tunes it's ok, but we really don't need it with swing tunes and ballads.
for rock i really think you should have a live drummer.
just my 2

bongomania · #8 03-31-2008, 12:27 PM

I would only do it if you are willing to work it. By that I mean use the electronic-ness as a strength, not a weakness. Buy, download, or have somebody program you some "dope" beats, some really strong out-there DJ rough stuff that will make people dance or bob their heads or view you as an electro-mood-band like Portishead.

IOW if you use a drum machine just to replace a drummer for "normal" rock or jazz, it will probably suck- both for you and for the audience. But if you play to its strengths and take on an electro/techno/modern/dope vibe for the whole band, then people will love it.

Jimmyplaysabass · #9 03-31-2008, 12:36 PM

All i can say is get a real drummer

The machine can't think for itself and that really adds up

ric1312 · #10 03-31-2008, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by nsmar4211

So my band is having a heck of a time finding a committed (to a group) drummer.......and thus can't get as many gigs as we like. My guitarist made a suggestion that my first thought was to trash... that we program a drum machine and play with that.
My first instinct was, I'm not playing with stock drum loops. Then he tells me he has an input pad...and if I wanted to I could program the parts I want......

But, isn't that against the whole idea of doing it live? He made the point that the audiences we'll play for (in clubs/bars) aren't musicians, they don't care where the drum sounds come from.... What do you guys think? Anyone do it?

The drum sounds can sound really good. Even a relatively cheap one has good sounds. What really matters if if you can program it to be convincing for your band and not sound like a robot. That is a good programmed drum maching should sound more like a drummer recorded drums for you.

I know a guy that does just that. He play drums, guitar and bass and pre recorded the drums and the bass. Him and his wife play out and sing and play guitar over the pre recordings.

I think to make a drum maching sound good live you might want to make sure you have a good sub for the kick. If you run a drum maching through the same PA speakers as the other instruments it's going to sound weak and piped in.

Ric5 · #11 03-31-2008, 12:56 PM

I used to live in Southeast Michigan and there is a band there that will play any cheesy gig for very low money.The guitar player had a long zztop beard. The whole band pretty much makes what one player should expect to make ... (I won't mention the name of the band) ... Anyway this band had trouble keeping drummers so they eventually went with a drum machine. It further cheapened the already cheap experience or seeing this band. Have you ever seen a band do a Zeplin number with a drum machine. It is kinda of funny and tragic at the same time. It makes you look forward to the next time you hear elevator music.

On the flip side I have a drum machine in my studio that is great for getting song ideas put down on a demo track.

msquared · #12 03-31-2008, 01:39 PM

There are already some good responses on this thread. I will add that there are a lot of acts who play with a real drummer along to loops and it works really well (think Peter Gabriel and other pop-ish groups). It can be done very well and tastefully if you're willing to put some time into it. Finding someone with experience in this area (such as hip hop beat producers) may benefit you greatly if you can find one who is willing and able to work in your genre.

One thing you might consider is having a real drummer record some tracks for you and then playing to the prerecorded stuff. No need to drag anything more complex than a CD player or mp3 player with you at that point and you have tracks which "breathe" and have nuance, which is hard to pull off with a drum machine. You might even have the drummer lay down four or five good takes of each song so you can switch up your prerecorded drums.

stflbn · #13 03-31-2008, 01:42 PM

Not sure how tech savvy you are, but Ableton Live is capable of some very nice programmed loop based things. Part of it is setup specifically for more of a Live playing situation.

jgroh · #14 03-31-2008, 01:51 PM

I am in the same boat...we are having issues finding a good drummer as well and I have contemplated using a machine. I have already programmed the drum parts to my originals in GarageBand and trust me, they sound real. I started out with some basic sample beats and arranged the notes so it really does sound like a real drummer (minor mistakes and all). I would love a kick ass drummer for real but its been months and no dice. Still thinking about it though...

bassandbeyond · #15 03-31-2008, 02:09 PM

Obviously there is nothing better than a real, live good drummer. But it's amazing how rare truly great drummers seem to be, and at least you can count on the machine to keep good time!

If everybody else on stage is really coming up with the goods musically, then a band can sound quite good even with a drum machine. As others have said, taking time to program the songs properly will help, but what you will still find frustrating is the lack of dynamics, and the lack of spontaneous response from the machine.

JmJ · #16 03-31-2008, 02:13 PM

I once saw a band use a drum machine live.
They set it on a custom made pedestal with psychedelic graphics.
When they introduced the members of the band and gave the name of their drum machine it played a wicked solo!
Everybody in the place busted out laughing & the band looked quite pleased. If you can make it work go for it!

thefruitfarmer · #17 03-31-2008, 02:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jimmyplaysabass

"The machine can't think for itself"

....then it can't get drunk and start fights!!

Seriously, one problem that may occur is getting guitar (eg) players to follow the strict tempo of the machine. You can't jam with it - you have to follow it.

Joeykun · #18 03-31-2008, 02:24 PM

I was on tour back in the early 80's with a band and we were in The Camen Islands when our drummer took seriously ill. We had several shows lined up. We had a drum machine sent to us from Miami and we spent all day programming our set into it. It worked out well for what it was. We had some drummers in the crowd that said "Hey, I'll play the drums" So we did a few nights with sit in drummers. One night "Yellow Man" and his drummer sat in with us. That was a very fun night.

Anyways, back to the point. Yes, playing with a drum machine can be done. I practice with one all the time!

nsmar4211 · #19 03-31-2008, 04:58 PM

(if we could FIND a real drummer this wouldn't be a problem.... so find a drummer doesn't help any ! )

After thinking about it, I guess it really is a *pride* issue. I am originally a drummer and always swore I'd never play with a machine...and knowing how real drums are supposed to sound electronic ones will never sound "right".
Judging by responses, seems people do it though... so it can't be that badly frowned up. JmJ, that's a pretty cool idea (intro it) actually... we might have to steal it.
The concern of getting the guitarists to play right along with it is a real one and something they'd have to work on. But I gotta think after a few practices that would take care of itself. The sound being weak is another valid point.....wonder if we could run it through my bass amp until we get subs for the PA? Hrm.....
I'm not worried about the parts being sterile, I already volunteered to do programming. I am wondering if we can program in tempo changes, a couple of songs we purposely vary the tempo between the chorus and the verses to give it more energy, but it's a consistant variation.
I have a sinking feeling I'm about to learn more about drum machines than I ever wanted too......
I did see a showband at a fair that was using a laptop to play the keyboard parts.... after looking for the keyboardist and wondering why the drummer always counted off the songs the same, i realized what that silver box was next to the drummer! Didn't sound bad though... they told me they had their part time keyboardist record the stuff for them and used that.
LOL Next thing you know we'll put the harmonies on a track too (since I can't sing harmony to save my tail!)....
Great ideas and points......keep em coming

IanStephenson · #20 03-31-2008, 06:15 PM

Consider recording the tracks from the machine to a CD. A drum machine has a lot of buttons to worry about when it screws up. A CD player just needs you to press play once per track. You can also take a backup CD.

Unless you've already got keyboards or other tech on stage, then there's little to be gained by having the actuall machine there.

Ian