The "I'm only in it for the money" club

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by fmoore200

Maybe his subsequent posts have been inflammatory, but when I first read the OP, I didn't think there was any ill intentions behind it.

The OP doesn't contradict any of his following posts, which IMO only serve to expand on what he's said in it.

[Brad Johnson]

Originally Posted by BobaFret

I think you'd be hard pressed to find a full-time musician that only played for money and had no real love for music. It's unpossible!

Apparently at least a couple of people said that in this thread according to the OP. I missed it... unless "only" doesn't mean what it usually means.

[Bassbubble11]

I play bass 'cause I love it. Writing music is all I really
need. I do love playing gigs as it gives you a sort a validation
and enables you to get your "art" out there. Honestly, I would
rather record than gig but gigging is still cool.

Judging you musicianship by the amount of "gigs' you play or the
amount of money that you make is lame. You know how many ******
bands with ****** bass players I have seen getting tons of gigs.

[bumperbass]

Originally Posted by Bassbubble11

I play bass 'cause I love it. Writing music is all I really
need. I do love playing gigs as it gives you a sort a validation
and enables you to get your "art" out there. Honestly, I would
rather record than gig but gigging is still cool.

Judging you musicianship by the amount of "gigs' you play or the
amount of money that you make is lame. You know how many ******
bands with ****** bass players I have seen getting tons of gigs.

Yeah that's so true. I've heard a lot of crappy bass players in bands playing 2-3 times a week.
When I took a new day job about ten years ago, this guy found out I was a weekend warrior and said "Do you play guitar?" I said "No, I play bass. I played guitar for a few years but switched". He said "Bass? How hard can that be? There's only four strings, right?" I had to do a fake laugh and get the heck away from him. I don't talk to him about the band anymore. I change the subject as quickly as I can.

[Renaissance]

For what it's worth, I think the OP got a raw deal in this thread.

[Russell L]

It has often been a good feeling to me to be a part of the music community, and to be a known artist in it. And I don't mean that egotistically, but rather that it is a feeling of having done well at something. A feeling of accomplishment, if you will. That I have made a lot of money at it takes nothing away from that feeling. And yet, I can still talk to the cosmos in the headphones back at home just for my soul, alone and payless, and very often. Why, that's where it all began, in my soul.

[Russell L]

Originally Posted by fdeck

To address the OP directly:

How many guys here judge their musicianship by the amount of "gigs' they do or the amount of money that they make? (like a competition or gauging themselves against players that don't play out often.)

Not my musicianship per se, but I use my gig income to gauge the health of the local scene, along with my own ability to keep myself in the market. I don't disparage players who gig infrequently or not at all. There are many ways to enjoy playing music, and I know that the business has had its ups and downs.

Does being up on a stage somehow "validate" your decision to make music?

I play because I enjoy playing, and I perform because I enjoy performing. With that said, I certainly get a morale boost from being able to hang with killer players on the bandstand, and bringing some pleasure to the audience. The bandstand is the place where I really find out what I have to work on in the woodshed.

How many play an instrument for the sole reason of performing in front of others?

For most of us, I imagine that bass is a naturally sociable instrument, like having a friendly dog who enjoys being around people and getting out for some exercise now and then. It gets lonesome and bored if it stays at home. For this reason, I think that bassists might be more likely than other players to lean towards gigging, and this just raises the likelihood of eventually confronting the issue of money.

How many do it because making music is what moves them?

How many think that it's fun / a hobby?

All of the above.

Really....... why such as strong focus on money?

Part of it is that for the genres that I play (mostly jazz) there is still a basic relationship between money, the caliber of the musicians involved, and the quality of the venue. Also, I feel that as a relatively affluent day jobber, I should be respectful to working pro's by following their rules regarding gig pay and working conditions.

I've been reading a book that includes some biographical material about JS Bach. While he was one of the most gifted musicians ever, he definitely expected to get paid, and was constantly trying to advance his career. He complained when his sidemen didn't get paid enough. He got into disputes with his employers over pay. During his era, it was a widely accepted social norm that a professional musician should be able to earn a living from music.

Pal, I think your post is exactly what the OP wanted each respondent to do with the questions, just gives a straight answer without wondering if the OP had some agenda. Too bad the original post came on awkwardly, and the OP's subsequent posts jumped in the flames with many others.

[Gaolee]

I'm only in it for the money. That's why I play bass. Bass players are godz who get paid a lot. Good thing I have a day job.

[nortonrider]

Originally Posted by Renaissance

For what it's worth, I think the OP got a raw deal in this thread.

Thanks.

I really expected to come back here and see that this thread had dropped onto the second page.
I guess a lot of you guys were not done piling on. (unjustified - I might add.)

I have learned a lot about many TB'ers from their posts in this thread.
that's it.... I've said enough.

[Brad Johnson]

I learned something too.

[tranquillum]

Having to make a living from music drove me from it,....now i do it for fun (and for little $) and are having a blast ...go figure "i'm not going to overthink it" just better keep the day job :-)

[ChrisB2]

Originally Posted by nortonrider

Thanks.

I really expected to come back here and see that this thread had dropped onto the second page.
I guess a lot of you guys were not done piling on. (unjustified - I might add.)

I have learned a lot about many TB'ers from their posts in this thread.
that's it.... I've said enough.

I was one of the first to give an innocent reply that simply answered your questions, which you did not comment on. Only once I made the (somewhat erroneous... my fault) statement "I only play for pay" did you respond to me, pulling that one phrase TOTALLY out of the context of my posts and saying "Thanks for the reply." That's when I got the distinct impression that I had been lured into inadvertently affirming some unstated prejudice... "duped."

If I'm wrong about that I'm sorry but... you haven't done a real good job of convincing me that I got the wrong impression. Not that you need to do that... you can look at me as a "bad guy" on here if you want, but at this point I don't think it's justified.

I will say that whether we're right or wrong I would agree you got treated a little harshly and I do apologize for my part in that.

Oh well, won't be the first time I made someone not like me...

[Russell L]

Off topic just a moment, if I may, I'd like to ask the OP if he rides a Norton. I'm a Harley rider myownself, but have ridden an old Norton Commando chopper WAY back. I love Nortons, BSAs, and Triumphs.

Ok, back to the grind.

[stagebanter]

Well, I just had a thought. If anyone really is only in it for the money, they probably won't be "in it" for very long at all, as bass playing requires thousands of hours and at least hundreds of dollars of investment before you see a single dime.

[fmoore200]

Originally Posted by Brad Johnson

The OP doesn't contradict any of his following posts, which IMO only serve to expand on what he's said in it.

When I initially read the OP, I read it as sarcastic, but in a humorous way. I guess that I have a similar sense of humor, so I read it that way. Maybe I was wrong.

Maybe if he would've added some emoticons instead of writing it "straight" it would have come across differently - not saying the outcome would've been different though

[Winterpegbass]

I generally expect to be paid to play.

I have a day job and I don't need the money but I want my music hobby to be self sustaining eg strings, gas, new equip, music books.

I'll do a couple of charity gigs/year eg kidney transplant, cancer (I've even done charity gigs for deaf kids).

I hate to do free gigs for a business that generates profits though. Once or twice a BL has insisted on this and that makes me rethink if I want to play with him/her.

[bassbully]

Originally Posted by nortonrider

Thanks.

I really expected to come back here and see that this thread had dropped onto the second page.
I guess a lot of you guys were not done piling on. (unjustified - I might add.)

I have learned a lot about many TB'ers from their posts in this thread.
that's it.... I've said enough.

I liked the post and support you and it. You know how TB is there are some who want just to cause trouble and others who if they don't agree will at least agree to disagree and discuss.

It's the net and I wont let anyone ruffle my feathers, nothing they say or do I really care about if it is negitive.

[phillybass101]

I play bass because:

I absolutely love the sound of the instrument.
I enjoy playing at home just as I do playing in front of an audience.
I have never justified my playing ability or level from the amount of money I've made.
I really do appreciate a sincere compliment as I have put much work into my playing.
I can play it better than others and worse than others. No fret here just see first comment.

I play for pay because:
I have reached that level of playing where I can get paid for it.
Gear and time spent for this investment is expensive so getting paid is nice.
Better paying gigs are really nice to have, especially when you get to this.
My pay has no connection to my musical gratification of being able to play and loving the sound of shaking walls and thunder.
If I am feeling I am being low balled. I get out of that situation. I quit a group recently for this reason and the band played often. My monthly calendar was Gigfull. I really miss playing for the people but I don't miss feeling the shame, and anger, and resentment of being low balled. When I see that group now, I feel sorry for the bass players because most of them are full time players and need that gig to help pay the bills.

I didn't turn full time pro because:

I didn't have it in me to make that sacrifice. It's kind of like deciding to be a priest.
I have friends who are full time pros who still live with their mothers or family members despite recording credits, world tours etc. I'm not built that way.
Being a great player is just that, being a great player. And it takes a lot of sacrifice and hard work. I like where I am as a player and not having to look for that next gig despite my most recent great piece of work.
I have great admiration and respect for the person who earns their living just through music. I just have never been that brave but that choice I highly commend for those who can pull it off.

For a lot of us it began simply because we love bass and no ego was involved.

[eb3mike]

Getting back into music after a 35 year layoff making money... I picked the 69 EB3 back up after several years of retirement and realizing my golf index would never get below 5. Jammed around with some locals for the fun of it and it took two years but finally hooked up with a working cover band and have played 12 paid gigs over the last 8 months. I thought I was playing for the fun of it until we were shorted a couple hundred by a bar owner a month ago. I use the bar stool at rehearsal.
Had a 67 Atlas in the mid 70's and currently own a 70 BSA Firebird.

[two fingers]

OP, the premise of your question came across as judgmental, that's all. Many who play for "the love of music" and would walk through fire to play music think that those of us who play for pay are "not artists" or have "sold out". Even if you didn't mean it that way, any line of questions along that premise will be interpreted that way (especially on the interwebs when we don't have the advantage of facial expression, vocal inflections, etc).

Plus, these days making a profit here in the states have become "evil" in the media. So many of us who make decent money ore a little edgy and defensive about having to "justify" success to others all the time.

Lighten up. It's just a forum. Sorry if you got flamed. Even more sorry if I contributed to it. Cheers.