The "making it band syndrome"

[Bert Slide]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F47AfASOnA8

[mikegug]

Originally Posted by SquierJazz72

Too much focus on the dream of "making it" probably distracts from making it, for one.

And it's not all about how well or how much one plays. Networking and making sure your music, if it's good enough, gets to the right people counts more. Most bands who just count on being "discovered" one day are probably still waiting.

Yeah, the days of playing ALL THE TIME in hopes that a talent scout will find you out are over (enter MTV and the internet). Get your songs and videos solid and get a decent Facebook following. Then get in front of the right people.

Yes, you have to have stage presence too.

And if you are looking for garantees, well, best of luck to you. Make your own opportunities and work them.

[Piggy8692]

I remember when I was 20 I joined a band that consisted of guys in their mid-thirties. Before we even had enough original material to fill out a opening gig, I learned that we had a manager and a publicist? Lame. Some people don't understand that no one is going to sign a band that hasn't played a show yet. It shouldn't even need to be mentioned, but sadly enough I have to say it.

I guess I don't have any beef with people trying to make it. It's not for me, but it is what some people want. That's fine, but you definitely need to do things in order. And if 'music' isn't the first thing on the list then you're setting yourself up for failure.

[dax21]

It really depends what they consider "making it". There is a fine line between being famous/earning money (if they are in for the money, abandon ship right away) and just wanting to play as often as possible, getting your name and music out there.
Now, I personally don't enjoy needless rehearsals. If all of you know your stuff, I doubt that you need to rehearse more than once/twice a week, especially for a grunge gig (not disrespecting the genre here). I'm all for being tight but nothing kills fun and that itch to play as over-rehearsing.

With that being said, I'd rather join a well-motivated band than a not-so-motivated one. It all depends, your standards shift a bit with every band you go through, it's all subjective.

[Piggy8692]

Originally Posted by dax21

It really depends what they consider "making it".

I agree with this. I could care less about having a reality tv show, being in teen magazines, and having my music videos played on MTV. I would be content playing good music and maybe having a little acknowledgement that my band is good. Other than that, the rest is extra.

Where I'm at there's a lot of TTMI Syndrome. It's more of a hinderance for me, because now, I have to sift the the droves of bands that are ready to get their name out there prematurely. You don't need a facebook page, recording, tour schedule, manager, before you've played a few shows.

I'd go as far as to say that you don't even need a band name until you're ready to start playing shows. Which shouldnt be any less than a few months. (Depending on practice schedule.) So many bands out there are so eager to be heard that they don't even bother to consider what their audience might be hearing.

[Frank Tuesday]

But do we make it?

[LiquidMidnight]

Originally Posted by two fingers

Oy. I promise you they don't. I have finally gotten it through the thick skulls of some of my good friends that I have absolutely no interest in these types of projects. I'm surrounded by MARRIED 30-45 year old men with KIDS who (up until recently when I had to get ugly with a couple of them) were STILL trying to get me into a band that practices several nights a week and travels who knows how many miles to play shows with 10 other bands for no money on the off chance that some big record exec is going to show up in a town of 20K people in rural Eastern NC. Reality never even entered into the conversation. Several of them can't hold down a job because they will show up to work half asleep because they HAD to go jam somewhere on a Tuesday night 4 hours away to make a name for themselves or get their foot in the door at some club that nobody cares about but them. It's really sad to me. I just want to grab them by the shoulders and shake them. "Take a look at your kids idiot! They need a DAD and some SCHOOL CLOTHES! They DON'T need a wanna be rock star with no money, a broken down car, no retirement, no college fund for them, and no BRAINS!"

Sorry. But the OP pulled my string and I had to vent as well.

I hate you are having to deal with that crap. I feel your pain.

Yep, I know these people as well. The drummer in my last band once made a pretty fair living as a professional musician, touring up and down the East Coast. He came close to getting signed but never did. A lot of major artists that are household names right now opened for him at one time.

He's in his forties now, has a wife and a kid. He still has this idea of "playing for a living," which is a bit more realistic than "making it." However, I don't think he's thought that one through either. He has RA and generally needs non-elective surgery for something every two to three years. He had a rotator cuff surgery a few years ago. Before we disbanded, he was starting to have complaints about the rotator cuff in his other shoulder. A double-header weekend would leave him feeling destroyed half-way through the second gig. I don't know how he's going to do five nights a week that would require extensive travel if he can't do two nights with regional travel. His wife works but she's not making the family rich. He took our last singer with him for his new project; that cat has a solid day gig and a new kid as well. I wish 'em lots o' luck, but I just don't see it happening.

[SquierJazz72]

Yeah, the days of playing ALL THE TIME in hopes that a talent scout will find you out are over (enter MTV and the internet)

That's it. A lot of the old ways are dead. Bands who rely on them are largely doomed, IMO.

I don't think many talent scouts are physically out there any more. They don't need to be. With all the social media outlets, they can find all the bands they want(and plenty they don't) without leaving the office(or home, for that matter).

So I think bands that want a serious shot at making it need to be leveraging that, in whatever way they can. Get good, yes. Play out, yes. But also record some of your stuff and get it out there. Have a plan and be proactive.

These days, if you just sit around waiting, you'll likely die waiting.

[Russell L]

Sigh...I remember being in my twenties, when making it was the ultimate goal. But, now at 63, I find that small-time is where it's really at. I enjoy playing a few times a month and still living at home everyday. I've done the touring thing and frankly didn't get into it. I've played for a living, too, but it was mostly local, so I didn't have to go far away much. Yet, I think each of us has their own way about us that makes us more tuned to different lifestyles. And sometimes when you have a good thing going on, making it might be the end of the good times, or at least that part of it. In a microcom, it's like the way a jam at a bud's house just for fun and creativity was ruined by taking it to a club and gigging it twice a month as a jam. Now, we don't do the thing at the guys house much anymore. So be careful what you wish for.

So, I agree that sometimes it's just best to relax and enjoy playing locally without the proverbial "making it."

[thlayli]

Heh... I just kinda went through that in the band I just left. The bandleader's in his early 40's and he's bound and determined that he's going to play music as his career, that's "all I ever wanted to do" to quote him. He has no family, works as a cab driver, and plays in the one band. Lead guitar player is raising a bunch of kids, has no job, dreadlocks down his back, mostly lives off of his wife working, only plays in the one band.

Bandleader just wants to play more, is somewhat reasonable but pretty much self-interested; once you figure that out, he's easy.

Lead guitar player complains about everything, but when I mentioned his complaints in MY complaints (which led to my leaving the band), he got very defensive and questioned my drive and love for music. His situation is an example of why I quit; I don't want to end up that guy, trying to feed a bunch of kids on $40 a week.

Both of them have what I consider to be unrealistic visions as to what's going to happen with that band. One thinks they can work constantly and make a living in the same bars that stiff them for guarantees/the door constantly, the other thinks that he can run himself into the ground and not feel the consequences. And they both think of the music business in an antiquated, 80's sort of way.

When I play in the future, it will be with other adults.

[Geroi Asfalta]

I like to believe my group is realistic about the whole idea of making it. We all have jobs and see the group as a fun project, and if it turns into some uber successful, great...if not, we at lest have fun playing together.

It does kinda help to know people. The bassist for the Conan OBrian show was at our last gig. He helped set up our recording studio with an acoustic image head and some aggie cabs.

One of my friends had a local group in the late 80's. Their drummer left to go play with another group, everybody else stayed. Bad idea. Drummer has been with Judas Priest now for over 20 years....

[bearfoot]

Making it is rocking the house, in whichever way it is you do that. Making it big is rocking bigger houses. I have done this, so far, from sidewalks to $1k gigs with a band.
And I think making it is also making an original album that stands on its own as a decent work of art, especially if it is an appreciated part of someone else's musical tapestry.

But in music, we have this syndrome. You dont see it in painting or sculpture, those aren't so attached to pop culture or so lucrative a business as selling 2-3 minute songs. I think the "making it syndrome" people are similar to the lottery addicts. Because with it goes this thought that your fate is based on luck. So they go about trying to stalk luck or something.
They dont know what making it is, and they don't know what luck is. Lucky is being able to do this stuff to begin with.

[Russell L]

IMO, there is no such thing as Luck. To make something happen you have to do something. If you do nothing, nothing will happen. But, just because you do something does not mean you will be successful. Things have a way of going how they go. Sometimes you can make something happen the way you want, sometimes not. No guarantees. Of course, there is a thing called probability. Some things are more probable than others, based on a variety of parameters. Like, you might be more likely to make a decent living at any number of regulars jobs than trying to "make it" in music.

[funkcicle]

Originally Posted by VigourousJHands

Basically every audition I go to is like going on a first date and having someone propose. Is this happening in anyone else's towns?

That's been happening for eternity, really- if nobody is trying to make it, then nobody will. It's not a matter of being right or wrong, or stuck on an "old way" of doing things, it's simply different people having different priorities. They're not wrong for having that ambition, their objectives are simply incompatible with yours. You've already fought half the battle by recognizing the difference between what you want from music, and what other people seem to want. The other half of the battle is effectively communicating that: if you make it known up front that you just want to play out once a month with a rehearsal or two thrown in there , you won't waste anybody else's time nor feel like they are wasting yours.

[nukes_da_bass]

I make it to practice, I make it to the gig.

Seems to me the only way to "make it" these days is get on the jam band festival circuit.
How possible is that even? 20,000 jam bands and slots for maybe 20 of them on the national circuit.
I despise Phish- but their business model was brilliant. Cut out management entirely- cut out ticket agencies entirely, and sell your own tickets to a show you booked in a cow pasture someplace.

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by Bassist4Eris

It's difficult even in humble Albany NY. Everyone wants to "go on tour" or try getting gigs in NYC and Boston. Which, IME, suck. Why drive 3 hours for a crappy bar gig when there are plenty close to home?

I just want to play the local club, then go home and sleep in my own bed.

In another thread they mocked a bar that's one of our February bookings and that I play $100.00 per man shows.

Heck, I love our local small bar/ club gigs, they're fun. I get to play out every weekend sometime twice every weekend and get paid.

I didn't understand what the joke was, maybe he was booked at Madison Square Garden.

As far as I'm concerned I've made it.

Blue

[Russell L]

Originally Posted by bluewine

In another thread they mocked a bar that's one of our February bookings and that I play $100.00 per man shows.

Heck, I love our local small bar/ club gigs, they're fun. I get to play out every weekend sometime twice every weekend and get paid.

I didn't understand what the joke was, maybe he was booked at Madison Square Garden.

As far as I'm concerned I've made it.

Blue

Right on, Blue. I love my smallish gigs, too. I got a six pack of them this month and about the same next month.

[keiththebassist]

The music biz is even less experimental than it once was 40 or 50 years ago. To get signed, hook up on a national tour in large venues for large crowds, you have to pretty much already be doing that on your own. No label will sign you unless you are already making pretty significant money on your own, and obviously, talent rarely has anything to do with that.

[dyack]

Im ready to quit my current band over "making it". We do original and cover sets, or a combo of both. But now its become about practicing stage presence and coordinating our "moves" on stage. Singer says by doing this people will notice. I say it sounds like a boy band. Im more interested in playing a 3 hour cover set on a thursday night that is laid back, fun, and pays well. We all have jobs making good money, so we cant do a "tour". But he wants to play every weekend for the next 5 months and constantly push the facebook and twitter promo crap. I like the music, but hate everything else.

[klejst]

Originally Posted by Technotitclan

Been like that in all the bands I've been in. I just tell them if there more focused on making it than you are on making music then it will never work out.

+1, good way to think. Early on in one of my earlier bands I joined we used to think about what it would be like to be one of the next big things and then eventually put a lot more into the press kit and making sure all the demo CD's had all our info and our promo pics were just right that my band and I lost what was important, the music. We became disappointed after we submitted demos and they all shot us down...shortly after the band just kind of started to fizzle out because we all had that attitude of "well they turned us down, whats the point now?" And we eventually broke up. What sucks is yeah perhaps we were not what the labels were looking for at that time, but we had a good thing going and we basically just ran it into a brick wall.

Now I look at making it as more of a "À la carte" not a necessity to making my music. Besides, looking at what many of the labels are interested in, backing and are putting out these days I don't really want to be part of top 40 everything sounds the same scene anyways.