Mic'ing the drumkit?

[Stanley Design]

Do you guys all mic the drumkit on gigs? We have a few times and it makes a world of difference to the sound, always. I'm in a street punk band, I'm the one with the money. My singer has a bum leg and is on welfare, the drummer and one guitarist are dishwashers going to highschool still, and one guitarist is 17 with a kid. I do sound, and own my own PA, but have no drum mics. My drummer is going to be buying some but I know he's going to really cheap out on them, I need you guys to recommend the cheapest used drum mics that will do the job well enough. He doesn't use toms, just floor tom, kick, snare.

I was thinking of making a few out of old speakers wired backwards? Aparently they work wonders? Anyone able to help me out with that idea, it would probaly be the cheapest.

[T-Bird]

Hi, Todd

Always, as it makes a world of difference as You said.

Of course the fact that I used to be a semi-pro soundman, have a small to large Pa and a s***load of good mics helps.

But then again, isn't the two most important qualities with the bassplayer the PA and the van

The drummer bought the cheapest set from Musichouse Thomann for 133 € (http://www.thomann.de/gb/t-bone_dc_1000.htm) and got what he payed for. Absolutely nothin magic, but gets the job done. The set lacks the overheads, but there's usually no need for them anyway . When You combine those with the Behringer ( I know) MDX 4600, You get some pretty impressive results LIVE.

If we are recording something, there's usually a mix of AKG D12, some CR57:s, MD 421, a Shure or two.

If You are on a tight budget, IMO get a good mic for the bass drum, and use what ever is available for the others. We used these for a while http://www.thomann.de/gb/the_tbone_mb60_mikrofonset.htm , well the tone acceptable, reliability as can be expected. Again, You get what You pay for.

As for the large cone lo-impedance dynamic microphones (speaker mics) I'd never use them in a live situation. In studio yes.

Regards
Sam

[vindy500]

i hear behringer mics are actually pretty good

[IanStephenson]

Not an expert, but we're gradually going down that route in my band.

Check on ebay - new sets of 7 (or 5) drum mics turn up relativly cheap. Our drummer picked up a set of 7 for about £100 (bearing in mind an SM57 is about £80 over here). At the momment he's only using the bass mic, but we're upscaling the PA next week, so we'll probably try a few more. Can't say how good they are, as I haven't really messed with them much, but they're not awefull, and the price is right - I can't imagine you could bodge anything together cheaper.

I don't know what the spec on your PA is, but remember that if you do get a 7 mic set, and actually plan to use it all, you'll need 7 mic cables (look into a snake), at least a couple of mic stands (the others clip to the drum rims), and 7 channels free on your mixer. We looked at getting a submixer just for drums, and found it REALLY hard to find a mixer with more than 4 XLR inputs. You also need to set all this stuff up at every gig :-(

It's probably worth getting the full set of mics as they're so cheap, and introduce them gadually - start with the kick mic, then the snare. Then you can add a mic on the floor tom, and/or a set of overhead mics.

Ian

[Diggler]

If you're going to skimp out somewhere, do NOT do it on the kick mic. Whatever you spend on it is money well spent.

My drummer bought a Nady kit and the kick mic was pathetic. It may make a good floor tom mic. We spent hours at my house trying to get a decent EQ out of it. We ended up getting an Audix D6 and with little to no EQ, it thumps you hard.

Seriously, the little bit of difference a good kick mic makes is well worth the cost difference.

[Rick Brienzo]

I have a fairly large mic collection and bought this because it was cheap, in a case, and would fit in my hardware bag. I figured it would sound OK and if it got stolen it would be no big deal.

This kit sounds really good for the price and has lasted about 4 years doing 2 nights a week in bars/clubs.

Like above posters have stated the kick mic isn't the best, but keep in mind if your PA is not the greatest, or lacks subs a $1000 kick mic will not help that much.

[T-Bird]

Oops.

The Behringer (Still usually IMO ) MDX 4600 I mentioned in my previous post is a 4 channel 1RU compressor. I didn't want to put another T link there and totally forgot to tell what it is.

I do agree, the Behringer FX units are usually rather good for their price, we have several, but since they are made in somewhere stuff, the quality is sometimes an issue specially on the road. One BIG disadvantage is the lack of schematics as far as I know, so if something gives the thingamajing is useless scrap. With a quality equipment, You always have some resale value even non functional. There's always someone who's willing to buy it.

IMO when You are on a tight budget and still want a good sound reproduction, compressors and know-how how to use them, make Your vocals and overall sound stand out. And it saves You a lot of grief when used as limiters to protect the sound system.


Remainder though. We play simple ROCK so this may or may not apply to Your music.

Regards
Sam

[Stanley Design]

The only compressor I use is built into my mixer, my PA is a yamaha EMX 16 channel mixer into a yamaha p3500s power amp (1100w per side, one side running mains, other running monitors), for mains I'm running two yamaha s115v's. All I'm looking to support with the PA is vocals and the drumkit IF I know it can handle it.

As people have said those cheap 20 dollar behringers are what we use for mics for everything, vocals, snare, etc. But I know they can't handle the bass drum. I guess I'll stick with those for the majority of my sound and try and find a decent kick mic to add to the mix.

[hbarcat]

If you need to mic the drums but know you have to cheap out on mics then get fewer mics and make them work for you. Only three mics will do a great job with drums if you use them prudently.

1) Mic the kick drum with a made for bass drum mic

2) Mic the snare with any halfway decent dynamic mic

3) Mic everything else with a single condensor mic about 3 feet above and slightly behind the kit (above the drummer's head)

With the overhead condensor you'll need phantom power, so if you don't have that available with your mixer you'll need to get a condensor mic that'll run off an internal battery. Also, don't run the overhead through the stage monitors or you'll likely get feedback from hell. I've found that using only three drum mics in a live situation saves a huge amount of aggravation in not having to set up 8+ mics and 8+ cables and do sound check/EQ/balance on 8+ channels.

For even greater simplicity, the snare mic can also be eliminated and you'd be surprised at how well the overhead picks up the snare sound.

[T-Bird]

Hi, Todd

A sub might help as the 90 Hz BD "exiter freq" may not come out from Your yamaha s115v's as loud as You'd like to.

IMHO You have to have a separate comp/lim with the BD, an accidental heavy kick, and You're got two creased woofers.

Regards
Sam

[Stanley Design]

Eek, if that happened I'd bawl, he's heavy footed and pretty sloppy for a drummer. Wears boots when he drums. What would be recommended for a seperate limiter? And is it possible to get one to go mic>limiter>mixer?

[Diggler]

We don't use a limiter. At all. Set your gain structure properly and use your ears. During soundcheck, have your drummer hammer the kick drum and make sure that the gain meters are reading around '0' and you'll have plenty of headroom.

Clipping anywhere in the signal chain can quickly toast speakers.