New Band Check List

[bluewine]

A few things to consider before making a commitment to play with a new band.

•Do you like the material

•Do you understand where the band is at and what their goal is (book shows in 3 months, record cd, whatever)Is it what your looking for or can accept?

•Decent rehearsal space

•Reasonable Commute to rehearsals and gigs.

•Do all members have computers and use cell phones. (Call it picky, I say it’s a necessity for any organized band for many reasons. If someone says they don’t use computers I am going to definitely raise an eyebrow)

•After 3-4 rehearsals access the talent level of all members. Do they meet your standards. Do they have the resources to meet their goals

•Ability to learn material

•Do all member show up on time and consistently show up for rehearsals

•Do they all use professional level gear (guitars &amps)

•Does the band own a PA.

•Are they good people, reasonable, professional, easy to get along with

Anything you want to ad or don’t think is important.

[zachoff]

Do they like a lot of different kinds of music and are they into music apart from just playing it?

This is something that's an absolute must for me. I don't really want to be in a band with someone that listens to nothing but power metal or nothing but punk rock from '76-'84, etc... I've found that people that are into and expose themselves to a lot of different music are more creative, open-minded, and easier to work with when it comes to writing and arranging.

[julio.gamiz]

Let's apply this to my own band. We do originals

Originally Posted by bluewine

A few things to consider before making a commitment to play with a new band.

•Do you like the material CHECK, we play heavy rock and there's a lot of bands we all like to listen to

•Do you understand where the band is at and what their goal is (book shows in 3 months, record cd, whatever)Is it what your looking for or can accept? CHECK, to us it's a hobby, money isn't important, but we're all looking to grow

•Decent rehearsal space CHECK, our guitar player's basement

•Reasonable Commute to rehearsals and gigs. CHECK 35 minutes

•Do all members have computers and use cell phones. (Call it picky, I say it’s a necessity for any organized band for many reasons. If someone says they don’t use computers I am going to definitely raise an eyebrow)CHECK

•After 3-4 rehearsals access the talent level of all members. Do they meet your standards. Do they have the resources to meet their goalsCHECK

•Ability to learn material CHECK, although we write most of our stuff together, but everyone comes to rehearsals prepared

•Do all member show up on time and consistently show up for rehearsals Our second guitar players standard delay time is 30 minutes, every week. So yeah, he's consistent

•Do they all use professional level gear (guitars &amps) CHECK, and they're 50W tube combo amps, so no volume wars!

•Does the band own a PA. CHECK, I have a vocal PA, but so far never needed it to play out.

•Are they good people, reasonable, professional, easy to get along with CHECK, I consider them friends

Anything you want to ad or don’t think is important.

Nice little list there blue. I think you got all the important stuff covered there.

Greets

Julio

[WarwickDavis]

I think you nailed it.

[bluewine]

Now that I think about it, this would probably be Number 1 on the list;

Are they good people, reasonable, professional, easy to get along with

[Winnb]

That's a good list. Very good. It'd be nice to add to the list - any substance abuse problems, but that's really hard to know about anyone until you get to know them. I guess that falls under the "good people, reasonable, professional" section of your list though. So that's covered.

[Phalex]

I think liking the material should go somewhere near the bottom, but other than that, yeah.

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by Winnb

That's a good list. Very good. It'd be nice to add to the list - any substance abuse problems, but that's really hard to know about anyone until you get to know them. I guess that falls under the "good people, reasonable, professional" section of your list though. So that's covered.

Yeah, I agree,I don't think anyone will say;

BTW, I like to stay high all the time.

[ChrisB2]

I like this thread a lot as I may be in the market for a new band soon. Good list Blue, thanks.

However, some of these points can't be known after one audition or even a few rehearsals, and some bands want a commitment right away when you accept the spot.

Can we get some dialog going on how to handle that, what is your experience getting bands to cooperate with a tentative agreement, how feasible is that???

I would like to tell bands that the deal will be on a trial basis, but I've never tried that and feel it might be off-putting to bands... your thoughts?

[AfroCubanFunkMa]

Hmmm, commitments are tricky things.. I can understand if they are a working band doing lots of originals then they wouldn't want too many subs but reality doesn't always line up with this ideal. I suppose it depends on you and where you are and how you fit in with them..

Are you/they in the original music trenches and not likely to make money at music right away?
Are you a hired gun with 15 sub gigs and a full calendar?
Are you a weekend warrior looking to make some cash?
Also what do they need as a commitment? 1 night a week rehearsals on Tuesdays and assorted gigs? How many a month? Why can't you schedule other gigs for yourself when they're not gigging?

I think you'll find every situation to be slightly different.. That said I would proceed with caution with any group that wants 100% exclusivity when it comes to dictating your schedule. What are they offering to deserve that.. International Tour? Retainer?

[bluewine]

Nice little list there blue. I think you got all the important stuff covered there.

Greets

Julio

Thanks for all the imput Julio


Do you understand where the band is at and what their goal is (book shows in 3 months, record cd, whatever)Is it what your looking for or can accept? CHECK, to us it's a hobby, money isn't important, but we're all looking to grow


Very important check here.

And this is one I have to pay more attention to.

I have to face that this is not a hobby for me, it's a business. How mich money a band can generate is very important to me.

I also have to face that I am not a match for those looking to grow. Some of us just don't have that kind of time any more.

thanks agian Julio

[jive1]

Originally Posted by ChrisB2

However, some of these points can't be known after one audition or even a few rehearsals, and some bands want a commitment right away when you accept the spot.

Can we get some dialog going on how to handle that, what is your experience getting bands to cooperate with a tentative agreement, how feasible is that???

I would like to tell bands that the deal will be on a trial basis, but I've never tried that and feel it might be off-putting to bands... your thoughts?

There's nothing wrong with a trial basis for commitment. But, a band will usually want someone who can commit and may choose someone else. On the other hand someone can say they commit, but they really aren't going to.

In the past, I have said that I am able to commit to the band, but there's some goals I would like to see us attain. If those goals aren't attained, then I may have to reconsider at that time. But, right now, I'm good to go. If I'm doing a bunch of auditions, I would tell them straight up that I am doing other auditions and can't make a decision until I've tried them all out. Some will respect that, some will be turned off by that.

One of things with having terms you want met, is that you also have to be willing to be rejected based on your terms.

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by AfroCubanFunkMa

Hmmm, commitments are tricky things.. I can understand if they are a working band doing lots of originals then they wouldn't want too many subs but reality doesn't always line up with this ideal. I suppose it depends on you and where you are and how you fit in with them..

Are you/they in the original music trenches and not likely to make money at music right away?
Are you a hired gun with 15 sub gigs and a full calendar?
Are you a weekend warrior looking to make some cash?
Also what do they need as a commitment? 1 night a week rehearsals on Tuesdays and assorted gigs? How many a month? Why can't you schedule other gigs for yourself when they're not gigging?

I think you'll find every situation to be slightly different.. That said I would proceed with caution with any group that wants 100% exclusivity when it comes to dictating your schedule. What are they offering to deserve that.. International Tour? Retainer?

I am talking about a traditional search.

Lets say, a guy like me and some other TBers that were in a good gigging band.

Now we are looking to commit to being a bass player in one band, a member of the band, not a hired gun. Committing to 3-4 shows a month 1-2 reheasals a week. Also ths would be a band playing mostly covers with lots of gis.

[jive1]

Originally Posted by AfroCubanFunkMa

That said I would proceed with caution with any group that wants 100% exclusivity when it comes to dictating your schedule. What are they offering to deserve that.. International Tour? Retainer?

I've dealt with that as well, and I won't go there. I've been playing in this area for about a decade, and I've made some good relationships with other musicians. I'm not going to forsake the relationships I've cultivated, for the sake of a band, ever. If a good friend calls me for a sub gig, or I have an opportunity to jam with some great players, and I have the night free, I'm doing it.

I find that many professional groups will understand, and don't expect exclusivity unless they are doing more than 40 shows a year. But, if they do they need exclusivity, they need to have solid bookings or else it can make the band-leader look like they may have some control issues. You can't take exclusivity seriously if you only have 5 dates booked for the coming year.

[jive1]

IME, I find that it's best to have a few metrics. Too many confuse, and it's difficult to prioritize and quantify them. And by having too many criteria, it's easy to pass on a good opportunity because of criteria that may not be a deal breaker.

If I'm looking to make money, here's what I look for. Everything past this is gravy, but these 4 things are essential.
1. Bookings - I put the most weight here, because this is where it all comes down to. If they don't have bookings, then I'll need to see what kind of contacts they have.
2. Personal reference - If you drop names, I may know who they are and I'll check with them. I may ask who they worked with to see if we have any friends in common.
3. Songlist - Do they have enough material. And when I audition, I'll audition on 10 or more songs to make sure they know the material and it's not a wish list. It'll also let me know if I can handle/stomach the material, and pull it off.
4. Reliability - Showing up on time, having gear that works, and stuff like that.

If I'm looking to have fun, here's what I look for.
1. Material - If I don't like their material, it won't be fun.
2. Bandmates - If I don't like them personally or musically, it won't be fun.
3. Convenience - Driving too far, sacrificing other commitments, staying up too late on a worknight, etc. are ways to make something that can be fun, not fun.

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by jive1

There's nothing wrong with a trial basis for commitment. But, a band will usually want someone who can commit and may choose someone else. On the other hand someone can say they commit, but they really aren't going to.

In the past, I have said that I am able to commit to the band, but there's some goals I would like to see us attain. If those goals aren't attained, then I may have to reconsider at that time. But, right now, I'm good to go. If I'm doing a bunch of auditions, I would tell them straight up that I am doing other auditions and can't make a decision until I've tried them all out. Some will respect that, some will be turned off by that.

One of things with having terms you want met, is that you also have to be willing to be rejected based on your terms.

Great points, all on point.

If gigs are a part of the goal.I think that one can be easy in a way.

When I joined my last band, they said we are booked out through the next 3 months.We need you to be ready by this date.

On the other side ,most of us know how hard booking a band is. For originals bands its more than twice as hard.

We can usually tell if a band has resources and their conected so gigs will come. And within a short time window we can say to ourselves, these guys are going to have a hard time getting gigs.

[JustDavid]

Great thread Blue. Good chance to get a lot of points into one thread.

A few quibbles (or different perspectives) on:

Originally Posted by bluewine

•Do all members have computers and use cell phones. (Call it picky, I say it’s a necessity for any organized band for many reasons. If someone says they don’t use computers I am going to definitely raise an eyebrow)

•Does the band own a PA.

PA rental cost, at least here, puts owning a PA into question. Renting is the best option if gigging once a month. If once a week, buy it. But you gotta have some vox amping for practices.

I'd rephrase the 'computer/cell' point to be something like 'Can I quickly contact each member if needed? And can they manage the information required to be in the band?' I've heard of far weirder things from musicians than computerphobia; if they can 'walk the walk' without one, I'd say it's all good. Phone contact issues when cancelling practice are easily solved by not cancelling. Phone contacting for short-notice gig availability is much quicker if the booker has everyone's availability on his booking calendar.

[jdwinva]

After my most recent disaster I might add the following check list item:

Will each member of the band have resonable expectations that they will be required to assist with setting up the PA and tearing it down if they are to be paid equally. You do not want to become the singer's bitch.

[bluewine]

Originally Posted by jive1

IME, I find that it's best to have a few metrics. Too many confuse, and it's difficult to prioritize and quantify them. And by having too many criteria, it's easy to pass on a good opportunity because of criteria that may not be a deal breaker.

If I'm looking to make money, here's what I look for. Everything past this is gravy, but these 4 things are essential.
1. Bookings - I put the most weight here, because this is where it all comes down to. If they don't have bookings, then I'll need to see what kind of contacts they have.
2. Personal reference - If you drop names, I may know who they are and I'll check with them. I may ask who they worked with to see if we have any friends in common.
3. Songlist - Do they have enough material. And when I audition, I'll audition on 10 or more songs to make sure they know the material and it's not a wish list. It'll also let me know if I can handle/stomach the material, and pull it off.
4. Reliability - Showing up on time, having gear that works, and stuff like that.

If I'm looking to have fun, here's what I look for.
1. Material - If I don't like their material, it won't be fun.
2. Bandmates - If I don't like them personally or musically, it won't be fun.
3. Convenience - Driving too far, sacrificing other commitments, staying up too late on a worknight, etc. are ways to make something that can be fun, not fun.

Not bad jive. I like check point 4.

I auditioned for 1 band that did not have gig worthy equipment.They were all between 25-33.

What was bad, was that they did not know that they had crap gear. How can you tell a bunch of guys;

Hey, I am sorry and I don't mean to hurt your feelings, but you guys don't own decent guitars or amps you can play out with.

[steveksux]

Originally Posted by bluewine

Not bad jive. I like check point 4.

I auditioned for 1 band that did not have gig worthy equipment.They were all between 25-33.

What was bad, was that they did not know that they had crap gear. How can you tell a bunch of guys;

Hey, I am sorry and I don't mean to hurt your feelings, but you guys don't own a decent guitars or amps you can play out with.

I'm ok with old beat up stuff that works, good musicians can make lousy equipment/guitars sound good, and bad musicians with day jobs can have great equipment and still sound like hell.

Having said all that, I agree with you in principle... just that there's a bit of grey area. 100 watt PA and 15 watt practice amps aren't going to cut it in a decent sized club without an available club PA. The clubs around here aren't usually paying enough to justify renting a pa for the gig unless everyone is playing for fun instead of profit.

But great thread, and your original list is pretty darn good, I can't think of any improvements.
Randy