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-   -   Open letter from bar owner to musicians (http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f67/open-letter-bar-owner-musicians-945725/)

rockinrayduke 01-04-2013 11:02 AM

Open letter from bar owner to musicians
 
This was on my FB feed, figured you guys might want to see it.

http://chrisledrew.wordpress.com/201...-to-musicians/

CalboDaGo 01-04-2013 11:11 AM

i have to say...i agree with this 100%

MatticusMania 01-04-2013 11:15 AM

I think this is posted in another thread:
http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f67/me...79/index8.html (top of page 8)

joelb79 01-04-2013 11:19 AM

I agree. Good read.

two fingers 01-04-2013 11:21 AM

Agreed. Music is a business. Profit is not evil. Want to "express yourself" or "share your art"? Rent a hall and throw your own show. The rest of us are trying to make some dough.

The Thinker 01-04-2013 11:22 AM

I enjoyed the article and found it helpful. I'd love to know what the "trade secret" sales technique is :).

N.F.A. 01-04-2013 11:24 AM

Yes, that was what I was about to ask as well. I guess it won't be secret if the guys here that are in the know give it up.

Jazz Ad 01-04-2013 11:24 AM

It is a nicely written response to the popular letter to bar owners we see quoted very often.

MatticusMania 01-04-2013 11:26 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by two fingers (Post 13668030)
Agreed. Music is a business. Profit is not evil. Want to "express yourself" or "share your art"? Rent a hall and throw your own show. The rest of us are trying to make some dough.

Not all music is business. I see no reason why the bands who want to "express themselves" or "share their art" have to go do it elsewhere. The bands that want to do that, theyre the ones getting the "open mic night/jam nights" mentioned in the article (theyre given the non-paying, slower nights). The venue owners, in the end, will get what they pay for. Theres no need to turn it into an us vs. them scenario. You say that the bands that want to do the above should rent a hall and throw their own show... the ones wanting to make money could do the same as well.

pedro 01-04-2013 11:30 AM

Hard to imagine someone out there doesn't know this.

lfmn16 01-04-2013 11:41 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pedro (Post 13668089)
Hard to imagine someone out there doesn't know this.

Then you don't have a very good imagination! :D

RedMoses 01-04-2013 11:46 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by two fingers (Post 13668030)
Agreed. Music is a business. Profit is not evil. Want to "express yourself" or "share your art"? Rent a hall and throw your own show. The rest of us are trying to make some dough.

Ive done this on a number of occassions, there is a local venue with a great sound system and a nice big music space seperate from the Bar. We book bands we like that have a decent draw and usually will headline unless we get a band that draws better than we do, we charge a cover at the door and pay the venue of use of the facility. They invite us back and give us an entire weekend evening because we bring out 100+ people that spend money on Booze.

I will say this, we get almost NO people coming in that were there to hang at the bar, time after time we had hopes to draw some fresh blood but it never happens, partually because there is a good seperation between the rooms and ppl at the bar cant really hear whats bieng played. While its nice to play a good venue and pack the house, its a lot of work and if you dont bring in enough ppl you end up loosing money or breaking even on the facility fee and that doesnt include renting a van, Gas, footwork to get other bands, promo..... In the end the bar makes a ton of money on booze but you have not gained access to any new fans from the bar.

pedro 01-04-2013 11:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lfmn16 (Post 13668151)
Then you don't have a very good imagination! :D


LOL!!

pedro 01-04-2013 11:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedMoses (Post 13668180)
Ive done this on a number of occassions, there is a local venue with a great sound system and a nice big music space seperate from the Bar. We book bands we like that have a decent draw and usually will headline unless we get a band that draws better than we do, we charge a cover at the door and pay the venue of use of the facility. They invite us back and give us an entire weekend evening because we bring out 100+ people that spend money on Booze.

I will say this, we get almost NO people coming in that were there to hang at the bar, time after time we had hopes to draw some fresh blood but it never happens, partually because there is a good seperation between the rooms and ppl at the bar cant really hear whats bieng played. While its nice to play a good venue and pack the house, its a lot of work and if you dont bring in enough ppl you end up loosing money or breaking even on the facility fee and that doesnt include renting a van, Gas, footwork to get other bands, promo..... In the end the bar makes a ton of money on booze but you have not gained access to any new fans from the bar.

One of our favorite venues has a party room that they rent downstairs. Very nice room w/ a bar and they rent it at a ridiculously low price. Anyhoo, we threw ourselves a party downstairs and when management saw folks headed downstairs they followed and hired us.

Jim Nazium 01-04-2013 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pedro (Post 13668089)
Hard to imagine someone out there doesn't know this.

Reading this forum, it seems like a lot of people don't know it.

pedro 01-04-2013 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Nazium (Post 13668349)
Reading this forum, it seems like a lot of people don't know it.


Really? I got the opposite impression. What don't you think most here don't get about the letter?

TinIndian 01-04-2013 12:45 PM

The drummer/band leader for my band could stand to read this. He acts like it is the bars job to give our band a place to play. One of the big reasons, if not the biggest, the guitarist and I are leaving and starting our own project. Already have a great drummer lined up and trying out a front man next week.

After all is said and done I/we won't be looking back.

Jim Nazium 01-04-2013 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by pedro (Post 13668403)
Really? I got the opposite impression. What don't you think most here don't get about the letter?

1. A bar is a business
2. Most of those businesses operate on pretty thin margins
3. The value of a band to the business is the increase in sales over what they would sell if there were no band.

A lot of people seem to think that musicians should be paid based on all the time and effort it takes to learn an instrument, the cost of their gear, etc.

pedro 01-04-2013 12:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Nazium (Post 13668524)
1. A bar is a business
2. Most of those businesses operate on pretty thin margins
3. The value of a band to the business is the increase in sales over what they would sell if there were no band.

A lot of people seem to think that musicians should be paid based on all the time and effort it takes to learn an instrument, the cost of their gear, etc.

A lot of people 'here'?

TinIndian 01-04-2013 12:57 PM

It's interesting to note that the "letter" brings up selling certain drinks and things onstage. My guitarist always mentions drinks and drink specials and always talks to the patrons about tipping the wait staff and bartenders. All due in part to the fact that his day gig is as a district sales manager for a liquor company.


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