Second Chance? Or Kick Him Out?

danjl131 · #1 11-09-2008, 10:19 AM

i play guitar and bass and i am in a band. in the band i am one of the guitarists and recently we have been having trouble with our bassist. we are all high school kids who dont get into trouble and stay away from partying and all the drugs and that stuff. however, our bassist is getting into the party scene and drinks. he hasnt done drugs but says that he will. he also drives from parties after having a drink, but says that he is responsible (which is contradictory). he is one of my best friends, but lately he has been putting me down and disrespecting me and my home, and he is now becoming more and more cocky and arrogant. one of my ideas was to at next practice have a talk with him (as a band) and tell him how he has changed and we dont want someone who is becoming a jerk heading down the wrong path to be in our band. also, our music differences are starting to show up. im open to all genres, but our bassist says we should start doing ska/punk songs, while our other guitarist and drummer both say rock (hard rock and soft rock). by the way we write originals, not play covers. im tempted to take over bass and kick him out (with the rest of the band being ok with it too of course, im not a control freak), however he was/is a close friend of mine. so what should we do? give him a second chance? or kick him out and have me move over to bass? (which would actually be more than fine with me)

p.s. i just asked the drummer this, havent heard back from him yet. havent asked the guitarist/vocalist yet. the bassist blindly thinks everything is ok and has no clue there is a problem.

mimaz · #2 11-09-2008, 10:24 AM

Don't let his problems become your problems. Move away from him now. I respect you and your friends "doing the right thing". Surround yourself with the best people, musically and personally.

Montsegour · #3 11-09-2008, 10:27 AM

You guys need to chill

traynor1132 · #4 11-09-2008, 10:32 AM

REMEMBER HE'S YOUR FRIEND TRY TO HELP HIM,BUT DON'T CHANGE ANYTHING YOU OR YOUR BAND HAVE IN MIND FOR ONE PERSON!

etoncrow · #5 11-09-2008, 10:32 AM

Stick to your path; but, doesn't 'doing things the right way' also involve letting him have a second chance? Especially if he does not have a clue that something is wrong. Approach him as a group but in a concerned 'family' way. Do not be confrontational; rather be concerned at his new direction. Let it be his decision whether to stay or to go.

Qvist · #6 11-09-2008, 10:32 AM

You guys should all follow him and become the most dangerous band in the world! Drunk driving isn't cool though...

Joe Nerve · #7 11-09-2008, 11:02 AM

If you are the friend you claim to be then I think you have only your first option. Talk to him. Lay it all out on the table and then hear him out. If he doesn't want follow in the direction you and your band are headed then you'll all know it's time to move on. No hard feeling, misunderstandings, backstabbling, etc. I'd also be open to allowing all your styles collide as having people into different things can really add to a band if you guys have the patience to work together and compromise. the drugs and alcohol thing is a whole nuther story though.

jdieh1 · #8 11-10-2008, 02:15 AM

I'd talk to him first. Then, if he can't be mature, kick him out

RCCollins · #9 11-10-2008, 02:24 AM

It's a tough spot you're in as a friend. It does appear that he will only complicate things more if he stays in the band. At the same time, I don't think just dropping him is the right thing to do either.

+1 on talk to him, so that everything's out in the open on BOTH sides. There's no guarantee he won't be hurt somehow but at least you're being straight with him that way. If he's not a moron he'll see that.

tom once dead · #10 11-10-2008, 02:32 AM

one of my friendships has gone partly becuase of a band, and partly becuase he told me he wanted to murder one of my best friends...hes done multiple personal things that have screwed up the band.

talk to him, then dump him, after you have found a replacement.

IanStephenson · #11 11-10-2008, 03:19 AM

Deal with your friendship first, the band second. Being in bands with friends is always potentially problematic if you don't decide which is more important up front. If he's a good friend you should put him before the band.

On the other hand pick your battles - unless he's doing something seriously wrong then you can't really tell him how to live his live. Acording to you he's
Going to parties: D'uh! You mean he's got friends other than you. Whats the real problem?
Being cocky/arrogant.: You mean disagreeing with you.
Drinking: Maybe a problem, depending on age, and amount. Ask about it, listen and consider if it's really an issue, or if you're over reacting.
Drink Driving: OK - this is bad. Again you migh be over reacting. Driving after 1 beer isn't good, but not the end of the world. However this is something you should sort out with him.
NOT doing drugs: You've got a problem with him TALKING about drugs?
Listening to music you don't like: call the cops!!!

I don't know - maybe your friend is screwing up. From your description, he's just growing up, and trying a few new things. Maybe you need to accept that being friends with someone doesn't mean agreeing and/or endorsing everything they do. If you're realy a friend, you'll accept some of his choices. If you accept the little things, he might listen to you about the drink driving (which could be a biggy).

acbert · #12 11-10-2008, 03:43 AM

The band issues are secondary to the direction your friend is heading. Talk to him one on one (rather then embarasing him in front of others) and let him know that you care about him. He knows that drugs/drinking/etc. are wrong. He just needs someone to stear him in the right direction and as a friend, you're the best person to do that. Don't give up on him even if he ends up out of the band. You're smart enough to know that drinking and driving and/or drugs will only lead to trouble so you should try and help him avoid that path as much as possible. Ultimately it's HIS decision, but don't give up on him!!!!!!!

And congratulations to you and your other friends for choosing NOT to drink or do drugs!!!!!!!!!!!

Can you tell I'm a father????

DudeistMonk · #13 11-10-2008, 01:01 PM

Quote:

Deal with your friendship first, the band second. Being in bands with friends is always potentially problematic if you don't decide which is more important up front. If he's a good friend you should put him before the band.

On the other hand pick your battles - unless he's doing something seriously wrong then you can't really tell him how to live his live. Acording to you he's
Going to parties: D'uh! You mean he's got friends other than you. Whats the real problem?
Being cocky/arrogant.: You mean disagreeing with you.
Drinking: Maybe a problem, depending on age, and amount. Ask about it, listen and consider if it's really an issue, or if you're over reacting.
Drink Driving: OK - this is bad. Again you migh be over reacting. Driving after 1 beer isn't good, but not the end of the world. However this is something you should sort out with him.
NOT doing drugs: You've got a problem with him TALKING about drugs?
Listening to music you don't like: call the cops!!!

I don't know - maybe your friend is screwing up. From your description, he's just growing up, and trying a few new things. Maybe you need to accept that being friends with someone doesn't mean agreeing and/or endorsing everything they do. If you're realy a friend, you'll accept some of his choices. If you accept the little things, he might listen to you about the drink driving (which could be a biggy).

+1

What has the guy actually done wrong? Does he show up and know his material? Would it kill you to do a ska song or two?

None of the stuff you mentioned has anything to do with your band and it sounds like you want to be his mom. 4 years from now you will look back and realize how stupid it was to even think of crucifying your friend over a few drinks.

BTW, there is a difference between having two beers at a party and driving home and having 7 beers in 2 hours and then stumbling to your car....although in HS you shouldn't be driving period.

**Stumbo** · #14 11-10-2008, 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danjl131

our bassist is:

Social differences
1) getting into the party scene and drinks.
2) he hasnt done drugs but says that he will.
3) he also drives from parties after having a drink, but says that he is responsible (which is contradictory).

Personal differences
4) he is one of my best friends, but lately he has been putting me down
5) and disrespecting me and my home, and he is now becoming more and more cocky and arrogant.

Musical differences
1) I'm open to all genres
2) bassist says we should start doing ska/punk songs,
3) while our other guitarist and drummer both say rock (hard rock and soft rock).
4) we write originals, not play covers.

My ideas for resolution:
1) at the next practice have a talk with him (as a band)
2) and tell him how he has changed
3) and we dont want someone who is becoming a jerk heading down the wrong path to be in our band.
4) im tempted to take over bass and kick him out (with the rest of the band being ok with it too of course, im not a control freak)

Current Status:
1) i just asked the drummer this, havent heard back from him yet.
2) havent asked the guitarist/vocalist yet.
3) the bassist blindly thinks everything is ok and has no clue there is a problem.

Question: give him a second chance? or kick him out?

I kinda arranged your post in outline form for clarity (no disrespect intended).

My first thought is that since you haven't let the bass player know what's up, you really can't "give him a second chance" since he has not been informed that there are issues to be discussed (you haven't given him a first chance).

As far as kicking him out, I suggest discussing the situation at a meeting with the drummer and guitar player.
Show them your post (or my outline if you like). Ask them their take on the situation.

Then call a meeting with the whole band and discuss the situation in a calm manner. Based on the bassist's previous behavior, he may get upset and start ranting. You guys remain calm and let him do his thing.

It may come down to musical goals, personal issues, social behavior or all three. Let the bass player talk as much as possible. In the end, it's up to you and the other band members as to which direction you want to take.

If the bass player wants to work things out and stop drinking/not taking drugs, do rock music and stop disrespecting you personally or whatever you decide, at least you'll face the issues in a professional manner and make a decision with all the facts. Hopefully, no bridges will be burned in the process.

You may want to check out the following TB thread, do some cutting/pasting and come up with a band "constitution". It helps to have these issued covered before hand so everyone knows where they stand. When problems arise, it's a lot easier to point to agreed upon rules then to point fingers at each other.

If only I knew then what I know now... If I only knew then what I know now....

Another thread you may find enlightening:
Best musical advice you ever got Best musical advice

Good luck. Keep us updated on your situation.