Unproductive Rehearsals

[bluewine]

New Topic, it’s straight forward, so lets not get crazy with this one.


Scenario;

Lets say the assignment for all members is to learn their parts for to new songs your going to add to your set list. Lets say it's a working band with shows on the books.

You get to rehearsal and it doesn’t take long to figure out the several members did not prepare and did not know their parts. You know, when nobody else knows the parts it kind of hard on the guy that does know his parts and came in prepared.

For me rehearsals should be super productive, it’s a business. Me, if I say more than 2 words to anyone at a rehearsal it’s a lot. I learn my parts and come in ready to execute.

What do you do about it;

My advice is the band leader should simply say, since only one of you learned your parts, rehearsal is canceled, see you guys next week. End of story.

How would you handle it.

[lousybassplayer]

Well, if I am hypothetical "pro", I quit and go geta real job. If I am what I literally am, a hobbyist bass nerd, I tell them its pretty annoying and that I would prefer we get on the same page as to how serious we want to take rehearsals. Even though I am a hobbyist, I have a life, and music is what I do for fun. Obviously my threshold for fooling around will be higher than a pro, but eventually I draw the line when I am no longer having fun, just hanging out with some guys I met off craigslist who own instruments. I have better stuff to do.

[TheBasicBassist]

Unless there is a significant amount of old material that can be worked on, ect.
Than I +1. No point in sitting around with your thumb in your ***. Maybe the guy(s)
who didn't learn their parts should take the rest of the band out for a round? (j/k) :-P

[LaklandBass]

I think it depends on the situation. We have a guitar player that doesnt have a ton of personal time to be working out songs.... however he is extremely good and learns VERY quickly on the spot at practice.
I suppose we could get someone that learns the songs ahead of time but this guy is seriously talented and doesnt hold us back in the slightest.

I suppose it all depends on how much someone holds you back.

For me I learn best when playing with my band. An hour of working on a song at home isnt as good for me as 5 minutes of playing at rehearsal with everyone there.
So when Im at home I mostly work on my chops and technique instead.

[bluewine]

For me I learn best when playing with my band. An hour of working on a song at home isnt as good for me as 5 minutes of playing at rehearsal with everyone there.

That might work, try that 5 minutes when the rest of the band is completely unprepaired.

[bassbully]

Depends. If its a new band have a band meeting and make sure this kind of thing doesnt happen again. Everybody has to do their homework or the band will suffer.

If its an established band of good players it could be due to everybody just got too busy. If its an experienced band that knows each other I am sure the songs will fall in quickly by the one who did their homework leading the rest of the group.

I understand a band is a buisness but ..lighten up and have some fun. Not saying two words to bandmates in a rehearsal doesnt sound like allot of fun. At the level most of us are at music should be fun and enjoyable. I have fun with my bandmates and wouldnt be in a band that wasnt a good "hang" with the group I perform with.

[lousybassplayer]

bully,
While that makes sense to you and I, if you're a "time is money" type of player, that situation may not work. I doubt experienced pro musicians would dare show up at rehearsal unprepared. Even if they are forced by circumstances to come into the rehearsal "cold", if they are experienced, no one should notice.

[dave_p]

*yawn*
here we go again...

anyway, how i handle it? i just parted ways with a talented guitar player this morning. not in a rude way or with any malice. it just wasnt happening on either end i believe and i was the one to come out and say it. no harm, no foul. too much time was going by with nothing getting done.

[LaklandBass]

Originally Posted by bluewine

For me I learn best when playing with my band. An hour of working on a song at home isnt as good for me as 5 minutes of playing at rehearsal with everyone there.

That might work, try that 5 minutes when the rest of the band is completely unprepaired.

I should specify that this is for originals.... makes a difference I suppose.
If its a cover band I dont really see a need to rehearse at all. Just burn a cd of your set and play at home. As long as you dont have any crazy tempo changes or key changes during live shows you shouldnt really need to practice as a band.
In all seriousness if you can play freebird along with the cd it shouldnt matter who is playing the other instruments. If you know the song..... you know the song.

[Spinal Tapper]

Originally Posted by LaklandBass

I suppose it all depends on how much someone holds you back.

For me I learn best when playing with my band. An hour of working on a song at home isnt as good for me as 5 minutes of playing at rehearsal with everyone there.
So when Im at home I mostly work on my chops and technique instead.

I like this ^

I don't think canceling practice for the night would solve any problems either. The same guys are probably just going to go home, flip on the TV, and forget to rehearse their parts for next week's rehearsal and into a downward spiral we go...

Band time together is just as important whether you're playing songs, learning material, or just goofing around.
Might sound stupid, and obviously if you're just goofing around all night, nothing will get accomplished, but that's a pretty extreme example of what I'm trying to get across...

Here's what I'd do if I was band-leader, and what's been done to me before when I wasn't prepared for practice: You make the guys SWEAT IT OUT. Right there, in front of you and the whole band, learning the material as a band. It can get extremely tedious, frustrating, sweaty, and annoying...but...

I GUARANTEE they'll come to the next practice prepared before letting that happen again. Doesn't matter how many times people have to play the parts over to get it right, don't let them give up, or put their instruments down!

Sure beats just going home for the night and being non-musical for everyone.

Obviously, if this continued through multiple practices and shows are booked in advance, we'd have to have a real important sit down about everyone's commitment in the group and not coming to practice prepared

[Spinal Tapper]

Originally Posted by bluewine

Me, if I say more than 2 words to anyone at a rehearsal it’s a lot. I learn my parts and come in ready to execute.
[/b]

Jeez man, sounds like a real fun way to make music...no wonder you're having so many problems trying to find the right "band".

[neurotictim]

Originally Posted by LaklandBass

I suppose it all depends on how much someone holds you back.

^ This. I love the people in my band, and don't mind a bit if we're spending more time goofing off than rehearsing, for the most part. We eventually get them all done, and we plan practices with the knowledge that we aren't going to have a "arrive, practice, work out kinks, go home" kind of schedule. It's more like "arrive, catch up/smoke/bs, practice, take a break and smoke/bs, practice some more, then go home" kind of arrangement. Any given practice for my band is probably 50% "practice/rehearsal" and 50% goofing off.

We're not currently booked, but even when we were gigging regularly that schedule held true - as long as everybody was progressing at more or less the same rate. FWIW, I have always been "the prepared guy" in my bands. If someone (most notably our soon-to-be-former drummer) wasn't learning the tunes fast enough or well enough, we have a talk and try to straighten things out.

Also, when we were booking regularly, we'd schedule the last rehearsal before a gig as a literal "dry run" for that show, planning out breaks, when we would talk to the audience, extended intros or outros and blends, all so we could get a feel for the "flow" of our show.

Originally Posted by LaklandBass

As long as you dont have any crazy tempo changes or key changes during live shows you shouldnt really need to practice as a band.
In all seriousness if you can play freebird along with the cd it shouldnt matter who is playing the other instruments. If you know the song..... you know the song.

This is very true, if you're playing note-for-note covers. Many bands I know personally here in the local scene do exactly that - they may add 5 or 10 songs between gigs and not even meet except at gigs - and they do them well. My situation, it's not so easy - we all agreed that we weren't going to be a "perfect note" cover band, and more of a "give it our own flavor" cover band. Subtle difference for some, but for us it's important, and means we really do need to rehearse.

I honestly think that if you make your living playing music, that's one thing, but for most of us "day-jobbers" it's imperative to have some fun at rehearsal - keeps it from becoming too job-like.

[LaklandBass]

Originally Posted by Spinal Tapper

I like this ^

I don't think canceling practice for the night would solve any problems either. The same guys are probably just going to go home, flip on the TV, and forget to rehearse their parts for next week's rehearsal and into a downward spiral we go...

Band time together is just as important whether you're playing songs, learning material, or just goofing around.
Might sound stupid, and obviously if you're just goofing around all night, nothing will get accomplished, but that's a pretty extreme example of what I'm trying to get across...

Here's what I'd do if I was band-leader, and what's been done to me before when I wasn't prepared for practice: You make the guys SWEAT IT OUT. Right there, in front of you and the whole band, learning the material as a band. It can get extremely tedious, frustrating, sweaty, and annoying...but...

I GUARANTEE they'll come to the next practice prepared before letting that happen again. Doesn't matter how many times people have to play the parts over to get it right, don't let them give up, or put their instruments down!

Sure beats just going home for the night and being non-musical for everyone.

Obviously, if this continued through multiple practices and shows are booked in advance, we'd have to have a real important sit down about everyone's commitment in the group and not coming to practice prepared

+1,000

So true. My band usually rehearses from 7pm to 1am. We show up and chat for 30 minutes or so.... play for an hour straight... have a smoke and discuss what we should work on for the night.... work for an hour and a half or so... take a 30 minute break to chill and have a beer... work some more etc. etc. etc. ........... this is really important because we're tight as people. I havent even known these guys that long yet we are all so comfortable with each other... it makes the music go that much smoother. If you show up to practice and walk right in, put on your bass, say nothing, play the set, unplug, go home.... you arent really building a solid relationship with your bandmates. This could easily result in getting replaced down the road.
Like many say.... its a job. But at work i try to BS with all my coworkers... we chat about chicks, cars, music, movies etc etc etc... and it makes us tight as a group. This REALLY makes a difference when we need to pull together for our goals each month.
There are 3 major parts to any band....
1.Personal Talent
2.Group Talent
3.Personal Interaction/Relationships

If you work on chops at home you'll be fine on your personal talent... keep in mind though that personal talent is relative to the band and your band members. No punk band needs vic wooten on bass so if you're in a punk band and play like vic remember not to crucify your guitarist if he cant do sweeping solos.

If the band is collectively tight you will have your Group Talent... with most bands this is something that gets worked on at practice.

Your personal interaction??? this is the most important part of the three.... Personal relationships can ruin ANY band.... I think we all know of many HUGE bands that broke up due to relationships.

[warnergt]

Here's what my band does (they even did it to me). It's not a plan to
beat people up. It's merely a plan that demonstrates progress (or lack
of it). You can use it even if there is no problem. That's what makes it
good. Everything is fine if everybody is doing their part but it gets
pretty embarrassing for individuals who don't.

For each band member (this is really only necessary for band members
who don't know all the tunes) , take your set list and split it into two columns:
Column 1) Tunes that still need to be learned.
Column 2) Tunes that are ready to go.

At the start of every practice, break out the list and say, "OK, what songs
can we rehearse today that moved from column 1 to column 2?"

If there are some new tunes that are ready, this is certainly where
you want to start rehearsing.
If no new tunes are ready, it is (at least, should be) embarrassing to
the offending player. If this persists week after week, the embarrassment
should be worse and your problem should be immediately obvious even
to the most obtuse players.

Under good conditions, at the end of each rehearsal, you should be
able to ask, "OK, what songs are we going to move from column 1 to
column 2 for next week's rehearsal?"

[Spinal Tapper]

Originally Posted by LaklandBass

If you show up to practice and walk right in, put on your bass, say nothing, play the set, unplug, go home.... you arent really building a solid relationship with your bandmates. This could easily result in getting replaced down the road.

I think this could be a bigger issue than the issue of certain guys coming to practice unprepared.

To be honest, if anyone came to my band practice and acted this way, I don't think I'd care too much about even being in this particular band, let alone coming to rehearsal making sure I knew all of the material...

[BritFunk]

My Friends,

Originally Posted by Spinal Tapper

Jeez man, sounds like a real fun way to make music...no wonder you're having so many problems trying to find the right "band".

I like having fun playing music, but nevertheless I also like everyone to show up prepared. The last band I was working with (as a fill-in bassist) wanted to learn a dozen new songs in a short time. I rounded up copies of the songs, pitch-corrected anything not in standard A=440 tuning, burned them to CD for everyone in the group, dug out lyrics, verified and typed them, printed lyrics sheets for the vocalist, and even provided accurate tabs for the guitarist. I obviously also learned my bass parts and both lead and backing vocals as necessary.

They still managed to show up to rehearsals totally unprepared, not knowing their parts or having any idea of what anyone else would be playing. For a while I genuinely wondered if anyone other than myself had even listened to the material.

When the gig finally rolled around I spent most of my time feeding the rest of the band cues (when to sing, when to shut up, when to come in, lead breaks, etc.). The vocalist was reading the lyrics off of a printed sheet on a music stand at the front of the stage. Keeping everything together was exhausting and took 99% of the fun out of the gig for me.

Maybe I'm a hard@$$ after 25 years of doing this, but if you're going to work with me please have your act together, as I really don't care for babysitting other musicians. Sure, we'll have a good laugh and a beer after a great show, but if you aren't serious about honestly preparing for a great show then what's the point?

For me, the band NOT sucking is the greatest fun.

And no, I will NOT be working with that particular group again.

----
Kurt

[Spinal Tapper]

Originally Posted by BritFunk

My Friends,



I like having fun playing music, but nevertheless I also like everyone to show up prepared. The last band I was working with (as a fill-in bassist) wanted to learn a dozen new songs in a short time. I rounded up copies of the songs, pitch-corrected anything not in standard A=440 tuning, burned them to CD for everyone in the group, dug out lyrics, verified and typed them, printed lyrics sheets for the vocalist, and even provided accurate tabs for the guitarist. I obviously also learned my bass parts and both lead and backing vocals as necessary.

They still managed to show up to rehearsals totally unprepared, not knowing their parts or having any idea of what anyone else would be playing. For a while I genuinely wondered if anyone other than myself had even listened to the material.

When the gig finally rolled around I spent most of my time feeding the rest of the band cues (when to sing, when to shut up, when to come in, lead breaks, etc.). The vocalist was reading the lyrics off of a printed sheet on a music stand at the front of the stage. Keeping everything together was exhausting and took 99% of the fun out of the gig for me.

Sounds like you just set yourself up for disappointment by assuming these guys were much more responsible and hard working than yourself. This happens, a lot, I'm sure, and probably is the very same situation Bluewine is dealing with. I'm sorry you had to put in all that work to get the songs ready and they just blew it off completely. That sucks.

I think successful bands are made of reasonable expectations and compromise equally between all members. Perhaps you should've sat back for a minute and observed all of their commitment levels before you put all this hard work in that ended up leaving you high and dry for the gig.

[EddiePlaysBass]

This topic I like.

Here is what I should do: tell them all that they are wasting my time and that I spent the appropriate time learning songs and so should they.

Here is what I actually do - in this exact order:

1)suck it up and get mad inside for falling into the same trap yet again
2) post about it on line (on a different forum)
3) tell myself I will not bother any more and just quit the band
4) schedule the next rehearsal and suggest a song for everyone to learn
5) show up at rehearsal and find that no one learnt the song

This has actually been going on forever with my band. We have a 60 minute set list (and that includes encores) which we have been playing for nearly 2 years now, with minimal changes.

I have - again - decided that I want no more part in it. Next Tuesday I am normally going to a blues jam session to sort of audition for and audition a bunch of players. I think only the singer and guitarist know each other.

This will be interesting on a number of levels: I have never done an actual jam session before, blues is not the genre I normally play and I usually suck really hard during a first rehearsal (but this will be a live gig so that might be different).

If that takes off, I will let my current band bleed to death slowly.

[wideload]

I guess I have been blessed with a group that catches on fast. We just learn a new song together. Being familiar with the roadmap and song helps, but it always changes as we go. Just because someone played a certain way on the recording doesn't mean its the RIGHT way for me. Artists are always wishing they had used our arrangements, I'm sure!! Also, you sometimes have to change keys for the vocalist. You won't know that till rehearsal time, and then you have to re-remember what you've learned.

[aztomr]

I again find myself asking why do you want to be in a band?
On a different thread, you said it was for the love of playing music, yet here comes "time is money" again. Try to enjoy yourself, try taking everthing just a little bit less serious.