Unsigned (me) recording with signed artist

[P. Aaron]

Wondering...there are creative license issues here and I am not sure I am aware of all (or any) of them.

It appears I am a member of his band though our relationship at this point in in its infancy.

Will there be some contract that I will be dealing with?

Any thoughts from you experienced TB'ers will be welcome.

[ibateur]

You need to ask the artist and/or the people who have signed him. If you are contributing to compositions, then you need to speak up.

[joelb79]

What is the expectation of your playing? are you performing live with them? recording on a CD intended for national publishing and distribution? I would expect at least union scale pay (hourly) for the CD if its a national project; less if it's something smaller; and for performing there is probably another flat fee as well paid for each performance (typically). Various levels of coverage with room/board and transportation. That's what I've heard typically; however there may be other deals you can work out; and an entertainment lawyer is who you want to speak with about this.

My buddy who tours with Rare Earth doesn't pay for hotels or airline transportation; the band as a business pays that stuff. He is then paid a flat fee for each performance.

Who are you playing with in D-town? PM me if you don't want to make it a public thing. I love talking to other Michigan bass players on the tour scene.

[P. Aaron]

I am a band mate. I am playing bass on the recordings and am going to gig with them.

I know there's going to be ( should be) a written statement as to expectations, compensation for those creative moments.

This came on quickly and so as I start to take it all in, the questions start piling up.

[joelb79]

Originally Posted by P. Aaron

I am a band mate. I am playing bass on the recordings and am going to gig with them.

I know there's going to be ( should be) a written statement as to expectations, compensation for those creative moments.

This came on quickly and so as I start to take it all in, the questions start piling up.

Man enjoy it. Nothing better than some fast paced life changes.

For recording there might be some sort of credit based profit share system. That's also a typical arrangement.

[Downunderwonder]

If there is no contract you will probably get taken for a ride and your contributions stolen.

[P. Aaron]

Originally Posted by Downunderwonder

If there is no contract you will probably get taken for a ride and your contributions stolen.

Yep. These thoughts are crowding out the joy of playing music.

Get it in writing. Indeed. Will be talking again to them this coming week...details, & hashing it out.

[tmdazed]

I would also consult an attorny that deals in contract/entertainment law to get a real picture of what the story is

[ibateur]

Until you feel protected, its 4/4 root notes lol

[Downunderwonder]

Originally Posted by ibateur

Until you feel protected, its 4/4 root notes lol

If all the world's bassists stuck to that we'd all be a lot better off. If only it wasn't so much fun to play bass

[lfmn16]

Originally Posted by P. Aaron

I know there's going to be ( should be) a written statement as to expectations, compensation for those creative moments.

What are you calling a creative moment? If your "creative moment" is suggesting a new harmony, neat bass line or idea for a lead break, it is unlikely you'll receive any compensation. If you are writing the bridge to a song or lyrics then it is possible you could be compensated.

Regardless, if its not spelled out in a legally binding contract you'll probably never collect a penny regardless of the situation or contribution.

[JimmyM]

Honestly, while it's fun to count all the money you think you're going to be entitled to, you are going to run into situations with signed artists where many of them have no plan for you to be writing and getting paid for it, and you will be put on a salary or a per-gig basis and won't be collecting royalties on anything. For example, Justin MJ has spoken about how Beck is a solo artist and he writes alone and runs the band as sole boss and pays everyone a salary, and a creative moment doesn't make you a partner on his songs. And that's all there is to it and you can either take the gig or not.

So be prepared for that since most people don't become solo artists so they can make everyone else in the band rich, and then decide accordingly. If it doesn't meet your expectations, then you're free to walk, but don't shoot your nose off to spite your face...Mick Taylor left the Stones because of similar disagreements with Mick and Keith about songwriting credits, and had he stayed, he'd be in a lot better financial position than he was by leaving.

[Kmonk]

Ask what the arrangement will be, get it in writing and have an attorney who deals in contract law review it before signing.

[Wally Malone]

If the artist is on a record label signed onto the AFM's Sound Recording Labor Agreement (SRLA) then a hired side-musician would get the paid the scales and benefits in that agreement. This agreement also calls for "new use" payments should the recording be used under the terms of another AFM agreement.

Wally

[mjac28]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Honestly, while it's fun to count all the money you think you're going to be entitled to, you are going to run into situations with signed artists where many of them have no plan for you to be writing and getting paid for it, and you will be put on a salary or a per-gig basis and won't be collecting royalties on anything. For example, Justin MJ has spoken about how Beck is a solo artist and he writes alone and runs the band as sole boss and pays everyone a salary, and a creative moment doesn't make you a partner on his songs. And that's all there is to it and you can either take the gig or not.

So be prepared for that since most people don't become solo artists so they can make everyone else in the band rich, and then decide accordingly. If it doesn't meet your expectations, then you're free to walk, but don't shoot your nose off to spite your face...Mick Taylor left the Stones because of similar disagreements with Mick and Keith about songwriting credits, and had he stayed, he'd be in a lot better financial position than he was by leaving.

+1 don't go out and buy that mansion just yet you don't want to get in the artists and management faces talking about song writing credits you will more than likely than not be shown the door.

[Fergie Fulton]

Sorry to say, but solo artists or signed artists salary the help, you are the help, so you get a salary.
Now what you expect to be salary and what you expect to be expenses, may not be the same as your employers idea. They have as much of a duty to look after you correctly as you have in doing the job correctly.
So just make sure you both agree on what are considered expenses, then get it in writing.
But remember this, of you do your job well, someone else may want your services, and as you are only an employee, its up to your employer to make sure you are happy or lose you to some else who will.

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by ibateur

Until you feel protected, its 4/4 root notes lol

Originally Posted by Downunderwonder

If all the world's bassists stuck to that we'd all be a lot better off. If only it wasn't so much fun to play bass

If all the world's bassists stuck to that, there would rarely be any sense of creativity, artistry or innovation whatsoever. And that's not music. It might be something, but music it is not!

MM

[MysticMichael]

Originally Posted by JimmyM

Mick Taylor left the Stones because of similar disagreements with Mick and Keith about songwriting credits, and had he stayed, he'd be in a lot better financial position than he was by leaving.

True. But Mick Taylor also left the Stones because, had he stayed, the chronic sleep deprivation and constant drug binging probably would have killed him. And he's said as much - more than once.

It's too bad that Mick Taylor had to miss out on all that extra fame & glory...not to mention all that extra money. Then again, it's too bad that Mick & Keith are such a couple of heartless, self-absorbed, narcissistic bastards (especially Jagger). But at least Mick Taylor is still alive...

MM

[Bassbubble11]

I would ask what your compensation will be no matter what your contribution.

[ibateur]

Originally Posted by MysticMichael

If all the world's bassists stuck to that, there would rarely be any sense of creativity, artistry or innovation whatsoever. And that's not music. It might be something, but music it is not!

MM

The 'lol' meant "don't take me seriously", just saying