Using DI live

ndrly · #1 09-03-2007, 10:33 PM

I've only really seen bands perform in a couple of pubs (I went to see Hassle Jackson live, my sister's in that band, and I saw some other bands there as well). I'm pretty sure PA support is not required there. But I have a question...

How do bass players perform using DI boxes live? I mean, Geddy Lee and Justin Chancellor do it. But how?

In two of the bars I went to, there was a DJ at the opposite end of the stage. I think he was responsible for the house sound system. The singer in one of the bands asked for some reverb, and I think she was addressing him.

If I want to use DI live, and I have to plug the box into the house sound system, which is at the opposite end of the stage, then that's gonna be a problem. Then there'll be a big wire between me and the sound system, and the audience might accidentally trip over it, or unplug it. I can't have that during a live performance.

Or maybe the PA support is behind the stage, and the DJ was just controlling it from there. I dunno. Little help?

It's just that I find the way Justin Chancellor sets up live is quite interesting. He splits his signal three ways.

1. He plugs in direct to the house sound system. This is his clean, unaffected channel.
2. He uses most of his effects through one Mesa Boogie/Gallien-Krueger setup. This is his "wet" setup.
3. The dry out of his whammy pedal goes through a ProCo RAT and BOSS GEB-7 to another Mesa Boogie/Gallien-Krueger setup. This is his dirty channel.

I think that's an interesting setup, which I would like to have. Except I would use different equipment. I think I'd prefer a box that has both a DI and 1/4 out (the DI goes to the PA and the 1/4 goes to the rest of my effects). I'd use a different pedalboard. And last, but not least, I think I'd use Ashdown instead of the Mesa/GK setup he uses.

msquared · #2 09-03-2007, 11:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ndrly

How do bass players perform using DI boxes live? I mean, Geddy Lee and Justin Chancellor do it. But how?

While the "how" for them is different than the "how" might be for you, the general idea is the same: bass -> DI -> sound system with maybe a stack of amps or effects in there somewhere.

I've never seen a DI which didn't have both XLR and 1/4" outputs. This is so that you can run a signal to your $5000 amp and use it as a stage monitor while the sound guy either dials in your sound perfectly or mangles it beyond recognition, depending on whether you bribed him or not.

biff brown · #3 09-03-2007, 11:20 PM

at larger shows Ive used both my amp and house pa. My amp and wireless have di outs. usually I use pre eq on mine so the sound guy doesnt have to do any thing. I have an ashdown by the way. the wiring is always set up in the clubs so just find a wire alet the sound guy know which one or ask which one to use. they usually have it organized per instrument anyways

ndrly · #4 09-04-2007, 12:18 AM

Where's the PA exactly? Is it behind the stage or something?

kalipigeon · #5 09-04-2007, 12:31 AM

Most places I've played have a cable snake running from one box at the stage to a box at the sound booth. They just patch you in from your DI box to the stage box. For smaller places, the sound guy is usually off to the side and not in the way of the audience.

And +1 on the Ashdown, my ABM 500 has helped me out of more fixes than I can remember with that DI out

ndrly · #6 09-04-2007, 03:04 AM

I'm actually checking out Ashdown's Classic series. Looks interesting. But will it work for me?

Maj. Lee FUBAR · #7 09-04-2007, 09:02 PM

Most places will have a "snake" which is essentially a box which consolidates all the wiring into one unit. It has a box on the stage side where you plug your XLR output from your DI into it (as well as all the other DI's, mics, etc.), and the one big cable is run to the mixing board, where it is split back into the single channels. Each one is numbered so you can tell which belongs to which.

On the large pro setups, they will have two mixing boards, one for the "stage sound" that mixes the monitors (what the band hears) next to the stage, and one for the "front of the house" out in the audience, that mixes what the audience will hear. They may still use a snake, or you may plug right into the stage mixer who will then send signal via snake to the front of house mixer. It can get complicated, but if you get guys who know what they're doing, it can be very nice indeed. The stage mixer can give you exactly what you want to hear into your monitor, and can customize it for each member of the band. I've only done a couple gigs like that, but it was a nice luxury.

Hope that helps.

MLF

badstonebass · #8 09-05-2007, 09:49 AM

Geedy Lee uses a Sansamp(and I am sure other devices) to achive to tone he wants. That signal goes to FOH and to his IEM's. RUSH runs the whole band through IEM's so stage sound is not even remotly important.

If you are going to DI a good monitor system is really needed. Either regular stage monitors or IEMs.

Personally unless I am using really good IEMs I prefer an amp and cab. That way I get to set my sound the way I want onstage. I run one signal from my Sansamp to my rig, the other goes to FOH. That way FOH does not effect what I want to hear onstage.

the few times I played with only a "DI" I thought it sucked. Monitors are usually the place where Pa's cut corners. hearing your bass(or not hearing) just from the monitors can really suck badly.

Baird6869 · #9 09-05-2007, 10:01 AM

I use an Ampeg setup on stage and DI out from my Sansamp fo FOH. Like Geddy but without the dryers or chicken roasters!

bluestarbass · #10 09-06-2007, 08:22 AM

Sorta while were ont the topic. I remeber a few years ago swr made a bass specific monitor. What would happen if you just got a monitor you really liked and used that as well as a DI, instead of using the monitors there. Youd have a sound you could rely on and much less porting gear around.

Pbassred · #11 09-06-2007, 11:43 AM

Don't sweat it.

A DI box is used to get the cleanest (most faithful) possible signal into the desk. Sound guys prefer this to micing up the cab
1/one less stand to fall over/bump out of position.
2/one less source of feedback. (It doesn't stop the band accusing you however).
3/Jacking up your stage volume doesn't screw up his FOH mix.

I take a bass Pod and split between amp and PA from there. Standard. There's no debate. Job done.
I've also DIed into the PA on smaller gigs. No amp.

If the singer can use a wired mic, you can use a DI box.

About the 3way set up; sounds complicated to me. The PA rig needs to get feeds from ALL signal sources or it doesn't go through the FOH. So, why not just send the sound that the audience aught to hear? - unless he's not in control of his own sound.