We want to kick our rhythm guitarist.

[FighttheSilence]

First off, we are all juniors in high school (excpet our singer who is a freshman in college) and we are starting to progress as musicians. We have a 4 song demo out and we are selling shirts. We live in a place where metal bands have a tough time getting a show, much less a good sized crowd, but we are actually starting to get both. We feel he's holding us back (he hasn't wrote a single riff and he never learns his parts clean). We always have to babysit him to make sure he practices (which he doesnt). His moms a biatch and wont let him go to week day practices and stay late on weekends. His stage presence totally sucks in comparision to the rest of us. We are thinking about moving forward with out him.

Problem is, he's my best friend and good friends with all the other guys in the band (but at times he hates our lead guitarist, and he always disses me at practice, not in a joking way even, and he sucks at guitar and Im a pretty good bassist). Plus, he has low self esteam, we don't want him to do anything stupid if we kick him out. So we all voted to kick him out but we want to have a band theorapy session before kicking him out. Our manager is in favor of us removing him if we feel its right. Anyways she is going to help us when we talk to him about it.

Heres our choices:
1. Kick him out (he's disappointed us many times before)
2. Give him 1 more chance to impress us (and seriously impress us)
3. Let him stay in and allow him to hold us back from our dreams of making it big (or at least playing at Warped Tour or a summer tour in a few summers).

Number 1 seems like the best. Any help is good.

[grifff]

Number one or two.

[stflbn]

You just have to decide what is more important to you.

1. His friendship to you and the rest of the band.

2. The potential 1 in 1,000,000+ chance you'll ever 'make it' as a band even without him. Which is probably being conservative.

3. Just wanting to make better music regardless of making it or his friendship.

[southernrocker]

Kick him out!

[Thor]

Why would you kick him?


Come to jesus meeting time. 'We are restructuring the band,
it's now going to be a heavy metal polka band, you're good with that right? No? Ok, we got a guy who is."

[brekfustuvluzer]

Originally Posted by FighttheSilence

We live in a place where metal bands have a tough time getting a show, much less a good sized crowd,

where do you live? i must move there . . .

[ThunderLizard]

High School band with a manager = Drama.

[FighttheSilence]

Originally Posted by brekfustuvluzer

where do you live? i must move there . . .

haha, I take it your not much of a metal head. I live in South West Minnesota. Closest major venue are is in Sioux Falls, SD or the Twin Cities.

[geeza]

Originally Posted by ThunderLizard

High School band with a manager = Drama.

Sounds more like a movie on the Disney Channel.

[FighttheSilence]

Originally Posted by ThunderLizard

High School band with a manager = Drama.

We do have some drama now with our situation, but once its resolved it'll go back to the good old days of envying our singer for getting **** way to much, our lead guitarist for being self loving whining bitch, our drummer constantly being confused yet having a mega hot swedish girlfriend, and the bassist who hates religion and is a total ******* (for for the harsh words but its all true).

[Rattman]

Originally Posted by grifff

Number one or two.

Yeah... sad scene but I suppose if you all feel that strongly about the situation, sounds like you have a semi-solution for the issue anyway. On other 'other side of the coin' however, what happens to the friendship and who have you got to fill his slot?

[krovx]

Doesn't really sound like he is a true friend. Why not confront him with everything you said right here and be like, " If it was anyone else, we would of kicked them to the curb, (as well as their teeth) but we want to give you once more chance to see if really want to be a part of this." I always think it is fair to give someone a chance after calling them out on b.s. You guys are still young, and there are many fish in the sea. Bands would flow so much easier if people were real and did not try to live up to some superficial image. Just don't be random pussies and kick him out by regrouping or something petty like that. Call him out, true friends will respect that. Does it really matter if you lose someone as a friend if they are that superficial? This is coming from a guy who had to grow up rather fast and does not have an issue speaking his mind.

[ZombieBRAINS!!]

whats the point in having a manager at your level?

[scsm]

I'll give my experience.

When I was a freshmen in high school I kicked out my best friend since grade school from my band and seven years later I sometimes regret it. He didn't speak to any of us for about 2 years after, really until the band broke up 3 years later. My friend and I are on speaking terms now and I will hang with him sometimes but it still feels like there is an elephant in the room.

The chances of you "making it" are slim, the chances of completely destroying your friendship are huge. So I think really you have to ask yourself "Whats more important the friendship I have with this guy, or playing decent music for a few years with this band".

[Bassman203]

Make fun of him back and criticize his playing until he begins to hate practices. Schedule a few without him. Schedule a gig at a time when you know he can't show up.

Sooner or later he'll quit, then after a while you can joke about it if you really want to be friends.

This is the non-confrontational little girl way of doing it, but I'm still friends with two kids that got kicked out pretty much this way. My band's got kicking people out down to an art


If he didn't sound like a jerk at practice, I would be more timid about kicking him out, but if he really acts like that towards you give him the boot.

[TortillaChip520]

honestly, just kick him out and find someone new. my old band went through the same thing, it was our drummer and rhythm guitarist. you don't wanna waste any time with him that you could be using to find someone else.
it sucks when it's a good friend, but you just gotta let him down easy and get it over with. you guys are still in highschool, there's no use worrying about people you aren't going to see anymore a year from now if it's going to hold you back from your future.

[topcat2069]

Is he a Bad business partner? Is he good or bad for the Band?

You can be a Business or a pal's club, can't be both.

[Stumbo]

Here's a technique that I think helps make the issues more clear:

BAND
Pros:
1) we are starting to progress as musicians.
2) We have a 4 song demo out and we are selling shirts. 3) We live in a place where metal bands have a tough time getting a show, much less a good sized crowd, but we are actually starting to get both.

Cons:
1) We feel he's holding us back
2) (he hasn't wrote a single riff
3) he never learns his parts clean.
4)We always have to babysit him to make sure he practices (which he doesnt).
5) His moms a biatch and wont let him go to week day practices and stay late on weekends.
6) His stage presence totally sucks in comparison to the rest of us.


PERSONAL
Pros
1) Problem is, he's my best friend
2)and good friends with all the other guys in the band
3) and Im a pretty good bassist).

Cons
1) (but at times he hates our lead guitarist,
2)and he always disses me at practice, not in a joking way even,
3) and he sucks at guitar


[OT] Somethings are out of your control
1) Plus, he has low self esteam,
2) we don't want him to do anything stupid if we kick him out.

So we all voted to kick him out but we want to have a band therapy session before kicking him out.

You're not therapists so you'll be in over your head if you try to do a "therapy" session. I know you're trying to "protect" his feelings but a loss of any sort is something that we all have to go through. If he wants/needs therapy, that's up to him and his family.

she is going to help us when we talk to him about it.

Is your manager a therapist? If not, you're all in over your head. A real therapist wouldn't be attempting to do therapy with someone who hasn't agreed to it.

Btw, I live with a real family therapist and am very familiar with what it takes to do therapy

Heres our choices:
1. Kick him out (he's disappointed us many times before)
2. Give him 1 more chance to impress us (and seriously impress us)
3. Let him stay in and allow him to hold us back from our dreams of making it big (or at least playing at Warped Tour or a summer tour in a few summers).

Number 1 seems like the best. Any help is good

Since you already voted him out, your list is a moot point. I suggest you (and the band) stop by his house, let him know the outcome of the band's decision and leave a copy of this thread with him.

The reason I suggest you stop by his house is that you can leave at any time and keep things under control, if necessary. I suggest you also stay outside.

IMO, a clean break is what is needed. Any "therapy" you, the band or the manager tries will probably cause things to blow up and create more animosity and drama where none need exist. And that's something you can't handle, especially if his parent's are not in attendance and the "adult" manager tries to intervene. Lawsuits have been filed for less.

Good luck.

[brekfustuvluzer]

Originally Posted by FighttheSilence

haha, I take it your not much of a metal head. I live in South West Minnesota. Closest major venue are is in Sioux Falls, SD or the Twin Cities.

i like pantera and a bunch of european stuff, but i live in dallas where there are all these disturbed/staind wannabes. metal and country are HUGE here, but theres not much for a motown/classic rock/indie rock bassist.

[stinger12345]

By the sounds of it I would have gave him the axe daaaays ago.