What would you do?

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by bradjonesbass

I have played with a singer/guitarist off and on for a couple of years now. Basically, he books gigs where he needs a band and calls me, a drummer and lead guitarist, sometimes a keyboardist if he can afford it. Sends a set list and basic charts and we just show up and jam. I played with him a month ago, 2 weeks ago and have another gig scheduled next Friday. Two weeks ago he wrote me a check covering that night, the night two weeks before and half of December 7. Check bounced, as did the guitarist's, who I brought in, and the drummer's. He claims bank's fault, supposed to meet us tonight to pay us. No shows us... Get a text an hour later saying his dad had a heart attack and he'll pay us all in cash at the gig before we set up... I sent his sister a message on Facebook saying I was sorry to hear about her dad and hoped he recovered soon... Her reply? Huh? I have a feeling we're going to get screwed either way, but I know the only hope we have of getting paid is showing up next week - it's in Lafayette, IN, which is about a 3 hour drive... What would you do? BTW, check was for $375...

Simple. Say you're not making the drive until everyone's paid in full. But first, go try to cash the check again, and try every day until he has enough money in his account.

[two fingers]

As stated earlier, have some music ready to play as a 3 piece. If your guy is this unreliable this suddenly, he may no-show the gig and you guys would be the hero for playing the night anyway. If he does show up, get paid for everything you have done up until now, or don't play WITH HIM. You can run inside to the manager and tell him what has happened and that you are ready to put on a show. Who knows? He may just say go for it. But DO NOT play a note of the new show until paid for previous work.

The only caveat to this is future gigs at that club. If you guys all agree that you really want regular show there later, and I mean REALLY want shows there later, then you may just suck it up and play the thing.

Best of luck either way.

[MarkMgibson]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

Simple. Say you're not making the drive until everyone's paid in full. But first, go try to cash the check again, and try every day until he has enough money in his account.

Doesn't work that way (at least not in Australia). Once a check is bounced, it's also cancelled. I would wait until just before the gig, then he'll have the guy over a barrel. Giving him a dodgy check is one thing, but lying about his father having a heart attack is well out of order. A few people I know would have decked him for that sort of dishonesty.

[Stumbo]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

Simple. Say you're not making the drive until everyone's paid in full. But first, go try to cash the check again, and try every day until he has enough money in his account.

I just call the bank. IME, they'll tell you in round numbers what's in the account: low three figures, high three figures, low four figures, etc.

[Munjibunga]

Originally Posted by MarkMgibson

Doesn't work that way (at least not in Australia). Once a check is bounced, it's also cancelled. I would wait until just before the gig, then he'll have the guy over a barrel. Giving him a dodgy check is one thing, but lying about his father having a heart attack is well out of order. A few people I know would have decked him for that sort of dishonesty.

... bleedin' ozzies.

[Marginal Tom]

I certainly wouldn't leave Fort Wayne without the cash in my pocket. I'd also threaten to go to the police if necessary to collect my back pay, even if the show in Lafayette is cancelled and he has to pay you later.

[MarkMgibson]

Originally Posted by Munjibunga

... bleedin' ozzies.

Yeah, we're a strange lot - our water even goes down the drain clockwise.

[marmadaddy]

Be totally up front with him.

Call him and tell him that you know his father didn't have a heart attack, you know he's been lying to you. Demand that he be up front with you about what's going on and if he actually has the money to pay you. Not if he wants to pay you and thinks he can, but "are you going to be paid in full that day, yes or no".

Also, call the venue, explain that you're booked to come in as the backing band for the s/s, what your plans are and see if it would be helpful towards getting booked there.

After these two conversations you'd have a much better idea of whether or not it would be worthwhile making the long drive and spending a night playing behind this idiot.

[bolophonic]

Originally Posted by Jeb

Great! How would you go about doing that exactly?

The last time I got blatantly stiffed on a gig was years ago. A percussionist sat in with a little combo that i had joined and we played the patio at the opening of a restaurant. At the end of the night, we discovered that the new guy had somehow convinced the owner that he was the responsible party and intercepted the money before disappearing for the night. I visited the guy at his store about a week later (he was a business owner) and instructed him to put his brand new set of congas into my truck. He did, and I kept them in lieu of my share of the cash.

In this case, I would probably take the advice in this thread of heading to the next show with my gear and a set prepared with the other members. I would get the cash in hand from the singer before loading in and then notify the guy that I was repossessing his gig and his band and send him on his way.

[MatticusMania]

Originally Posted by bradjonesbass

I have played with a singer/guitarist off and on for a couple of years now. Basically, he books gigs where he needs a band and calls me, a drummer and lead guitarist, sometimes a keyboardist if he can afford it. Sends a set list and basic charts and we just show up and jam. I played with him a month ago, 2 weeks ago and have another gig scheduled next Friday. Two weeks ago he wrote me a check covering that night, the night two weeks before and half of December 7. Check bounced, as did the guitarist's, who I brought in, and the drummer's. He claims bank's fault, supposed to meet us tonight to pay us. No shows us... Get a text an hour later saying his dad had a heart attack and he'll pay us all in cash at the gig before we set up... I sent his sister a message on Facebook saying I was sorry to hear about her dad and hoped he recovered soon... Her reply? Huh? I have a feeling we're going to get screwed either way, but I know the only hope we have of getting paid is showing up next week - it's in Lafayette, IN, which is about a 3 hour drive... What would you do? BTW, check was for $375...

I would show up to the next gig, but not take a single piece of gear out of my car until I was paid. If he doesnt pay prior to set up, well then Id take the drive home and cut ties with the guy.

[RustyAxe]

Live and learn. Don't do the gig. Don't call him to cancel. Don't ever answer his calls. Tell everyone you know about the dirt bag. Chalk it up to experience.

[MarkMgibson]

Originally Posted by marmadaddy

Be totally up front with him.

Call him and tell him that you know his father didn't have a heart attack, you know he's been lying to you. Demand that he be up front with you about what's going on and if he actually has the money to pay you. Not if he wants to pay you and thinks he can, but "are you going to be paid in full that day, yes or no".

Also, call the venue, explain that you're booked to come in as the backing band for the s/s, what your plans are and see if it would be helpful towards getting booked there.

After these two conversations you'd have a much better idea of whether or not it would be worthwhile making the long drive and spending a night playing behind this idiot.

No way you should call the venue. Management guys don't care about your arguments, and involving them in it makes you look like an amateur. Sort it out yourself - beat the sh*t out him if you want, but don't involve club owners; they couldn't give a toss.

[bradjonesbass]

Originally Posted by derrico1

Knickerbockers is a cool old venue, but I wouldn't drive across the state to see whether he'll pay so we could play there.

He has a week to pay you in Ft. Wayne. In your shoes, I'd be asking for the back pay now, in a friendly, but just-business manner. Depending on my relationship w/ the BL, I might suggest that we can work out a (short) timetable if for some reason he can't swing the money now. But even that might require some collateral, given his recent track-record.

We told him today, we need payment in full, including the Knickerbockers gig before we're driving 3 hours each way for the gig.

[bradjonesbass]

Originally Posted by Exploiter8

Explain the situation to management at Knickerbockers. Ask if the dud(e) has been paid upfront. Ask management to let you G'Mule it without said dud(e).

And call Knickerbockers to verify you really are scheduled for that night.

http://www.knickerbockersaloon.com/shows/calendar

X8

It's on the schedule...

[tZer]

Originally Posted by bradjonesbass

We told him today, we need payment in full, including the Knickerbockers gig before we're driving 3 hours each way for the gig.

What did he say?

Keep us posted. I am eager to see how this pans out.

FWIW, I think you made the right decision.

[boristhespider9]

Originally Posted by MarkMgibson

No way you should call the venue. Management guys don't care about your arguments, and involving them in it makes you look like an amateur. Sort it out yourself - beat the sh*t out him if you want, but don't involve club owners; they couldn't give a toss.

Agreed.

Loved the "give me your congas" story!

[bradjonesbass]

Originally Posted by tZer

What did he say?

Keep us posted. I am eager to see how this pans out.

FWIW, I think you made the right decision.

He's supposed to meet me Monday... We'll see...

[JohnMCA72]

+1 on getting paid before any gear gets unloaded at the next gig.

+1 again, if you can get him to pay you what he owes you Monday.

I'm not too keen on letting him know that you know he's lied to you. Let him think you don't know, & maybe hold onto that knowledge for a time when the leverage is more valuable.

I have people that I won't work with unless I'm paid cash, up front. They also get charged a higher rate - I call it my "Douchebag Tax". Those who won't or can't pay more & pay it up front don't call me anymore, which suits me just fine. Some of them, I have priced high for that very reason, that I don't want to work with them.

[tZer]

With guys like this, I find it best to keep them at an arms length, get everything upfront and only deal in short, sweet sentences until you've gotten everything you are owed. After the gig, sever all ties and don't take his phone calls.

[obimark]

Hell yeah!

Originally Posted by electracoyote

Cash up front from now on. Pull up to the venue and sit there in your car until he shows up and puts cash in your hand. Then unload and set up. No cash, no gig. Drive away.

Or keep letting this guy play you like a fiddle.