Why I won't play gigs with newbie bands anymore and one certain club...(LONG rant)

Ubersheist · #1 02-09-2009, 11:06 AM

So, this is a common story about mismanagement from the bar, and a newbie band screwing it up for the rest of us. Old story, but it hasn't happened to me in a while and I'm still pissed.

[rant]
So, we had a gig Friday that didn't go as well as we had hoped. All signs leading up to the gig said "don't play it!" But we did anyway...

Here's the gist of it:

We set up the show last October with certain parameters (pay, bands, time slots, etc.).
We were given control to find a headlining band to our liking. We found a damned good one with a sound that compliments ours very well. It took a ton of work to find this band and get it all done.
The bar double books the night with a bar manager's friend's band that's brand new, and promise them that they won't have to open.
The bar doesn't tell us about a bunch of changes at all (set lengths, time slots, payments,etc.). I found out about the additional band when I looked at the bar's website 2 weeks before the gig. They had no intention of telling us due to miscommunication on their part between their staff members.
The bar goes back on it's word on almost every single previously agreed upon issue. I could go into detail about this, but it would be a terribly long and dull read.
The headliner that we set up so that we'd be part of a killer show with good bands that compliment each other cancels because he got the shaft from this club last time, too, and this was the last straw. We now had 1 week to prepare for a set that would be about 1 1/2 hours long, or twice as long as we previously agreed upon.
The newbie band gets started late, and takes absolutely forever to tear down, leaving us with only a 1/2 hour to play. We were just starting to really get into it, and the crowd (what little was left) was just starting to get into us when the house lights went on and they gave us the "one more song" warning.

At least the club's management was apologetic, and knew that we got screwed. However, this isn't the first time that we've gotten screwed at this club.

The lessons we learned were:

If you take the time and energy to set up a whole show, get anything you can in writing. Have them always handy whenever you're dealing with the club management.
We will never play again with a newbie band unless they're all obviously seasoned players with experience in the scene.
We'll never play that specific club again. This is twice in a row that they've screwed us over. While they did say that the previous booker will no longer be booking with that club, we have too sour of a taste in our collective mouths.
We will never play a show with that specific band again.

Ug... what a disappointing night. I'm glossing over a ton, too. So much work, and then... Ug...

On top of it all, our singer had severe pains all day and night. It turns out that he had a kidney stone that was working it's way out of him. He went straight to the ER after the show. What an eff-ing trooper!

DudeistMonk · #2 02-09-2009, 12:28 PM

That sucks man...Digging your link already though and I just clicked it 30 seconds ago.

Jehos · #3 02-09-2009, 12:59 PM

And this is why you get a contract well before the show. You should have had it in writing before you even found the awesome headliner band.

BigOldHarry · #4 02-09-2009, 01:03 PM

If this was a showcase gig... Welcome to the showcase world. Get some rep and this won't happen.

If this was a paying gig - so long as you got the same $$, no need to gripe. I recall playing a paying gig once where something similar happened - we played for all of 20 min and collected a night's pay. I was cool with that!

unbridled · #5 02-09-2009, 01:04 PM

That sucks.

That's part of the reason I just don't get the whole deal where the bar basically wants the band to do all the work, sell all the tickets, etc. If they are going to do that, I say you are the promotor and the bar staff should stay the heck out of it. You put the whole show together just to have them ruin it.

martyman5000 · #6 02-09-2009, 01:14 PM

If you were only left with 1/2 hour left you should have packed up your gear before that happened and been on the way to the ER.

**DougD** · #7 02-09-2009, 01:26 PM

Man, I wish there was some sort of black list of bars and clubs that make a habit of doing that to bands

.. Hey theres an idea

Ubersheist · #8 02-09-2009, 02:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DougD

Man, I wish there was some sort of black list of bars and clubs that make a habit of doing that to bands

.. Hey theres an idea

That is an Excellent idea. It would be nice if there was a site for musicians specifically to tell about both positive and negative experiences at a venue. Hmm... does anyone know about this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by unbridled

That sucks.

That's part of the reason I just don't get the whole deal where the bar basically wants the band to do all the work, sell all the tickets, etc. If they are going to do that, I say you are the promotor and the bar staff should stay the heck out of it. You put the whole show together just to have them ruin it.

Exactly. We're trying to create a vibe for shows with several local bands. We (and a few other local bands) are trying to create a sort of mini scene, with shows that guarantee all good bands that compliment our music. We want the control, and we don't mind having to sell the tickets to certain shows because we know we'll sell well. The bar's management threw a big monkey wrench into the whole process.

Oh well... We've got some minor, super low pressure shows coming up, but after that, we'll spend several months getting new songs down and getting ready for the summer shows.

Ubersheist · #9 02-09-2009, 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BigOldHarry

If this was a showcase gig... Welcome to the showcase world. Get some rep and this won't happen.

If this was a paying gig - so long as you got the same $$, no need to gripe. I recall playing a paying gig once where something similar happened - we played for all of 20 min and collected a night's pay. I was cool with that!

Well, this wasn't really a showcase gig, but more of one for us then usual. Sacramento doesn't have the showcase shows like some of the bigger cities. We have to make our own. So, we hired a photographer that night. We also had a couple of event planners and promoters stop by to check us out who were interested in booking us into festivals, too. We were also going to get the whole show video taped, but that fell through at the last minute due to forces beyond our control.

I think the icing on the cake is when the bouncer was kicking everyone out, and started physically removing my girlfriend, the singer's girlfriend, and the photographer we hired.

W - T - F ??? Yeah the guy was brand new to bouncing, but... really??? We spoke to the manager who set him straight. Just after that, a 'new' lady friend of the drummer's came back out from the bathroom, and the bouncer started trying to kick her out even though we said "she's with the band!" His response - something like "the boss said those three can say, but he didn't say nothin' about her!"

Egads... so lame...

T-Bird · #10 02-09-2009, 03:04 PM

Hi.

That really sucks. Badly. Hope You got paid and your singer is recovering, didn't get any infections or anything.

A similar thing happened to us a while ago. A long one too.

We were supposed to again play in the MC club our drummer and our singer, his GF, are members of, a B-day party of the prospect. There was supposed to be a youngster band before us. Cool. They wanted to use our stuff and all but the drummer agreed. Then, at the last minute another local, well, booze-band really, wanted to play too. Just Great.

We have a 4*40 setlist, so things started to look rather dim when the clock stroke 2100 and the first band hadn't even started yet. The booze driven band didn't want to play as they weren't in the mood yet. The singer had been getting into the mood for the past 2 days so we promptly told the b-day boy that if we didn't have the stage cleared by 2300, we wouldn't play, at all. The winos played their terrible set, they were in the mood all right and when they finished, I left to give our guitarist a ride. When we came back 45 minutes later, no one were playing and I thought, this just might work. Then a realization hit me like a wet sock across my face, the second band hadn't even started yet.

They were waiting someone to come watch their set, which almost resulted me saying pretty bad things to the youngsters. What was worst the person they were expecting was a fake negro white boy

(didn't even know people like that existed), in snow white hip-hop clothes. Goes really well in a biker club with 150 big hairy bikers in leathers

. When the kids finished, they vanished. Their GFs almost crapped themselves when we told that the stage clears now and that means NOW. So while the boys were mostly mingling, the tiny, hot girls, they were loading out. I felt a bit bad for them, but the tension was quite high.

We played until 3Am and had a hell of a time. Most of the crowd left while we were setting up though and that was a bummer. Never again will we play there last if there's more bands than just us.

Just my 0.02€
Sam

MatticusMania · #11 02-09-2009, 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ubersheist

That is an Excellent idea. It would be nice if there was a site for musicians specifically to tell about both positive and negative experiences at a venue. Hmm... does anyone know about this?

Actually yes, this dude in a SoCal band that I was corresponding with had started something like that down here, however I dont think he managed to keep it up.

the_evil_monk · #12 02-09-2009, 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MatticusMania

Actually yes, this dude in a SoCal band that I was corresponding with had started something like that down here, however I dont think he managed to keep it up.

Any idea why he quit? I have actually been putting together the framework for something like this...figured it could be a tremendous resource for all of us!!

BOSS302BASS · #13 02-09-2009, 06:18 PM

You guys need to book another gig with the noob band, and plan ahead...
Just before they go on stage, rub oil all over their fretboards and spin all their tuning pegs so they are TOTALLY outta tune. Then spray some Rotten Egg gas liquid into the backs of their Marshalls so as the valves heat up, the audience will realize they stink(that's if they can even re-tune) and if they get through all that chaos, ninja up in black and run out while they're still tryin to play and dack 'em! Then get into their Winnebago and spray GLUE - STRONG STUFF - onto their gas pedal so things go real bad for them when they try to chase you down the highway!

the_evil_monk · #14 02-09-2009, 08:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BOSS302BASS

Then get into their Winnebago and spray GLUE - STRONG STUFF - onto their gas pedal so things go real bad for them when they try to chase you down the highway!

Yeah...and then you need to go crash your car through a mall while being chased by every cop in the state...and then play a gig at the Palace Ballroom...before getting the money for the penguin...

Skarekrough · #15 02-10-2009, 10:20 AM

Apologies don't cost anything to dole out and usually don't actually account for anything material or in the long run.

I can count on one hand the number of times a bar manager has expressed remorse when I used the phrase "you screwed us the last time" (well, maybe not in those exact terms).

One thing I have found is that being "helpful" by "assisting" a band breaking down and getting off stage does wonders to motivate them. If they don't get the point then consider a nice little chain of band members tossing gear to the off-stage area. They'll figure it out soon enough.

kraigo · #16 02-10-2009, 10:36 AM

We just put their gear in the middle of the dance floor with a "Free gear!" sign on it. Problem solved.

For most of my gigs there are connections between the bands. Rarely do we have to deal with that kind of crap.

KO

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skarekrough

Apologies don't cost anything to dole out and usually don't actually account for anything material or in the long run.

I can count on one hand the number of times a bar manager has expressed remorse when I used the phrase "you screwed us the last time" (well, maybe not in those exact terms).

One thing I have found is that being "helpful" by "assisting" a band breaking down and getting off stage does wonders to motivate them. If they don't get the point then consider a nice little chain of band members tossing gear to the off-stage area. They'll figure it out soon enough.

Ubersheist · #17 02-10-2009, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kraigo

For most of my gigs there are connections between the bands. Rarely do we have to deal with that kind of crap.

That's what we attempted to do before the management screwed us, and usually do for most of our gigs. Ug.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skarekrough

One thing I have found is that being "helpful" by "assisting" a band breaking down and getting off stage does wonders to motivate them. If they don't get the point then consider a nice little chain of band members tossing gear to the off-stage area. They'll figure it out soon enough.

Yeah... we did that. I helped the bass player with his amp, and the turntablist with some of his stuff. The drummer helped the other drummer carry stuff off the stage.

I kick-started them into doing anything about a 1/2 hour after they were done (while we were pacing around the stage like sharks) by grabbing our drummer's cymbol bag and tossing it next to the drummer's still set up kit, and said "Hey, lemme place this here for a while 'till you get torn down, OK?"

Man, it was strange... As soon as they were done, they split. All their stuff was still on the stage, and no one was around.

Stinkin' newbies...

Ug... Ok... I think I'm done rehashing the night. Thanks y'all for letting me rant!

kdiggity · #18 02-10-2009, 10:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MatticusMania

Actually yes, this dude in a SoCal band that I was corresponding with had started something like that down here, however I dont think he managed to keep it up.

Why doesn't TB just add a new forum called Venues or something, where people can post both good and bad reviews, stories, etc.?

Maybe even do two sub-forums, one for venues from a player standpoint, and one from a patron standpoint (that would help me find some cool places to visit for a pint when I'm visiting a new area!).

Seems like a simple enough solution?

MatticusMania · #19 02-10-2009, 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by the_evil_monk

Any idea why he quit? I have actually been putting together the framework for something like this...figured it could be a tremendous resource for all of us!!

Honestly, Im not even sure he quit. I just happened to lose contact with the guy, but thinking about it now I just remembered where I could possibly have his email.

Yup, just found it. I'll write him an email and see if he's kept up on that endeavor and ask him if he doesnt mind me passing along his email to you.

MatticusMania · #20 02-10-2009, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by kdiggity

Why doesn't TB just add a new forum called Venues or something, where people can post both good and bad reviews, stories, etc.?

Maybe even do two sub-forums, one for venues from a player standpoint, and one from a patron standpoint (that would help me find some cool places to visit for a pint when I'm visiting a new area!).

Seems like a simple enough solution?

That doesnt sound like a bad idea really, but it would take some effort on TB's part to organize and moderate.