Why the transition to one nighters?

[MrLenny1]

Yup, all one nighters here in N.E.
An occasional Fri-Sat combo but very rare.
I use to gig out 3-5 nights a week back in the day.
People still say they'd rather hear a live band but
really don't support them anymore.

[powmetalbassist]

Originally Posted by Stumbo

The first year of the Baby Boomers(BBs) turned 18 was in 1964. The last year of the Baby Boomers turning 18 in 1982.

Let's say all the BBs went clubbing, partying, etc. until they were 30 y.o. That gives a time period of 1964 to 1994 (30 years) that the US had about 77 million people (with some money) available to attend clubs, bars,concerts etc. During that time the biggest advances music tech wise was going from reel to reel tape to vinyl to cassette tape to CD's. Sure there were smaller players like Walkman but they were expensive and not many people had them at first.

Some of my friends went to many, many concerts during those years. The Interweb was barely beginning to catch on after 1994. So 77 million people could play/watch sports or socialize at club on the weekend or probably watch some TV during the week. Or you visited family on the weekend and BBQ'd or whatever.

Don't forget that "Rock n Roll" was a very big deal, especially with all the English bands coming over and Jimi, Grateful Dead and their cohorts playing their stuff. It was a huge deal to attend their concerts and locally, if you could play their music, gigs were plentiful. People gathered to hear new albums by new bands or the latest albums by the popular bands. Listening to music on crappy AM radio only motivated people more to hear their idols or bands covering them so they could dance, socialize and pick up on each other.

With birth control becoming widely available, BB families were (are) much smaller than the families they grew up in, and with music going to more Pop, the file sharing on the web and CD copying, reduction of drinking/smoking, why go to a venue and that may or may not have good sound and the music is so loud you can't socialize and pay $$ all at the same time? So you have smaller families with more entertainment choices using better technology and less "going out" to socialize because you can do it from your PC or phone therefore less gigs for live music. The venues can choose among DJs, karaoke, band or have all three different days of the week and make more money doing it that way.

+1000 hit it on the head.

Less young people in total
Less young people looking to go out
more availability of entertainment at home
More variety of entertainment at the bars

Lets face it. On average as people get older, have families, retire, etc you tend not to go out as much as you might have 10,20,30 years ago.

One other thing I've noticed. Young people (and most people in general) don't care about music like they used too. Music is more of a background thing. Turn it on to fill in the emptyness of the room while you watch tv, screw around on the interweb, etc. It is background noise and less people are actually interested in listening to a song (I think there was a thread about this topic on here about a year ago) same thing can be said for live music...go to a bar (with wifi) turn on the phone and use the band as background noise while you have your drink and check your email, facebook, twitter, porn sites)

[aborgman]

Originally Posted by powmetalbassist

+1000 hit it on the head.

Less young people in total

The "millenial" generation is LARGER than the "baby boomers".

78 million vs. 76 million.

Problem is - some of them are only 12 years old.

[MNAirHead]

Originally Posted by aborgman

The "millenial" generation is LARGER than the "baby boomers".

78 million vs. 76 million.

Problem is - some of them are only 12 years old.

Less in venues

[DwaynieAD]

Originally Posted by Factor88

Not trying to sound argumentative, but are you suggesting that the bar scene in your town has MORE bars with bands on any given night than it did 15 years ago? That may be true in your neck of the woods but isn't in mine and sounds like not true in most other markets that people describe on this board.......

i obviously can't speak for anything other than what i experience and yes in my neck of the woods the number of bars has grown exponentially in the past 15 years and the number of bands to play those bars has grown even more so.

you could also add in the fact that venues don't want to pay like they once did and a band worth listening to 3 nights in a row isn't going to stand for that, they'll find a venue that will pay them right.

[LiquidMidnight]

Originally Posted by bluewine

Most hits, regardless of the vintage have huge production values and only the top notch bands have the resources to reproduce it pull it off.

Blue

While those hits have always had "good" production, the idea of layering guitar upon guitar upon guitar upon guitar upon guitar wasn't as prevalent as it was today. There were exceptions (e.g., Steely Dan), but any three or four piece with good musicians wouldn't have trouble doing a respectable replication of Proud Mary, Taking Care of Business, or My Sharona. Now, you almost need two guitars, a keys/sampler, and a Southern Baptist gospel choir to pull off all of the instrumental and vocal parts in the average rock radio song. People like to dis on Nickelback, but I challenge anyone to cover one of their songs and nail all of the instrumental and vocal parts as close as they can (though to be fair, Nickelback is one of those highly produced modern rock bands that can actually pull off their own stuff on stage).

[/hi-jack]

[Muttleybass]

Originally Posted by Factor88

So, I'm asking, why did it change?

Drinking and driving laws, cheap club owners, the younger crowd not appreciating live music, older crowd that does like bands not going out anymore, horrible transit (around here, anyway), bands playing what they WANT and not what the audience wants to hear. Too many bands, not enough venues.

Originally Posted by Factor88

A follow up question, is given how much a PITA it can be to set up a good sound/light production, have any of you guys ever tried to negotiate a “volume discount” with a club/bar owner, where you charge slightly less per night if you get the whole weekend?

We don't always get enough money now! There are venues around here that are offering $250 a night for a 4 piece band, and bands are actually playing there! Unfortunately the bar owners are lord and master over us all. If we wanna play, we gotta play by their rules. Or they just won't bother with live music.

The only option is to keep getting people out to see you. Fill the bar they'll hire you back. Not easy every weekend.

[aborgman]

Originally Posted by MNAirHead

Less in venues

I agree...

...but that has nothing, at all, to do with what i responded to - which was the assertion:

"Less young people in total"

[pbass6811]

There's been a lot of good point raised here. We've experienced the same things here in the mid-central region. I've played 3-5 nights/week the last 10+years and the shift has gone from exclusively full weekends(Fri. & Sat.) to 99% one-nighters. All of the reasons mentioned probably play a part in this trend.

-Not as many bars, but a bunch more bands
-DJs are cheaper
-Can't smoke inside=less people at your bar=less revenue
-More access to more entertainment at home
-People are getting older
-And poorer

The list goes on and on. At first, it was was bit disturbing, but it's cool. We actually make MORE money now than we did when we were doing multiple nights/same club. It's much easier for bars to swallow $1500 for one night than $2500 for full weekend, then we book the next night at a different club for $1500 and instead of getting $2500 for a weekend, we just got $3k. A little more work gets us a lot more money...

[kcole4001]

Used to be the same here.
Friday/Saturday night combos were common, but DJs, law enforcement/MADD, and the smoking ban has killed the bar business, so bands don't get to play nearly as often as even 10 years ago,and it's only single nights now excepting very special occasions.

[kjpollo]

I've noticed a lot of the bars switch the entertainment. The place closest to me that regularly has entertainment brings in bands on Friday nights and has karaoke on Saturdays. Occasionally they'll book a quieter act (acoustic duo etc) for a random weeknight too.

I also totally agree with the fact that people have less disposable income so they stay home more.

[jungleheat]

I didn't think this thread would be as interesting as it turned out to be. Somehow this simple question kind of turned into a whole laundry list of why the live music industry is so much different now than it was in the past.

My own addition...

The population in the US is a LOT more diversified now than it was say 20 years ago. Are young hispanic or asian guys going to want to go watch a classic rock/country band of older white dudes? Probably not. And the more "ethnic" bands are usually more specialized, it's not like you can throw in a few salsa tunes next to nickelback and matchbox 20 and tap into that crowd in any significant way.

So any of those factors mentioned might have a small to moderate effect on the overall market, but when you add them all together, it seems like it could only be fairly devasting if not worse.

As far as the smoking thing... for me, I'm at just the wrong age. I was kind of phasing out going out a ton by the time smoking was banned in my area. I actually went out probably LESS than I would have if smoking was banned earlier. And there are a lot more non-smokers than smokers, but I guess at the same time, smokers are probably more likely to also be heavier drinkers (know any smokers that don't drink, probably not). I mean it's just such a pointlessly unhealthy activity, that why NOT drink as well?

So that one might be a wash. Non-smokers coming back to bars after the bans, but smokers are more likely to be drinkers... hard to say where the numbers would end up pointing.

[pnchad]

The late 60s and ALLLLL through the 70's was incredible

there was a bar with a band 5, 6 or even 7 nights/wk on every corner - no exaggeration

I played right on Key Biscayne Monty Trainers 5 nights/wk for 5 yrs stright! parked the gear in a store room & setup in 20mins every night

playing standards jazz, fusion & pop (done as jazz) very high musicianship

return customers and regulars all the time

great fun even if JP sat in once in a while

[Stumbo]

Originally Posted by aborgman

The "millenial" generation is LARGER than the "baby boomers".

78 million vs. 76 million.

Rock was "new" in the '60s and then there was the Beatles...

[MNAirHead]

Originally Posted by aborgman

I agree...

...but that has nothing, at all, to do with what i responded to - which was the assertion:

"Less young people in total"

-----

Ill repeat .... When I look out in venues the demographic in the chairs mainly is the 28-60 crowd

So in your market there are fewer young music customers

There was a day when clubs would pack as kids couldn't rely on Facebook or email as a social outlet

------

We play a few places that are packed with 21-30 until close ... This is now the exception

[millsbass5]

The reason for 1 nighters around here is 2 simple reasons. The economy, and the cops. Man! These cops around here are just waiting like vultures for someone to pull outta the parking lot of a club. It's really bad around here. Hell, you can't even hardly go to the damn grocery store, much less a friggin' bar around here without gettin' pulled over. It's crazy. I seriously think they sit beside the road with a radar gun in one hand, and beatin' their junk with the other hand, just gettin' off by pullin' people over. The cops around here are like a friggin' gang. It's crazy.

[alembicguy]

Other than the bars regulars who spend nickels and dimes. The crowd a band brings in and spends large amounts of money usually is only a good bet for one night and the bar knows if you make it a one night only deal raises their chance of making more money.

[rockinrayduke]

Originally Posted by tlr1293

15 years ago...
- Cable TV was maybe 40 channels, tops.
- The WWW was an AOL account still (for most people) and NOTHING streamed into an XBOX/Roku/BluRay/TV.
- Smart Phones did not exist (OK, maybe the very beginnings of Blackberry?).
- Socializing was in person and not via Facebook, Twitter, MySpace, texting, etc...
- Smoking was still allowed (for those that smoked) in bars AND the parking lots!

Technology, my friend - technology can be blamed for the changing habits of humans.

If you were only getting 40 channels in 1997 then you must have lived in a very remote area. But I get your point.

I agree technology has not helped the live music business. I watch young and older folks out there texting away on their iPhones while we're playing.

I know I'll sound like Grandpa but six night a week gigs for 2 or 3 or more weeks in a row were pretty common for the road band I was in, did it for years. A month's residency was no big deal. As things went on it became 5 then 4 then 3 and then you couldn't make enough money to be on the road at all. The whole circuit is gone now. I really hope the local live music scenes can at least sustain themselves and somehow start to flourish again. That will happen if people will get out of the house and go support the bands, whatever style they play.

[rockinrayduke]

Originally Posted by pnchad

The late 60s and ALLLLL through the 70's was incredible

there was a bar with a band 5, 6 or even 7 nights/wk on every corner - no exaggeration

I played right on Key Biscayne Monty Trainers 5 nights/wk for 5 yrs stright! parked the gear in a store room & setup in 20mins every night

playing standards jazz, fusion & pop (done as jazz) very high musicianship

return customers and regulars all the time

great fun even if JP sat in once in a while

Through the 80's and into the 90's too, brother. I had a house gig for a short time with some cats in Ft Walton Beach who'd been at the same club for 20 years. But all things come to an end. Good party while it lasted!

[soulman969]

It's definitely changed here in Denver and most everywhere else I imagine. Lately the only two nighters I've played have been out of town gigs where it wouldn't be worth it to travel the distance for just one night.

From my observation the "baby boomers" who supported bar bands playing classic rock covers has pretty much gone by the wayside and the younger crowds have different demands. Add to that more bands willing to do one nighters and more clubs with their own sound systems making it easier to attract those bands.

I don't see it as a good thing but it seems to be the way of it. To me it's less fun musically since we're not using as much of a repertoire as we would playing two night and covering different tunes and different genre each night. A band can pretty much get by with a set list of 35-40 tunes now. We used to have 80-100 back in the '90s.

I will offer a club a break for two nights but in this market few will take it.