INSTRUCTIONAL VIDEOS, dvds

[knez]

I am interested in videos and dvds that are instructional, showing a lot of right hand technique, walking bass, really the basics for acoustic bass. can anyone point me in the right direction of something they know is good?
thanks

[Ed Fuqua]

Get a teacher.

There is no DVD, video, computer program, website, instructional book that will ever take the place of a real live living and breathing human who will listen and watch you play, week after week, and tailor a program that will work on the weaknesses in your playing and understanding and turn them into strengths.

The physical approach to the instrument is fairly complex. And while there is a "right" way, that is not so much a standard approach as it is an approach based on getting the specific individual to a point where their interaction with the instrument is relaxed and without strain or stress. And the nly way to get that specificity on a recorded medium is to film you and your teacher going over your technique.


You certainly don't have to take my advice. But it is the advice of a player who "taught himself" the double bass, played professionally for 15 or so years and finally hit a brick wall. Which I couldn't get past until I started working with my current teacher (who I have been working with for over 7 years now).

You can do it now or you can do it later. But if you are serious about the instrument, you have to do it sometime. From my stand point, I wish I had started earlier.

[knez]

hey ed, i appreciate your advice but why you would assume I haven't studied i have no idea! All I did is ask a question if there were any videos out there!!!! I studied double bass for ten years, and have toured all over the world playing the bass in shows and small groups. I was just interested in videos that show actual playing technique, mostly for students but also for myself, but thanks anyway!
and thanks Patrick, i'll look into those.

[Ed Fuqua]

I voiced no opinion about your background. You asked about instructional material that could be used to relate information about conception and approach to double bass, I related my experience that the best way to deal with this was not with media, but with a person. This, as a response to "something they know is good". So yes, I know that studying with a person as opposed to a TV is good.

I also know that no matter how well meaning and well produced a video/book/ etc. is, it still can't tell me if my wrist is relaxed and at a proper angle. Or if I'm hearing my way through the approach to the bridge any better. Or if I am managing to convey more intent and meaning in my walking lines.

I would hate to assume that your response to a student who wants to work on "the basics of acoustic bass" is "Check out this DVD."
So maybe splain to me a little better why getting a list of DVDs etc. "mostly for students" is a more useful endeavor than a specific teacher showing a specific student how their body can interface with the instrument.

If you took a moment to fill out your profile, then no one would have to assume anything about your range of experience or background. especially if it seems a point of some sensitivity.

[knez]

now i've got to explain to you why i want it?
hey look i'm sorry, didn't mean to open up such a can of worms. If i offended you I apologize but no sensitivity here----- I mistated when i said for students and for me, i meant videos directed at students but i wanted for my own interest.
Sorry but it is not mutually exclusive. You can have a teacher and still find a video to be of interest. No different than having a teacher and still going to hear a good player in performance and getting something from it. Well, it is the same thing. And also, really there would not be a damn thing wrong with letting a student see a video that you know is informative. Anyway, once again. sorry if i came across as hard edged.

[Ed Fuqua]

Originally Posted by knez

now i've got to explain to you why i want it?

Nope, you don't have to explain anything to me you don't want me to understand. That's totally your choice.

Originally Posted by KNEZ

If i offended you I apologize but no sensitivity here

No worries, no offense taken. I disagree with your opinion of the value of "instructional" DVDs etc. You apparently disagree with my assessment of their efficacy. Yet I remain remarkably hale and hearty. People can disagree without anybody being adversly effected.


Videos are great entertainment. I enjoy the JAZZ CASUAL series, I've got a nice couple a VHS tapes with Ahmad Jamal, Ben Webster, two different Miles quintets, Mingus, Diz, Dolphy. Watching BENEATH THE UNDERDOG was informative and touching. But it's like listening to records, with the added hazard of being able to see what's going on. I'm about 5'8" and 180 pounds, if I tried to base my physical approach to the instrument on what I saw on a videotape by Mingus (who was taller and stouterer) without being able to talk to him about what he was trying to acheive and him being able to look at me and respond in a specific way, I'd be in trouble. But if I have a question about technique or approach, I'm still gonna talk to my teacher, not the TV.

It's like trying to learn Tai Chi from a book or videotape. What you can learn wrong in 6 months watching a tape, you can learn right in five minutes by being in the same room with your sifu.

[knez]

but that is it, don't you realize that you just agreed with me?
i never said that videos would substitute for a teacher, just that they could be informative as you just said one was for you. I don't know who you are arguing with about that point but it isn't me.
You can watch the video and then talk about with your teacher, but you seem to think that just watching them can adversely affect your playing.
As i said, it is no different than watching a concert or filmed performance (with no ability to speak to the musician) but still finding it interesting, inspiring and motivating.
anyway, good luck to you.

[Ed Fuqua]

Informative, yes. I learned a lot about Mingus background that I really didn't know, enjoyed seeing and hearing from cats on the scene in th 40s and 50s. And listening to him play of course.

Informative, as it applies to "instructional, showing a lot of right hand technique, walking bass, really the basics for acoustic bass", nope.

Like I said, entertainment. Watching them does not "adversely affect your playing". Just like watching video from a helmet cam of a Formula 1 driver does not adversley affect my driving. But it in no way prepares me to drive in a Formula 1 race. Or to put it another way, it prepares me just as much as ROAD TRIP 2.

Maybe Paris should get a helmet cam?

[jazzbo]

Originally Posted by Ed Fuqua

I'm about 5'8" and 180 pounds

You're short, and therefore, a bad person.

[Chris Fitzgerald]

Originally Posted by HASBRO

You're short, and therefore, a bad person.

Wow. FOGHORN's only 5'8"? No wonder his hands look so hammy...


KNUCKLEZ,

Don't let FOGHORN worry you none. His bark is worse than his bite, and he always speaks his mind, which is usually a good thing in the end. I've been wanting to see that Rabbath DVD my teacher keeps telling me about, even as I am aware that having a lesson with the man himself would be WAY cooler. Carry on with the DVD search. There may even be an old thread around here with the same basic import. Can anybody help me refresh my memory on that point?

[Davehenning]

Originally Posted by knez

I am interested in videos and dvds that are instructional, showing a lot of right hand technique, walking bass, really the basics for acoustic bass. can anyone point me in the right direction of something they know is good?
thanks

There is a good tape of Gary Peacock

While I do agree that there is no substitute for a great teacher, it can be interesting, informative and exciting to see a great player in action. Especially those who have passed: Slam, Mingus, PC, etc.

[Savino]

watching a video of a great player can give you some insight into their physical approach to playing. Why deny this resouce? After years of saying "How the f$&* did he do that?" when listening to NHOP. A Kenny Drew DVD allowed me to slow him down and see for myself. Does it replace a teacher? no

[knez]

thanks savino,
that is all i am saying as well. I never made a statement that you shouldn't have a teacher, or that videos can replace teachers, just that i asked about videos that were out there. Any reasonable person would understand that !!! Now i'm done discussing this as I think most on here know where i'm coming from, thanks

[jazzbo]

Originally Posted by knez

thanks savino,
that is all i am saying as well. I never made a statement that you shouldn't have a teacher, or that videos can replace teachers, just that i asked about videos that were out there. Any reasonable person would understand that !!! Now i'm done discussing this as I think most on here know where i'm coming from, thanks

I'm reasonable, and I didn't understand that. I think Ed made some extremely valid points.

[Davehenning]

Originally Posted by jazzbo

I'm reasonable, and I didn't understand that. I think Ed made some extremely valid points.

While good input is always welcome, Ed should lighten up.

[knez]

well jazzbo, all you have to do is read my posts, i just asked for videos, I never said a thing about videos being a substitute for teachers. It was just a simple question and ed took it from there!!!!!!

[jazzbo]

Originally Posted by Davehenning

While good input is always welcome, Ed should lighten up.

I disagree. I think Ed's first post, in response to the opening post of the thread, was solid. Maybe the rest of us need to lighten up a bit.

[Davehenning]

Originally Posted by jazzbo

I disagree. I think Ed's first post, in response to the opening post of the thread, was solid. Maybe the rest of us need to lighten up a bit.

No heavy-ness here.


While it was good advice, again, all the guy wanted were some links to some vids.

[flatback]

This seems like a weird non-argument argument here. I for one went thru the entire system of jazz education from Berklee to Seeking out private instruction with some of the great bassists and Even now that I am 40 and fairly solid in how I approach the instrument and the music, I seek out videos and DVD's everywhere I can. Self starters do. Jesus, How many insights have I had about playing from watching Dave Holland play (DVD called Vortex and another one from some european Fest.) Listening to Gary Peacock talk about his approach and concept in the Homespun video is fantastic (ever tried getting a lesson with HIM?)(or on the Keith DVDs) Watching Ron Carter play is well... Ron is fantastic. (talk about a college education, just watching him play is super deep)
To be able to check out old video of Jimmy Garrison is worth 100 lessons (I dont mean it replaces them its just worth that in insights...if you are looking for them)
Watching/listening to Eddie Gomez play with Bill Evans or on the Tribute to Coltrane DVD is worth the price any day on the week.
Watching/listening to Marc Johnson play with Stan Getz or Bill Evens or John Abercrombie even tho he is way young and has not yet come into his mature sound can really show you alot about the way he approaches the instrument and conceptualizes getting around the instrument.
This is a big huge physical instrument and the visual stimulation alone of watching how cats deal with that is worth the price of any DVD.
Let alone Instructional stuff...For example I attented one of those two week workshops at Gages with Dave Holland.( Gage filmed it too...we should all pressure him to release it) Both those cats let me record it and I listen to those tapes all the time. Dave Holland because he taught for so long can really break down what he does into clear concepts. That workshop, changed the way I play bass and without the tapes I would have forgotten half of it.
The NHOP video is interesting (check out his weird briefcase rig)
I'd love to see Sam Jones playing or more Percy Heath I love watching Charlie Haden Play (I studied with him but I'll tell you I learned more when I worked for him and just watched and listened from back stage)
Charlie sure is gracious to his fans...he would sit for hours after a show signing CDs and pressing the flesh.
Course the holy grail (for me) would be so see Scotty playing, I just cant figure out how he does half that stuff and I'll bet seeing footage would be really insightful.
Good luck and let us know if you find any gems out there.
It goes without saying that transcribing is a huge part of the education....To that end the Software called Transcribe is a god send...Check it out.
All the Best,
Piro Patton

[bassbaterie]

Nothing can make me stink any worse than I do now, or progress any slower! I for one like to see what the experts in our field are up to. If you know of any, please point me to some vids of some classical players, oriented toward advanced and/or professional players. Looking through the catalogues, it seems most are instruction for young students. Sooner or later I'll come up with the bucks for the Gary Karr DVD (it was about $90 from Lemur); in the meantime, I'd rather soak my brain in music-oriented videos than another round of SpongeBob re-runs with our 2-year-old.

You know like that famous PBS documentary/archival footage of the Trout Quintet with Perlman, Barenboim, Zubin Mehta and who was on viola and cello? They were in rehearsal, and then gave a performance. It doesn't have to be specifically instruction, just a presence with the pros.

Or like that Steve Gadd "in Session" thing. It's just cool to see close-ups of great players playing.