Club Fbass (Part 4)

[thndrstk6]

Originally Posted by Tom7

+1

I've noticed Ken Smith has "Banned" under his name in posts now.

You think it's him being funny, or do you think he's gone too far and got himself booted?

Yeah he was probably running his mouth "joking" and being "funny" when
really he was probably just being a jerk. I read more of his posts and he
seems to have it out for most people. I can see why he got banned.

[thndrstk6]

How cool would a 28 fret BN4 be! I would sell my body for this one.

I made a vertical and horizontal version to get a different perspective on it.

[J.Wolf]

wow, I love that headstock detail! is that your idea Thndrstck? very slick

[Tom7]

Count me as LOVING the vertical and horizontal perspectives you gave us.

This is an interesting bass for sure. With 28 frets, this accessible, for a lot of people it would cover the need for a C string. Not for me, because I do like the harmonics on the C, the chord fingers with a C, and playing across the finger board rather than up it, but in strict terms of range (and weight), this is an interesting bass.

Oh, and I think the headstock looks great too.

[Angus]

Originally Posted by Tom7

Third, I don't see what this bass offers above and beyond a Jazz bass. It has a boutique look to it for sure, but to me it comes off as looking like an unbalanced Jazz bass that wants to look like a Fodera.

Oh, the irony. You play an F Bass! How does anybody describe them other than an updated Jazz bass?

(Not to say that's a bad thing, but come on.)

Using a master volume instead of separate volume knobs, I understand, requires an additional circuit and dilutes the pure tone of the instrument.

This isn't true. A master volume will have just as much "pure tone dilution". But then, if you already have an active preamp, you can't really discuss "pure tone dilution" anymore, especially when it comes to volume control, which has a very little effect on the output relative to the rest of the active circuit.

Fifth, the string spacing is just 17.5. I know a lot of players can go between basses with different string spacing without much difficulty, but it takes me a minute or two to get used to it, and by then I've either butchered half a song, or haven't tried to do much with it as I adjust. Standardizing on 19 mm for all my basses works best for me, but I guess some guys, especially those that never slap, want narrow spacing to help them achieve guitarist speeds.

It doesn't necessarily have anything to do with achieving guitarist speeds. I play with 16.5mm spacing, and it is purely due to economy of motion and minimizing unnecessary reaches and hand motion rather than speed. I think his reasoning is the same, particularly given that he plays just as quickly on a full-spacing instrument.

I would've purchased an F Bass years ago if custom spacing and a scale length didn't add like $3000.

I don't know what happened with his Fbass plans, and I know how this sounds coming from the guy who tends Club Fbass, but from where I sit, Hadrien is a much better player than he is a decision maker. I can see very little that would attract me to his signature bass.

How can you make that judgment? Because he doesn't play the basses you like? He got a Fodera, but went back to his burner. He went to F Bass, but went back to his burner. I think he just saw the writing on the wall and stuck with the instrument that feels like home to him. I wouldn't ever buy one, either, but if it is what feels like home to him, I think he made a BETTER decision that going to another manufacturer just because they make nicer stuff.

[narud]

Originally Posted by Tom7

There used to be an announcement on the fbass.com news page about an endorsement deal with Hadrien Feraud, but that announcement is gone now.

Now I see Hadrien Feraud started a thread on talkbass to announce his new signature bass:





It is "made" by Ken Smith, the most socially impaired luthier I have ever known of. I write "made" in quotation marks because it is actually manufactured in Japan, and on multiple occasions Smith has made it clear that basses made with his name on them but not by him are not real Ken Smith basses.

Anyway, the irony of this endorsement deal can only be appreciated if you have read this old thread started by Ken Smith basically to mock and make fun of Hadrien.

In the thread someone guessed that Hadrien was going to do an endorsement deal with Smith, and Smith had this to say about Hadrien and endorsements:



Hadrien countered Smith's pompous post with a polite response which basically said, "Really? You don't consider this to be a Ken Smith bass? Then why did you guys put me on your artists page on your website?"

While there are a bunch of guys gushing about this signature bass, and while I definitely like Hadrien as a person and a player, I must say his signature bass is definitely not for me.

First, he went with Ken Smith, whose arrogance and rudeness have put me off of owning his basses.

Second, this is a return of the defunct "Burner" model, which is infamous for neck dive. Even if some players don't consider that balance neck dive, no WAY is it as nice as the balance of a BN5, BN6 or VF5, and I hate fighting with my bass to make it play.

Third, I don't see what this bass offers above and beyond a Jazz bass. It has a boutique look to it for sure, but to me it comes off as looking like an unbalanced Jazz bass that wants to look like a Fodera.

Fourth, the controls are Volume, Balance, Bass, Treble, and a 4 position mids boost switch.

Using a master volume instead of separate volume knobs, I understand, requires an additional circuit and dilutes the pure tone of the instrument.

And if you are going to use a knob for it anyway, why not let mids be controlled like treble and bass are: with smooth analogue control that can be tuned to any room, rig or situation?

Fifth, the string spacing is just 17.5. I know a lot of players can go between basses with different string spacing without much difficulty, but it takes me a minute or two to get used to it, and by then I've either butchered half a song, or haven't tried to do much with it as I adjust. Standardizing on 19 mm for all my basses works best for me, but I guess some guys, especially those that never slap, want narrow spacing to help them achieve guitarist speeds.

I don't know what happened with his Fbass plans, and I know how this sounds coming from the guy who tends Club Fbass, but from where I sit, Hadrien is a much better player than he is a decision maker. I can see very little that would attract me to his signature bass.

odd post. that was a lot of typing to basically say, " i cant believe how dumb this high profile player is for not playing an f bass"

as to spacing, thats a players problem if youre butchering stuff, not the bass. ive been using a jazz 5string with 17mm spacing at the bridge and i have no issues with it. i love to slap as much as the next guy. i also have the added benefit of fingerstyle things being much easier. arpeggios across the entire board are just way easier with tighter spacing. ill actually be getting the badass bridge on my vf5 slotted to 18mm. id go tighter if the neck wasnt 3" at the heel.

[speyer]

Originally Posted by Angus

I would've purchased an F Bass years ago if custom spacing and a scale length didn't add like $3000.

Actually about HALF that price... but I get yer point.

pat.

[speyer]

Originally Posted by thndrstk6

How cool would a 28 fret BN4 be! I would sell my body for this one.

I made a vertical and horizontal version to get a different perspective on it.

That Headstock detail is KILLER IMO!! But this bass is missing two strings... what's the deal?

[DonovanBankhead]

Originally Posted by narud

odd post. that was a lot of typing to basically say, " i cant believe how dumb this high profile player is for not playing an f bass"

That's not at all what Tom7 was saying. He was basically pointing out Hadrien and Ken Smith have an "interesting" past, one where Ken derides any bass that he doesn't make in his shop. Hadrien didn't get the insult due to the language barrier...

Also, Hadrien does own and play F Basses as well...

Anyway, what are you guys doing in our club house anyway?

[thndrstk6]

Originally Posted by wolfbass1025

wow, I love that headstock detail! is that your idea Thndrstck? very slick

Yeah it is. I asked George about it a while a go. He said they would do it.

[narud]

Originally Posted by dkb

Anyway, what are you guys doing in our club house anyway?

pfft.

whats that you ask? oh yeah, thats my vf5

[DonovanBankhead]

My bad, sir, you may pass.

BTW, NICE BASS!

[thndrstk6]

Very nice narud! I love natural basses.

[narud]

heres some clips. it took some tweaking to get the sound. ive noticed some variation in these basses (i thought the sunburst one donovan had sounded pretty bad)but you cant really just play it with the factory specs and think its going to sound like a fender. i had to spend some time with the setup,pickup heights and preamp experimentation to get the sound.
http://www.4shared.com/file/15051751...9b1/shine.html
http://www.4shared.com/file/150517448/16badf67/biz.html
some earth wind and fire and some teena marie lines.

[thndrstk6]

Great clips. What were all mods that you made?

[Vic]

Originally Posted by Angus

This isn't true. A master volume will have just as much "pure tone dilution".

This is actually incorrect... at least from a technical standpoint. From a practical standpoint, it's pretty highly debated.

It's a known fact that with a vol-blend you have more pickup loading issues than with vol-vol. Part of the reason is you're actually dealing with three variable resistors in a vol-blend config, and only two in a vol-vol. I believe there's really more to it than just that, but just as one primary example, at least.

However...

But then, if you already have an active preamp, you can't really discuss "pure tone dilution" anymore

I would generally agree with this, at least based on my experiences. I think the whole loading thing is highly dependent on what's connected to those pickups and resistors. If that's the input buffer of a preamp and only a few inches of wire, I'm not convinced there's a significant diff in tone. Again, at least in my experiences. With passive basses, or basses with a true passive bypass, vol-vol purists have a much stronger argument IMHO.

All that said, at least (again) in my experiences, even with passive basses, I've had so significant tone issues with a passive blend system (by FAR the most typical kind, even in active basses, even if they have no bypass), so the convenience of vol-blend easily outweighs whatever tone I might be losing by not having vol-vol, so that's the way I always go, given a choice.

[zMatko]

Originally Posted by speyer

But this bass is missing two strings... what's the deal?

You mean the strap flap?

[Vic]

Originally Posted by thndrstk6

Great clips. What were all mods that you made?

+1

Inquiring minds wanna' know.

[narud]

Originally Posted by Vic

+1

Inquiring minds wanna' know.

i didnt mod it really. the set up ive noticed with the high end jazzes needs to be lower than a fender to get that quick clack and bite. my 78 jazz and 75 ri can have the strings a little higher and still get the same attack. good thing i like low action.

ive also noticed that makers always ship out jazzes with the bridge pickup higher than than the neck. if you want a marcus sound, thats not going to work. after lowering the action as much as i did, i had to lower both pickups quite a bit, but lowered the bridge more than the neck.

next was the eq. ive never had an active f so getting used to how subtle the eq is and finding the sweetspots took a while. i think all that resulted in some clips that sound more like a 70's jazz than any of the vf5 clips ive heard so far.

[thndrstk6]

Nice! Well I like the tone either way.