Club Sandberg (part 2)

[mr.mow]

Originally Posted by Hou

I don't own a Sandberg but I have one on order. I have been reading different forums about them and some people don't like their bridges because the hard to adjust. Anyone have any similar experience?

It's unnecessarily fussy in my opinion, intonation is a bit of a pain to adjust, but I believe some of their basses have a new saddle design?

But really, it's a one off annoyance unless to switch strings regularly, otherwise you probably won't ever need to adjust it.

[Hou]

Originally Posted by Salo70

Here's my passive beauty

Nice. Do you have picture of the whole bass and back?

[phoenix_555]

Anyone have an Sandberg california VM 4 matt blueburst?
I would like to see how it looks because im not quite sure about te color.

[yesitsme]

use the configurator: http://www.configurator.sandberg-guitars.de/

[willbassyeah]

hmmm... just saying, thinking of getting this bass here:

[Scott McArron]

FINALLY took the 90 min. drive up to Frankfurt Session Musik to check out the Sandbergs there. Here are a few unscientific observations of mine after playing a half dozen of them for an hour or so. It may seem a little pessimistic, but take it with a grain of salt; I'm an extremely picky player when it comes to the feel and sound of my basses!

After picking one up an jamming on it to get a quick feel the first thing I noticed was how unusually acoustically quiet it was compared to the basses I normally play. The store was pretty quiet, so there wasn't much audible distraction. The E string especially was hard to hear at all. This made me curious as I'm not used to this. So I picked up a workhorse bass like the one I'm currently playing, a 2012 Fender Am Del P Bass, and found the difference to be night and day. Hearing each note was effortless and enjoyable.

Back to the Sandbergs. I picked up and played a few more and found the results to be to one varying degree or another about the same. Hm, didn't go into any more testing than this at the time. There was much more I was curious about.

I picked up a P/MM and the MarlowDK Sig jazz bass to test side by side. Unfortunately, the setups on both basses were not optimal for my playing style, and they were strung with new SS strings, which feel exceptionally sticky to my fingers. I like bright nickels. Both were rather difficult to play for my style of playing, but certainly not as bad as any Guitar Center bass. Action was about medium, but the pickups were too low, necks were pretty straight.

I tried out the jazz first since I grew up on the jazz bass and it feels like home to me. This one felt pretty good, but it didn't feel like a jazz. For one, the neck was thicker than your typical 70's era jazz. It felt somewhere closer to a PBass to me. Not as thin near the nut. A medium C profile neck. The sound was really clear, very little of that jazz grit and grind. A modern take on the jazz sound for sure. Not my thing for a jazz bass. If I ever got this bass, I'd swap out the pickups in a hurry.

The P/MM model was a little more to my liking, surprisingly, although the configuration is rather strange looking to me. A P pickup screams vintage to me while the MM says modern. Interesting combo. I'm not a big fan of the MM pickup sound. I kept it either dialed 50/50 or straight over to the P 100%.

Mixed 50/50, it sounded very modern. If I closed my eyes I'd see soapbar pickups. Very clear with a warm low end and a little clacky upper mids and highs. It was alright. Not my typical thing, but I could see myself getting used to it. I like a little vintage grit when I dig in though. With a little EQ I might have been able to find it, but knob-dialing wasn't on the list of things to do that day. Just looking for the straight up sound of each bass.

The P was... unfulfilling. My current P is outfitted with the Fender Original 62 Pickup, and this thing is P heaven! A lovely bottom end and lots of meaty mids that really carry a band. The Sandberg P didn't have this vibe to my ear. It was clear and warm, but not ballsy, and less of that midrange grit. I think the less ballsy nature may be in part to the pickups being set a little low, and also maybe because of the low acoustic volume of the wood/components. Unfortunately, the sales guys were busy and since I wasn't planning on buying anything I wasn't going to make a guy give it a setup.

After that comparison, I played few more of the Sandbergs. Each one varied in weight and balance so much that I couldn't see myself ever special-ordering one. One felt like a tank, the next light as a feather, and another had bad neck dive, etc. My guess is their choice of wood and parts matching is not in the same league as your Lulls, Sadowskys, etc. and that's why (one of the many reasons) the much lower price point. Just a guess, naturally.

To top things off, I picked up a Lakland AJ-55 and the neck and action were superb! To me, Lakland has the feel of the neck down perfectly. 5 strings don't feel to wide or like a baseball bat, they're relatively thin for fast playing, but thick enough to keep the tone ballsy and substantial. Additionally, I played on a couple 2012 Fender American basses and felt equally at home in terms of feel. What's funny is that Fender is known for having a lot of variance in their line of basses and guitars, but the ones I've played from the last few years are MUCH more in line than the Sandbergs I played, where each one felt like it was made by a different builder. Hm.

All in all, I'm really trying to love the Sandbergs. I love the way they look and I love that they're German made. But I'm still on the fence. I think if I played enough of them and found the right one it could work. Most likely though, I'd be changing out those pickups in a hurry. I was not digging the ultra clear sound of these vintage-esque instruments. That's just my personal taste, though. YMMV. And there was no scientific studies done here. Just some casual jammin' and bass comparing.

For reference: the rig I was playing through was what I use at home, TecAmp Puma900 through a TecAmp S212 newer rear-ported version.

[Musicman20]

Originally Posted by Scott McArron

FINALLY took the 90 min. drive up to Frankfurt Session Musik to check out the Sandbergs there. Here are a few unscientific observations of mine after playing a half dozen of them for an hour or so. It may seem a little pessimistic, but take it with a grain of salt; I'm an extremely picky player when it comes to the feel and sound of my basses!

After picking one up an jamming on it to get a quick feel the first thing I noticed was how unusually acoustically quiet it was compared to the basses I normally play. The store was pretty quiet, so there wasn't much audible distraction. The E string especially was hard to hear at all. This made me curious as I'm not used to this. So I picked up a workhorse bass like the one I'm currently playing, a 2012 Fender Am Del P Bass, and found the difference to be night and day. Hearing each note was effortless and enjoyable.

Back to the Sandbergs. I picked up and played a few more and found the results to be to one varying degree or another about the same. Hm, didn't go into any more testing than this at the time. There was much more I was curious about.

I picked up a P/MM and the MarlowDK Sig jazz bass to test side by side. Unfortunately, the setups on both basses were not optimal for my playing style, and they were strung with new SS strings, which feel exceptionally sticky to my fingers. I like bright nickels. Both were rather difficult to play for my style of playing, but certainly not as bad as any Guitar Center bass. Action was about medium, but the pickups were too low, necks were pretty straight.

I tried out the jazz first since I grew up on the jazz bass and it feels like home to me. This one felt pretty good, but it didn't feel like a jazz. For one, the neck was thicker than your typical 70's era jazz. It felt somewhere closer to a PBass to me. Not as thin near the nut. A medium C profile neck. The sound was really clear, very little of that jazz grit and grind. A modern take on the jazz sound for sure. Not my thing for a jazz bass. If I ever got this bass, I'd swap out the pickups in a hurry.

The P/MM model was a little more to my liking, surprisingly, although the configuration is rather strange looking to me. A P pickup screams vintage to me while the MM says modern. Interesting combo. I'm not a big fan of the MM pickup sound. I kept it either dialed 50/50 or straight over to the P 100%.

Mixed 50/50, it sounded very modern. If I closed my eyes I'd see soapbar pickups. Very clear with a warm low end and a little clacky upper mids and highs. It was alright. Not my typical thing, but I could see myself getting used to it. I like a little vintage grit when I dig in though. With a little EQ I might have been able to find it, but knob-dialing wasn't on the list of things to do that day. Just looking for the straight up sound of each bass.

The P was... unfulfilling. My current P is outfitted with the Fender Original 62 Pickup, and this thing is P heaven! A lovely bottom end and lots of meaty mids that really carry a band. The Sandberg P didn't have this vibe to my ear. It was clear and warm, but not ballsy, and less of that midrange grit. I think the less ballsy nature may be in part to the pickups being set a little low, and also maybe because of the low acoustic volume of the wood/components. Unfortunately, the sales guys were busy and since I wasn't planning on buying anything I wasn't going to make a guy give it a setup.

After that comparison, I played few more of the Sandbergs. Each one varied in weight and balance so much that I couldn't see myself ever special-ordering one. One felt like a tank, the next light as a feather, and another had bad neck dive, etc. My guess is their choice of wood and parts matching is not in the same league as your Lulls, Sadowskys, etc. and that's why (one of the many reasons) the much lower price point. Just a guess, naturally.

To top things off, I picked up a Lakland AJ-55 and the neck and action were superb! To me, Lakland has the feel of the neck down perfectly. 5 strings don't feel to wide or like a baseball bat, they're relatively thin for fast playing, but thick enough to keep the tone ballsy and substantial. Additionally, I played on a couple 2012 Fender American basses and felt equally at home in terms of feel. What's funny is that Fender is known for having a lot of variance in their line of basses and guitars, but the ones I've played from the last few years are MUCH more in line than the Sandbergs I played, where each one felt like it was made by a different builder. Hm.

All in all, I'm really trying to love the Sandbergs. I love the way they look and I love that they're German made. But I'm still on the fence. I think if I played enough of them and found the right one it could work. Most likely though, I'd be changing out those pickups in a hurry. I was not digging the ultra clear sound of these vintage-esque instruments. That's just my personal taste, though. YMMV. And there was no scientific studies done here. Just some casual jammin' and bass comparing.

For reference: the rig I was playing through was what I use at home, TecAmp Puma900 through a TecAmp S212 newer rear-ported version.

Thanks. I bet the clarity without the nice grit is the glock preamp and the pickups.

I'm shocked about the variances as well...

[kasbrey]

I think the variation in weight is purely down to the different wood options in my experience. The relic'ed and custom ordered appear often to be a little lighter than the off the shelf models that I've tried though.
My JJ and JM necks are a little different but not miles apart and while my PM neck has a shallower depth front to back it is a very early model. They are probably less uniform in this respect than production line or parts based basses though as you would expect.

It's very easy to get my Delano'd JJ to sound vintage by cutting the bass and treble just a little. This has the effect of making the sound more middy with added snarl.
I bought the JJ because I wanted the classic vintage J sound and was intending to swap the pickups but it sounds great as it is.
A small piece of foam under the E and A strings compensates for the very strong bass response there (due I believe to the 6 bolt neck). I find the Sandbergs to be far more even sounding than my Fenders in a live situation.

I did swap the pickups on the PM for Alnicos as I think they sound better with flatwounds.

I must admit I don't care for the stock strings myself.

[yesitsme]

Originally Posted by kasbrey

My JJ and JM necks are a little different but not miles apart and while my PM neck has a shallower depth front to back it is a very early model.

the neck of the california basses are all the same. they differ a bit cause the shaping is handmade, but the "basic" shaping is always the same

[MKA]

Originally Posted by Scott McArron

FINALLY took the 90 min. drive up to Frankfurt Session Musik to check out the Sandbergs there. Here are a few unscientific observations of mine after playing a half dozen of them for an hour or so. It may seem a little pessimistic, but take it with a grain of salt; I'm an extremely picky player when it comes to the feel and sound of my basses!

Thanks for an honest review! One thing I've noticed with all the new Sandbergs that I've tried is that the stock strings are really thin sounding. I think they come with Sandbergs own 100-40 gauge strings, and first thing I did when I got my Sandy was to change the strings - made all the difference.

My Sandberg Cali TM (JM) is currently strung with TI flats and playing it with my TecAmp Puma I get a sound that is so close to the sound in my head that its scary! Perfect "vintage-meets-modern" sound for me. My fender p just sounds so dull compared to my sandy that I hardly play it at all.

[yesitsme]

I honestly like the factory strings very much. Seem to be pretty good steel strings. When I worked @ Session Musik we sold tons of these. I play Elixir or DR Sunbeams on my TT's. Mostly Elixir.

[Musicman20]

Originally Posted by yesitsme

the neck of the california basses are all the same. they differ a bit cause the shaping is handmade, but the "basic" shaping is always the same

That is odd...but explains why I've never seen any specs with differences.

I am now realising I need to test one before I even think about ordering.

[Scott McArron]

Originally Posted by MKA

Thanks for an honest review! One thing I've noticed with all the new Sandbergs that I've tried is that the stock strings are really thin sounding. I think they come with Sandbergs own 100-40 gauge strings, and first thing I did when I got my Sandy was to change the strings - made all the difference.

My Sandberg Cali TM (JM) is currently strung with TI flats and playing it with my TecAmp Puma I get a sound that is so close to the sound in my head that its scary! Perfect "vintage-meets-modern" sound for me. My fender p just sounds so dull compared to my sandy that I hardly play it at all.

The thin strings did probably have a good amount to do with it. Thin and SS. Not what I typically like. Medium (or thick for 5ers) and Nickel. Changes the playing experience quite a bit, IME. I'll take a lot more time with them once I'm ready to make a purchase in the not-too-distant future and make sure to get a good set up and my strings of choice on them first before making a final judgment call.

[Scott McArron]

Originally Posted by yesitsme

I honestly like the factory strings very much. Seem to be pretty good steel strings. When I worked @ Session Musik we sold tons of these. I play Elixir or DR Sunbeams on my TT's. Mostly Elixir.

The Elixirs I've used were the longest lasting strings I've ever had. Only had them on my Lakland for a while so can't comment on the tone more than that. I'm currently running the Sunbeams on my P and really like those so far, except for a weird rattling sound that doesn't sound like fret buzz and raising the strings ridiculously doesn't get rid of it. Very strange. Seems to happen at the head after the nut. Same gauge as the strings before (stock) and those had no such noises. But I do look forward to putting this set on a Sandberg and trying it then. Maybe I'll have a completely different experience!

[yesitsme]

The Sunbeams have less tension than the most other strings out there in this gauge. A quick neck-setup would help to get rid of these noises.

[MKA]

Originally Posted by Scott McArron

FINALLY took the 90 min. drive up to Frankfurt Session Musik to check out the Sandbergs there...

The P/MM model was a little more to my liking, surprisingly, although the configuration is rather strange looking to me. A P pickup screams vintage to me while the MM says modern. Interesting combo. I'm not a big fan of the MM pickup sound. I kept it either dialed 50/50 or straight over to the P 100%.

Mixed 50/50, it sounded very modern. If I closed my eyes I'd see soapbar pickups. Very clear with a warm low end and a little clacky upper mids and highs. It was alright. Not my typical thing, but I could see myself getting used to it. I like a little vintage grit when I dig in though. With a little EQ I might have been able to find it, but knob-dialing wasn't on the list of things to do that day. Just looking for the straight up sound of each bass.

I personally don't think Sandbergs J/MM and P/MM basses as having an actual MusicMan pickup in the bridge position (for one thing I don't think that the pickup even is at the MM sweet spot). I've always felt that the rear pup sounded and behaved more like "super-jazz" bridge pickup. So that would make the J/MM a "superjazz" and the P/MM a "superPJ" (IMO of course).

Many times with jazzes and PJ's the bridge pickup is a bit thin sounding, specially soloed (and compared to the neck pickup soloed). With my Sanderg JM I find the balance between the neck (J) and the bridge ("MM") to be perfect both sound- and volume-wise.

But of course, if one is used to that classic passive fender jazz sound, that is not the thing your going to get from a sandberg. Nice basses, but not for everyone (for me? yesss sir!!! )

[Scott McArron]

Originally Posted by MKA

I personally don't think Sandbergs J/MM and P/MM basses as having an actual MusicMan pickup in the bridge position (for one thing I don't think that the pickup even is at the MM sweet spot). I've always felt that the rear pup sounded and behaved more like "super-jazz" bridge pickup. So that would make the J/MM a "superjazz" and the P/MM a "superPJ" (IMO of course).

Many times with jazzes and PJ's the bridge pickup is a bit thin sounding, specially soloed (and compared to the neck pickup soloed). With my Sanderg JM I find the balance between the neck (J) and the bridge ("MM") to be perfect both sound- and volume-wise.

But of course, if one is used to that classic passive fender jazz sound, that is not the thing your going to get from a sandberg. Nice basses, but not for everyone (for me? yesss sir!!! )

Interesting perspective. That mm-style pickup sounded VERY modern and much like a MM sound to me, albeit a different flavor (like Lakland's MM pickup on their 55-02s which I have had 2 of). It didn't sound anything to me like a jazz bridge pickup, which gets that snarly midrangey burp tone.

[MKA]

Originally Posted by Scott McArron

Interesting perspective. That mm-style pickup sounded VERY modern and much like a MM sound to me, albeit a different flavor (like Lakland's MM pickup on their 55-02s which I have had 2 of). It didn't sound anything to me like a jazz bridge pickup, which gets that snarly midrangey burp tone.

Hmmm... thats interesting. Did the Sandbergs that you tried have Delanos? Cause thats what I have in mine, and playing my Sandberg with the bridge humbucker definitely snarls in a very midrangey way. Doesn't sound too modern either (although flats might have something to with that), and doesn't sound exactly like a H Stingray that I also have (some similarities though).

Well, just goes to show how differently we hear things, and like always with instruments, try before you buy!

And just so that the thread does not get too boring, here is a pic of my Sandberg:

[Scott McArron]

It definitely has a midrange snarl to it, totally agree! But find it closer to a modern snarl, not like vintage jazz grit, and again, not a burpy jazz tone. Musicman? Maybe not exactly, but it sure reminded me of it. And yeah, they were the DeLano's. Meh, who knows... So many factors.

[yesitsme]

seen? there are new sandberg videos:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eyR1tyUpLlU
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HSlstjnlzWc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QRhVSM88ZFI