Fake Kubicki-Found!

[Baryonyx]

Well, I remember reading a thread about Kubicki's, and if any replica's were made...

as I remember, people were sure they hadn't been made...but look.





A few differences...

Look at that white neck...not the multi-lam of real Kubicki's...

The Jack socket is in the wrong place, as is the strap button...the bridge design is not the same. On a real Kubicki, the tuners are mounted on top, not on the bottom. The Pickups are huge and the saddle thing is in the wrong place...

At a glance, those tone controls don't look right...they're not the concentric design one of the Original. I can see it says "Fixer", but what it says beneath that I cannot see. I don't have photoshop or anything, so I can't clean it and zoom in to see "what lies beneath".

It looks like the ends of the strings clamp in at the headstock too...

A friend of mine just bought it, and I thought you guys might be interested in seeing it...very interesting!

[PilbaraBass]

Originally Posted by Chris2112

I can see it says "Fixer", but what it says beneath that I cannot see. I don't have photoshop or anything, so I can't clean it and zoom in to see "what lies beneath".

It looks like it says "POOR HOUSE FACTORY"

very strange, indeed. could easily be a one off.

[Baryonyx]

That jack socket irks me...

on the real bass, it's set so you can't actually touch the cable if you touch the bottom of the bass...but there, it's right in the way!

[rogerbmiller]

Great pics. I was the guy who started that thread about clones a while back as I had one. Mine in fact turned out to be this very bass-- a "Fixer" Poor House factory bass but mine had no logo or wording on the battery. I came across a pic on an aussie website months after selling mine.

The scary thing is that this was a really decent bass. There are some some fundamental differences with this vs the real deal such as the 34" vs 32" scale. There are also some really stupid things that make this a cheap clone like the string bolts at the "headstock" and cheap electronics. But overall a well built a handsome replica.

[raulshred]

Where I can find a Kubicki Ex Factor bass made in China? I tried in dhgate and I found nothing...

Thanx!

[rogerbmiller]

You can't. There are a limited number of MIJ Kubicki's floating around from back in the day though branded as Blaster basses.

As I understand, for a brief period of time, Phil Kubicki was in discussions with a Japanese company about licensing the basses. At the 11th hour negotiations fell through but several basses were sold anyway.

Phil is beyond bitter about this whole thing and has stated to me and others that he wishes "he could get his hands on all of them and burn them." Can hardly blame him-- he had a revolutionary design and patent that companies blatantly stole.

Originally Posted by raulshred

Where I can find a Kubicki Ex Factor bass made in China? I tried in dhgate and I found nothing...

Thanx!

[Kink Rimson]

Looks like the same pickups as my Riverhead Unicorn... Quite distinctive.

[Duplo42]

I properly enlarged it in PShop and shapened it, but no success - it does look like Poor House Factory indeed.

[raulshred]

Thank you very much Rogerbmiller, You're very well informed. I did not mean basses under Kubicki licensed, but Chinese replicas, similar to replicas of Steinberger guitars and basses for much less money. For example, I recently bought a headless guitar Steinberger GU (I'm guitar player), and I replaced the pickups by Seymour Duncan SH-4, SSL-1, SSL-1 and was an excellent guitar.

[rogerbmiller]

Originally Posted by raulshred

Thank you very much Rogerbmiller, You're very well informed. I did not mean basses under Kubicki licensed, but Chinese replicas, similar to replicas of Steinberger guitars and basses for much less money. For example, I recently bought a headless guitar Steinberger GU (I'm guitar player), and I replaced the pickups by Seymour Duncan SH-4, SSL-1, SSL-1 and was an excellent guitar.

Don't think there are any such replicas anymore. Kubicki Factors had their heyday but I think the brand was ultimately mismanaged by Fender and they lost to Steinberger as the standard in headless design, though they do enjoy a small and loyal following by people such as myself. My guess is that there have been no replicas since give 1) smaller market for the basses, and 2) since the patents were never licensed, all manufacturing is centralized with Kubicki and would be too expensive to replicate.

[Beej]

I'm far from a drama queen, but what you guys are referring to as "replicas" are actually counterfeits...

[raulshred]

You may be right, but the Chinese people copy everything that is profitable. I think that the bass market is also great. Web sites like Dhgate or Tradetang have a lot of imitations of basses like Steinberger, Ibanez, Fender, Spector, MusicMan, etc. In my opinion, Kubicki models could be very profitable because they are very attractive and were sponsored by well-known bass players, but you may be right that some parts of this bass as the bridge are expensive and difficult to replicate. Anyway, the photo showing Baryonyx (a clearly chinese imitation) is about what I'm looking for, although the failure of this replica is clearly the bridge, which has nothing to do with the original Kubicki. The pick ups may be replaced by active EMG or similar.

[raulshred]

Yes, exactly, but this should not be a drama. If I were a musician who lives of music and I have enough money I will buy the original. If I can not get the replica, I will buy something else, so in my opinion Kubicki is not affected by this type of situation, because in my condition, I never will buy his original bass!

I think the issue of Chinese imitations is not a bad thing. Most major brands like Fender, Gibson, Yamaha, MusicMan made in China products under their specifications. With the replicas We not to pay the middleman.

[JIO]

I've seen the "Blaster" copy, but have never seen this white version. Phil Kubicki designed a great instrument, and did it right the first time. I've owned a few and they can do it all. The only less than ideal aspects were the huge boost of active from passive (or huge drop from the other way around) and the capo buzz that occasionally occurs on the Ex-Factors. G&L's L-2000 system as a comparison, have more manageable (live) level between active boosts from passive. The buzz thing wasn't uncorrectable but just niggling to deal with. But that's about it. I'm not going to bad-mouth Steinberger, but at the end of the day, I'll take an Ex-Factor any day over his headless bass. Everyone has their personal favorites for as many reasons as there are choices, but IMHO Kubicki's represent a nearly perfect design in the 4-string department of an instrument introduced in the past 30 yrs.

Related to this thread, PK also has integrity and does not compromise quality. That's why the Fender association didn't last and it may have had something to do w/the attempt at Japanese deal. So I can understand him being less than pleased to have his unique design copied. On the other hand I guess he really can't do much w/o litigation like Fender does. He doesn't have that big corporation clout and probably doesn't lose any sleep over it anyway. Copies seem unavoidable. Just the fact that you can buy a used Ex-Factor for less than 1/2 what they cost new to this day, is a bargain. And lastly, when you call Kubicki - you talk w/Phil. Nuff said.

[raulshred]

JIO thank you very much, you are very well informed. I believe that each creator always defends his work of copying and Kubicki does the same. IMHO I think the Chinese copies is not bad think, because it's evident that the quality is lower and if I were a professional musician I would buy the original Kubicki. On the other hand, I think the difference between a copy and the original is exaggerated. For example:

Guitar Steinberger Spirit GU original: $ 2750
Replica made in China + Seymour Duncan Pick ups: $ 350.

Result:
Proportion of quality:
100-90
Price ratio:
100-15

The difference is obvious. If I were a professional I would pay the difference, but other people should not pay for this big difference for that little jump in quality.

On the other hand, when someone enters the business world and creates something, should be aware and accept that there will be copies. For two reasons:

- It's inevitable
- Fighting them is unpopular.

The photo you sent looks like a good copy of Kubicki Factor Bass. Where did you get?

To finish, I did not understand your last sentence, I'm Spanish and I speak English two years ago ... sorry!

[JIO]

Originally Posted by raulshred

JIO thank you very much, you are very well informed. I believe that each creator always defends his work of copying and Kubicki does the same. IMHO I think the Chinese copies is not bad think, because it's evident that the quality is lower and if I were a professional musician I would buy the original Kubicki. On the other hand, I think the difference between a copy and the original is exaggerated. For example:

Guitar Steinberger Spirit GU original: $ 2750
Replica made in China + Seymour Duncan Pick ups: $ 350.

Result:
Proportion of quality:
100-90
Price ratio:
100-15

The difference is obvious. If I were a professional I would pay the difference, but other people should not pay for this big difference for that little jump in quality.

On the other hand, when someone enters the business world and creates something, should be aware and accept that there will be copies. For two reasons:

- It's inevitable
- Fighting them is unpopular.

The photo you sent looks like a good copy of Kubicki Factor Bass. Where did you get?

To finish, I did not understand your last sentence, I'm Spanish and I speak English two years ago ... sorry!

Actually, it is a Kubicki. A 1986 to be exact. I refinished it w/Tung oil over an orange stain. Stripping the original black finish was a chore. "Nuff said" is like saying, "enough said" - no need to say more.

[spiltcoil]

Here's another:
http://www.chrisguitars.com/warmoth-factor-style.jpg

[MrWalker]

Just as a side note, this isn't a counterfeit, it's a replica. Had it written "Kubicki" instead of Fixer, it would be a counterfeit.

That bridge also looks like the standard tuning bridges that were put on a lot of the headless Japanese basses at the time. The Riverhead all had them, as well as the other headless offerings from Vantage and what not. So I'd say, someone made a replica of the Kubicki just as there was made replicas of Fenders, Gibsons, Steinbergers, and so on and so forth.

Looks nice, and there are so many of these replicas that are decent playing instruments that they are worth owning.

As for the Kubicki, I also owned one in the early 90s. Great instrument indeed. Wouldn't mind owning one again But then.... there are a bus load of basses I wouldn't mind owning (again).

[laklandplayer]

This Kubicki has the same bridge/tuners as the old Cort and Hohner Steinberger headless bass knock offs of the 80's. The came in either black or white and were very popular.

[JIO]

Originally Posted by spiltcoil

Here's another:
http://www.chrisguitars.com/warmoth-factor-style.jpg

Odd looking bass. If anyone has seen the French animated movie "The Triplets of Belleville", it looks like the square-shouldered mafia guys that kidnap the cyclists.