Kala UBass Megathread, Part 5

[imperialbari]

I used to be very good a math and classical physics. Also being a brass player makes me speak about frequency patterns like everybody understands them thoroughly.

Every oscillating string (or air column) has a nominal frequency closely related to its length. That nominal frequency has a note name and a spot in our various music notation systems (music on staffs, in tablatures, and in Braille).

But these oscillating mediae also oscillate in subdivisions of their lengths, basically in all fractions thereof. Half length=> octave, third length => octave + fifth, fifth length => 2 octaves + a major third just to mention a very few samples of these harmonics or overtones.

Many combo amplifiers for bass are not able to emit the nominal frequencies of the lowest notes. However our brains hear the harmonics emitted and from these automatically deduce the basic frequencies, the fundamentals, so that we think we hear them.

However some of us after years of experience can hear whether the low notes are really sounding (ears more talented than mine probably can do this without the experience factor). When I put a bigger subwoofer on my sound system, I started experimenting with the old one which goes down to 20Hz, so that I now get the real fundamental sounds from the E string.

Klaus

[Christofolo]

Figures, it is a low as hell E string and my combo amp is a 200 watt only I believe. So you are implying the only way to fix it is to get a better sound system or alter mine? Because that's a hell of a jump in solutions lol

I'm surprised though, if that's what the reason is. So why do thumb strokes work but plucking doesn't? Vibrates differently?

[caeman]

Originally Posted by Christofolo

So why do thumb strokes work but plucking doesn't? Vibrates differently?

There is a difference it signal strength, maybe.

Is there a volume difference between plucking really hard and moderate to soft?

[Christofolo]

From the 30 minutes playing it I'd say the output volume didn't really change when doing the thumb downstrokes... It only got a little louder either way as well with plucking. All in all it feels like there's a separate volume knob for the E string and someone has it at like 1/4 while the other 3 strings are at full power

[imperialbari]

Originally Posted by Christofolo

Figures, it is a low as hell E string and my combo amp is a 200 watt only I believe. So you are implying the only way to fix it is to get a better sound system or alter mine? Because that's a hell of a jump in solutions lol

I'm surprised though, if that's what the reason is. So why do thumb strokes work but plucking doesn't? Vibrates differently?

Not knowing the bass amplifying market really well my guess still would be that a 200 Watt system has a large, may be 15", cone capable of the frequencies down to the needed 40Hz for a true E.

But you may have to rework your settings used for full size bass guitars. With the EBS 60 alone I maximize bass and middle frequencies, whereas treble goes to a minimum.

If the sound goes dry, high frequencies have been cut too much.

Klaus

[SBassman]

Maybe it's worth opening up the pickup to see if anything is going on in there.

It would be nice if there was a separate gain control for every string.

[Christofolo]

As it was last night I had my EQ set up this way: Treble was dialed back to 10-11 and the low-mid-high ranges were 12-1 with bass set to 1-2 o'clock. Pretty much I cut some treble and brought up the bass, the gain is high with a lower volume... I can see where this is going rofl.

That is how I have my amp set for electric bass

[Christofolo]

If anything when I get home I'll play with the amp and see what comes out of it and I will update.

[imperialbari]

Originally Posted by SBassman

It would be nice if there was a separate gain control for every string.

Separately adjustable (action & string length) bridges for each string combined with separate gain & tone controls for each string certainly would be desirable. But then we are moving into a different price range.

Klaus

[caeman]

I do not have these troubles with my GK Backline 210 + 210 extension, or playing direct. All strings sound good.

[olitoon]

Originally Posted by little george

http://www.thomann.de/es/tenayo_ugb_...ss_starter.htm

Uncommon things: Aquila thunderguts, laminated woods, only fretless.

Thunderguts and fretless is good .

I think it´s got a very narrow neck, strange machine heads, funny pots,

I'm not sure the neck is really narrower than a U-Bass neck. Machine heads look like Ashbory's and I like the look of the pots.

no strap peg... Do the tenayo people pretend us to hold it ala ukulele?

no strap peg, that's stupid indeed!

As a (probably) positive point, active electronics, and very cheap: 272 euros versus 466 on the cheapest Kala SUB

Maybe I'll order one...

[SBassman]

Originally Posted by olitoon

...

Maybe I'll order one...

If you do - please post a review at some point.

[imperialbari]

The German retailer and web shop Thomann appears being a major distributor of the Tenayo brand.

Further information:

http://www.guitar-list.com/brands/tenayo

The most interesting instruments from Tenayo might be their 7-, 8-, and 10-string guitars.

Klaus

[Christofolo]

Well I got home and played with the EQ and now the E string only goes low in output when I fret some notes. It plays normally when I pluck open E so I think I'll just put up with it for now.

[imperialbari]

Originally Posted by Christofolo

Well I got home and played with the EQ and now the E string only goes low in output when I fret some notes. It plays normally when I pluck open E so I think I'll just put up with it for now.

This is quite close to my experiences also.

With all of my instruments I tend to first play the most difficult note in terms of response and/or resonance. Mentally the approach is: If I can get this one right, I can get them all right.

With my fretted acoustic UBass the hardest note to get full is the low G on the E string. I adjust my settings for that note to sound well. There are other matter to check, but they tend to succeed, if the low G is good. The uppermost notes may need some descant boost to get alive, but that most often also boosts the attack of the low G.

Despite the frets I sense that non-open notes are kind of dampened by the fretting finger. And then the neck isn’t necessarily equally responsive with all notes. In one review of a bass guitar well above the entry level, one high note was totally dead on the test sample. The reviewer ascribed that to the design, but I am not so sure about that. And at least I have found no dead notes on my UBasses so far.

Klaus

[imperialbari]

Just had a practice session with the fretted acoustic UBass that had me worried by the octave G-G on the G string being unmanageably flat.

I haven’t measured the instrument proportions, as I havent sensed any skewing of the wood.

Other posters have hinted the problem being with the string, so my curious mind unmounted the G string and remounted it the other way round and used a cable binder to make a stable knot at the bridge end.

At the first tuning-up the said octave had gone a bit sharp, but settling in and some more tunings now have made that octave much closer to true (and it isn’t flat which is very bad in my ears).

Uneven wear or uneven stretching causing the original problem? Beyond me, at least for now.

Klaus

[3234718]

Is anyone using the pyramids? A while back I shelled out the 60 bucks to satisfy my curiosity but ended up taking them off. It seemed to me it took away the unique ubass tone, but tuning stability was nice.

[Christofolo]

I think my E string is just messed up somehow, since fretting on the other strings is fine and the E just goes down in volume when i play fretted notes on it. Somehow it just decides to hush but shout out when I play it open.

If anything later on I can grab pyramid strings *shrug* they seem to be more stable from what im hearing

[imperialbari]

Originally Posted by Christofolo

I think my E string is just messed up somehow, since fretting on the other strings is fine and the E just goes down in volume when i play fretted notes on it. Somehow it just decides to hush but shout out when I play it open.

I haven’t taught bass, but I have taught a lot of instrument lessons.

Which together with my sense of elementary physics makes me believe your analysis isn’t the most productive for your own playing.

What is the most significant feature of Pahoehoe’s as well as of Thunderguts?

The E strings are disproportionally thick compared to other types of bass guitar strings.

At the same time the frets of the acoustic UBasses are small, low, and thin like the frets of the small ukuleles and unlike the robust frets of most bass guitars.

The implication thereof, as written in a number of posts by a number of contributors here, is that if you fret very close to the frets, then a low finger pressure will result in a buzzing sound, whereas a harder pressure will kill the string oscillation. Get your finger away from the fret. And then please tell us the effect.

Klaus

[jburtonca]

Originally Posted by 3234718

Is anyone using the pyramids? A while back I shelled out the 60 bucks to satisfy my curiosity but ended up taking them off. It seemed to me it took away the unique ubass tone, but tuning stability was nice.

I'm using the Pyramids on my Kala S.U.B. I posted some photos here a few weeks ago. I wanted a more electric tone for the solidbody. I have Thunderguts on my mahogany acoustic.

Jeff