New Fender American Vintage Series - Waiting Room

[ggvicviper]

Originally Posted by David281189

carvin sells direct, therefore their price calculation is different to other companys who have to worry about retailers ect...

but let's end this discussion here. people who like them should buy them if they think they're worth it and those who don't think they're worth it have a lot of other options to choose from and thats perfectly fine

Yeah, Carvin is a little different, but the other two aren't.

Yeah, to each their own, and if it makes you happy, then all the merrier. I'm still not happy with Fender right now though.

[savofenno]

Originally Posted by sigmafloyd

If they play/sound at least as good the current AVRI I would take any one of the new AVRIs at 2k over a lakland at 3k.

I agree. But i feel that Fender has become greedier.

[zortation]

Maybe you guys should read the specs before complaining about the price! These are NOT on the same level as their previous lineup. You will be paying more because you'll be getting more.

[David281189]

Originally Posted by zortation

Maybe you guys should read the specs before complaining about the price! These are NOT on the same level as their previous lineup. You will be paying more because you'll be getting more.

+1

[cigi]

Originally Posted by landau roof

Oh dear god, man. A 33% jump in MAP pricing is exorbitant. That is all.

I don't debate that. But I say you can't judge the new basses by some specs on a website. You have to play them to judge them. You don't know if they are the same quality as the current series. If that is the case it would definately be ridiculous. A 2008 american standard bass may be more expensive than a 2006, but the new american standards I've played were of way better quality than the old ones, so you're comparing apples with oranges. And the quality of the new american standards wasn't just in the objective specs. It was in more consistent build quality, lighter and more resonant woods...

That is all.

[king_biscuit]

Calling a corporation that makes luxury items greedy makes no sense. Fender is in the business of maximizing profits -- like most corporations -- not for charity or public good! I think you would have a better point calling a company like Exon Mobil greedy for gouging gasoline prices, because gas is an essential commodity and the few companies who produce it are essentially a monopoly.

[ggvicviper]

Originally Posted by king_biscuit

Calling a corporation that makes luxury items greedy makes no sense. Fender is in the business of maximizing profits -- like most corporations -- not for charity or public good! I think you would have a better point calling a company like Exon Mobil greedy for gouging gasoline prices, because gas is an essential commodity and the few companies who produce it are essentially a monopoly.

Basses are an essential commodity... For bassists

[ShowLow]

Looks like this discussion has taken a lighter tone and for that I am glad. As one of those who stoked the fires of pricing complaints, I apologize for contributing to the near-hijack of the thread.

Clearly there are those with strong opinions on both sides. In MBA school they taught us that pricing is independent of cost. It's all willingness to pay. And ultimately the market will determine whether these bad boys are good sellers or not.

Lest the moderators have any concerns, nothing to see here, nothing going on, we're cool. Never mind. [whistling]

[Dredmahawkus]

oh man that natural maple pearl block binding 74 is like the exact bass I have lusted for forever! Now I have to save!

[Joseph12]

Originally Posted by A-Step-Towards

Your forgetting something.

The 62's and 57's were $1500 and this 15-20% off could be applied towards those as well.

The fact you can get a % off doesnt really matter, we always could. The fact is the 57 P bass is now a 58 and the only really change is the neck isnt tinted, the decal is slightly different and they spaced the twelth fret dots differently, honestly I cant even tell the dots arent spaced to vintage specs on my 57', its freaking dots. I also way rather have the tint to the neck, then that white stick on the 58's.

The fact is there was a 25% jump in price from the 57 to the 58.

I know the pricing well and am not forgetting anything.
But go ahead and knock yourself out.

I wouldn't buy one of the new ones *now*, I'd jump on an old one now, would be a deal, (in fact I do have a line on a '57 that might work out).
But I wouldn't buy a '58 now, perhaps next year if I don't get the '57 this year.
I'm done, have fun, folks.

[P Bass Legend]

Originally Posted by zortation

Maybe you guys should read the specs before complaining about the price! These are NOT on the same level as their previous lineup. You will be paying more because you'll be getting more.

I'm pretty sure almost everyone in here already read the specs. It's exactly the same bass sound wise and almost the same bass aesthetic wise.

[D.M.N.]

I have to say, I went into my local music store today, and they had all of the new AVS Guitars in. I picked up a 65 Strat in Dakota Red, and I have to say, I was seriously blown away. One of the best instruments I've ever held. My guitarist has a CS 64 Strat in Surf Green, and this 65 was easily just as nice, if not better in my opinion. The neck was a fantastic shape, and the gloss on the back was like playing...I don't know, air? Ice? It was such low friction, my hand could just glide all over the place. I say the same thing about the old AVRI necks, but somehow this was different. On the old ones I'm aware that it's a gloss finish, and this Strat...it was like there was nothing, sort of hard to describe. The sound was lush and gorgeous, very clean and articulate, but not shrill or piercing. I played an older AVRI Strat (57?), and this one was definitely a step up in terms of that X-factor of playability. On paper there aren't many changes, but upon actually playing one of the new ones, you can feel the difference. The 64 Tele they had also had the one of the most beautiful bursts I've ever seen. I'd describe it as Vibrant. Whereas my AVRI P & J are quite orange and darker, this Tele had a very bright and yellow burst. Really cool. Also, have to love the binding on the Jazzmaster (plus the shoreline gold is stunning, I want a bass in that colour).

Anyways, I know this is about the guitars, but seeing all this...disgruntled sentiment regarding the price I figured a hands on review of part of this series was in order. The only other guitar I played that was in the same ballpark was a Gibson Custom NOS SG Standard, which was around the $3000 mark. So I think we need to think of these instruments not so much in terms of a revamping of the old AVRI line, but an entirely new deal. They are really stellar. I mean, don't get me wrong, I love my AVRIs and won't be rushing out to buy any of the new series anytime soon, but these instruments are just something else. Like I stated in an earlier I think part of the price increase is them rearranging their pricing structure (moving everything upward), and there is inflation, I mean, a brand new bass in the 60s was like $200. Prices go up. A couple years ago the old AVRI peaked at around $1600-1700 retail when Fender raised all their prices. And People weren't happy. So while I understand people's complaints about pricing, I don't think it's just the Fender Corporation trying to stick it to you. There's more to it than that. So that's my blurb for right now, I'm still looking forward to seeing these out and about


P.S. - That video reminded me of why I replaced the pickups in my 62 Jazz. Stock Jazz pickups are not my bag, I guess. The Precision basses though sounded killer.

[nukes_da_bass]

FMIC almost went bankrupt. IMO they have done amazing things to avoid bankruptcy and still stay in business.
You people are unbelievable! I'm one of FMICs worst critics around here, and I applaud their ability to survive.

Of you don't like the expensive high end American basses, they have 3 other offshore product lines to buy from.

[David281189]

Originally Posted by nukes_da_bass

FMIC almost went bankrupt. IMO they have done amazing things to avoid bankruptcy and still stay in business.
You people are unbelievable! I'm one of FMICs worst critics around here, and I applaud their ability to survive.

Of you don't like the expensive high end American basses, they have 3 other offshore product lines to buy from.

it wasn't that about...they just had to pay for a big credit or something that was due in 2011 or 2012. they managed to do so. in think in 2011 they even had the biggest revenue in company history, but the profit was really really small...but they still managed to make one
they're far from bankruptcy now

[the art guy]

Originally Posted by D.M.N.

I have to say, I went into my local music store today, and they had all of the new AVS Guitars in. I picked up a 65 Strat in Dakota Red, and I have to say, I was seriously blown away. One of the best instruments I've ever held. My guitarist has a CS 64 Strat in Surf Green, and this 65 was easily just as nice, if not better in my opinion. The neck was a fantastic shape, and the gloss on the back was like playing...I don't know, air? Ice? It was such low friction, my hand could just glide all over the place. I say the same thing about the old AVRI necks, but somehow this was different. On the old ones I'm aware that it's a gloss finish, and this Strat...it was like there was nothing, sort of hard to describe. The sound was lush and gorgeous, very clean and articulate, but not shrill or piercing. I played an older AVRI Strat (57?), and this one was definitely a step up in terms of that X-factor of playability. On paper there aren't many changes, but upon actually playing one of the new ones, you can feel the difference. The 64 Tele they had also had the one of the most beautiful bursts I've ever seen. I'd describe it as Vibrant. Whereas my AVRI P & J are quite orange and darker, this Tele had a very bright and yellow burst. Really cool. Also, have to love the binding on the Jazzmaster (plus the shoreline gold is stunning, I want a bass in that colour).

Anyways, I know this is about the guitars, but seeing all this...disgruntled sentiment regarding the price I figured a hands on review of part of this series was in order. The only other guitar I played that was in the same ballpark was a Gibson Custom NOS SG Standard, which was around the $3000 mark. So I think we need to think of these instruments not so much in terms of a revamping of the old AVRI line, but an entirely new deal. They are really stellar. I mean, don't get me wrong, I love my AVRIs and won't be rushing out to buy any of the new series anytime soon, but these instruments are just something else. Like I stated in an earlier I think part of the price increase is them rearranging their pricing structure (moving everything upward), and there is inflation, I mean, a brand new bass in the 60s was like $200. Prices go up. A couple years ago the old AVRI peaked at around $1600-1700 retail when Fender raised all their prices. And People weren't happy. So while I understand people's complaints about pricing, I don't think it's just the Fender Corporation trying to stick it to you. There's more to it than that. So that's my blurb for right now, I'm still looking forward to seeing these out and about


P.S. - That video reminded me of why I replaced the pickups in my 62 Jazz. Stock Jazz pickups are not my bag, I guess. The Precision basses though sounded killer.

What was the street price on the guitars there?

[Britbonic]

While this has been a fun thread with first speculation then actual photos, videos and pricing it's a bit silly until a few people have actually played them and can do a real hands on evaluation. Of course they sound great in the youtube video - those are professional musicians and no doubt Fender took the time to get the sound just right and culled what's in the video from many hours of playing. Think about the range of quality and price in Fender clone instruments - Sadowsky, Lull, Lakland, Alleva-Coppolla to name a few. Now imagine that all we had to judge them were some photos and a short video? "Can you believe the prices they're charging for a PBass??"

To Fender's credit, they continue to expand the range of options available over a range of price points. That's what good companies do, especially if they want to stay in business.

Greedy? I dunno. That fact that you can get a Squier Affinity PBass that is totally usable (maybe with a little setup work) for under $200 is amazing. The Squier CV and VM series are amazing. The MIM has gotten much better. Am Stds at $1000-1200 are pretty hard to beat in terms of quality and playability.

Not everything they make is great of course. I've played a couple of the new Select basses and don't understand why anyone would pay $2000 for one of those. There was also a shop here in town that a one point had over 20 CS relic'd basses. With the exception of the Pino, none of them were anything special and IMO were not even close to the quality and playability of my AVRI 57. Most sold for upwards of $2000 yet somebody must have bought them cause they're all gone now!

No doubt Fender did a fair bit of research and market analysis before deciding which models and how much to charge. I can understand that everyone has their favorite model variation but guess I don't understand all the outrage. There are so many options available, there are still 30 years worth of the old AVRIs out there and within a year there'll be a decent supply of used ones available for 20-30% less than new. Hopefully I can wait that long for my 74 in black!. Until then, I'm looking forward to getting my hands on a couple and see if they are all that.

No I don't work for Fender

[D.M.N.]

Originally Posted by the art guy

What was the street price on the guitars there?

They aren't known for their great deals, I think it had a tag saying $2199 or something? Which is lower than the MF price, but not by much. I'm sure they'll have a better sale price later in the year when they've been hanging around for longer. However, I don't think it's an unfair price. Like I said, these are every bit as good as the CS strat I've played. Once they start hitting the used market, if you can find them for $1800 or under, I'd consider them a pretty sweet deal.

[Personatech]

Originally Posted by David281189

it wasn't that about...they just had to pay for a big credit or something that was due in 2011 or 2012. they managed to do so. in think in 2011 they even had the biggest revenue in company history, but the profit was really really small...but they still managed to make one
they're far from bankruptcy now

Well, FMIC just shut down Hamer. They're still carrying $200 million in debt - not as far from bankruptcy as you might like to think: http://www.guitarsite.com/news/music...hamer-guitars/

[Pet Sounds]

Originally Posted by ShowLow

IIRC, the '74 had a 4-bolt neck plate.

According to the book "The Fender Bass," the three-bolt neck was introduced in late 1974.

[bigsnaketex]

All I can say is that I got a '59 American Vintage Strat recently in Faded Sonic Blue w/maple and it is so very sweet. The List price was $2874.99 and the MAP was $2299 and I walked out the door at $1749.

So there is hope folks.

And please, please support your LOCAL music stores. Leave the Wal-Mart guitar complexes to slowly drown in their own juices.