SPECTOR® Club - Part 53 (A tribute to our Spector Brother and Friend Chris Loe)

[bunkaroo]

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

It's so funny. I have bought so many tracks from Jammit that now I don't even know which ones to start with, LOL. I should just do what you do and just pick a few for each week and start moving on them.

I haven't even attempted any Dream Theater tracks since I know my skill level isn't there yet. I am occasionally playing through YYZ or Tom Sawyer by Rush but still can't play them up to speed yet but I am slowly getting there

Well if you're making headway on YYZ I think you'll be fine to try some of the DT stuff. I think "Innocence Faded" is a very fun song to play. I learned "Pull Me Under", "Take the Time", "6:00" and "Caught in a Web" when they first came out since I worshipped the band. I of course need to use the pick on those, but the fingerings give quite the work out. More recently I've been trying to get through "Beyond This Life" and "Never Enough" cleanly.

The thing I struggle with is how much time to spend playing these songs vs. sitting and working on my own stuff. Since they have all of Images and Words, Awake and Octavarium out the completist in me wants to learn them all but that's a huge time commitment.

The Queensryche stuff is great too. Some drop D stuff in there as well. Of course I have to admit once in a while I play along to "Rebel Yell" and just go nuts on the low B."

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

He is all fingers too so he does have a section that explains his 3 finger technique which is just insane. There are 2 different types of 3 finger techniques that he explains and I am getting the first one down but the second one is just going to take time. He shows it in this video so you only need to see the first minute:

The one I was already familiar with was the 3-2-1 ring-middle-index pattern. The funny thing like 20 years ago I started just playing along to whatever I was listening to in the car by "plucking" my gearshift with that technique before I even tried it on my bass, and after a while I was actually halfway decent at it. Obviously no substitute for practicing on the bass itself, but it got me fingers conditioned to move like that. I still like the pick better though - I love the precision.

[delucajohn2000]

Originally Posted by bunkaroo

Well if you're making headway on YYZ I think you'll be fine to try some of the DT stuff. I think "Innocence Faded" is a very fun song to play. I learned "Pull Me Under", "Take the Time", "6:00" and "Caught in a Web" when they first came out since I worshipped the band. I of course need to use the pick on those, but the fingerings give quite the work out. More recently I've been trying to get through "Beyond This Life" and "Never Enough" cleanly.

The thing I struggle with is how much time to spend playing these songs vs. sitting and working on my own stuff. Since they have all of Images and Words, Awake and Octavarium out the completist in me wants to learn them all but that's a huge time commitment.

The Queensryche stuff is great too. Some drop D stuff in there as well. Of course I have to admit once in a while I play along to "Rebel Yell" and just go nuts on the low B."



The one I was already familiar with was the 3-2-1 ring-middle-index pattern. The funny thing like 20 years ago I started just playing along to whatever I was listening to in the car by "plucking" my gearshift with that technique before I even tried it on my bass, and after a while I was actually halfway decent at it. Obviously no substitute for practicing on the bass itself, but it got me fingers conditioned to move like that. I still like the pick better though - I love the precision.

I really need to listen to Dream Theater more. I think the only song I know by them is "Pull me Under" since that was kind of their popular song back in the early 90's but I was never too much of a fan of James Labrie as a vocalist so I couldn't really sit and listen to them as much as I should have since they are all just amazing musicians. Watching them audition the drummers was a cool video to watch and got me to buy Black Clouds and Silver Linings but I haven't listened to it much yet.

I am really strange with vocalists for some strange reason, LOL. Probably one of of my favorite bands of all time is a band from the 80's called Marillion. Their first 4 CD's are just amazing to me and I still listen to them all regularly but once the original singer (Fish) left, I could never get into anything they put out afterwards. I am just odd I guess

I just received these today so this should be very interesting.

[bunkaroo]

Originally Posted by iceboxbass

Oh yeah, what's the title of his book? I know that I should practice with a pick on e in a while as I only finger play. Do you find that it's better/easier to play fast using a pick vs. fingers? With fingers you can use 3-4 fingers for faster songs. I tend to use James Jamerson's method of using my index finger solo for faster songs. Do you find since you played guitar for so many years that its just easier to use a pick? Sorry about the barrage of questions. Lol

I've been playing 25 years now, and for some reason I just started with a pick when I was 13. I was trying to learn Metallica, Megadeth and Slayer right away to play with some guys who had already been playing a few years and at the time the pick just seemed to be the best way to get up to speed quickly, no pun intended! It just always felt so natural to me so I've stayed with it over the years. I started mixing some fingerstyle about 15 years and have gradually added more as the years go by. But using the pick will always be easier for me. I'm so used to it I don't even really have to think about how I'm string hopping or alternating - it just happens. I also used a lot of staccato to try and emulate some fingerstyle stuff.

It's funny because since I do play a lot of guitar, people make the connection about me using a pick on bass, but I was playing bass for probably two years with a pick before I even started trying to play guitar seriously (for writing purposes).

I expect if I had spent as much time practicing with my fingers in my first 5 years of playing as I did with the pick I'd probably be very proficient at it, but the realities of trying to keep up with my bands made the choice for me.

At times it used to get to me that I wasn't considered a "real" bass player by some fingerstyle purists. I remember the band I moved to NYC to join in 1996, I replaced a very traditional fingerstyle player, and he played fretless. He also knew very little English even though he had moved to NYC years before from Japan. So he came out the band's first show without him, and he comes to me before the show when we were soundchecking and says in broken English "So pick, no fingers huh?" and I was like "Yep!". Then I proceeded to nail every song he had recorded as well as some new stuff. No comments after the show.

I come from the school of "if it sounds good, it is good". I might not have the prettiest technique, but I think I get the job done.

[bunkaroo]

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

I really need to listen to Dream Theater more. I think the only song I know by them is "Pull me Under" since that was kind of their popular song back in the early 90's but I was never too much of a fan of James Labrie as a vocalist so I couldn't really sit and listen to them as much as I should have since they are all just amazing musicians. Watching them audition the drummers was a cool video to watch and got me to buy Black Clouds and Silver Linings but I haven't listened to it much yet.

I am really strange with vocalists for some strange reason, LOL. Probably one of of my favorite bands of all time is a band from the 80's called Marillion. Their first 4 CD's are just amazing to me and I still listen to them all regularly but once the original singer (Fish) left, I could never get into anything they put out afterwards. I am just odd I guess

I just received these today so this should be very interesting.

I hear ya on Labrie - I've been listening to DT since before he joined, and there are many times I wish they had someone else singing. For me since I was waiting for every album to come out, it's easier to remember what happens in the songs. Trying to get into them now without much familiarity could be pretty daunting. Images and Words of course is their seminal record, but I think Awake and Scenes From a Memory are just as good. I'm not as gaga over what they've done in the past 10 years, but Systematic Chaos was pretty solid.

Very familiar with Marillion but more the post-Fish stuff. Please tell me you've listened to Porcupine Tree - if you like Marillion I can't see how you wouldn't like them.

Have fun with the BTBAM stuff - that stuff can't be easy!

[bunkaroo]

Well my Avalon U5 is waiting for me at home. Gonna be a tough choice between playing with it all night and watching the Hawks/Blues game.

[superdick2112]

Originally Posted by j.kernodle

how cool would it be to buy that ultraviolet Woodstock NS2 #813 to go with my Brooklyn NS2 #813? can anyone answer that?

Very cool! As cool as me buying it to go with my Woodstock NS-4....

[j.kernodle]

awesome! are you officially getting it?

[peledog]

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

That Bass Aerobics book really doesn't waste any time throwing some crazy songs at you. I stopped doing it for a while but now I am playing through it for at least 15-20 minutes each day with my practice schedule and I am finally getting it down.

Lessons 2 and 3 are insane if you don't keep at them so I am finally have lesson 2 down good and am close to getting the third one down as well. They just throw so many notes at you it gets tough to keep up with but that is really good and helped my playing a good amount. It seems like they are starting to tone down a few of the songs after those and work more on timing which is good.

Notice the cover artwork? It's a Spector Euro bridge, square saddles



I'm going to try this out. I'll check in with you and icebox to see how you are doing on this.

[delucajohn2000]

Originally Posted by bunkaroo

I hear ya on Labrie - I've been listening to DT since before he joined, and there are many times I wish they had someone else singing. For me since I was waiting for every album to come out, it's easier to remember what happens in the songs. Trying to get into them now without much familiarity could be pretty daunting. Images and Words of course is their seminal record, but I think Awake and Scenes From a Memory are just as good. I'm not as gaga over what they've done in the past 10 years, but Systematic Chaos was pretty solid.

Very familiar with Marillion but more the post-Fish stuff. Please tell me you've listened to Porcupine Tree - if you like Marillion I can't see how you wouldn't like them.

Have fun with the BTBAM stuff - that stuff can't be easy!

I have recently started listening to Porcupine Tree but I will be honest and say I never even heard of them until someone posted a live video from their concert DVD in this club actually.

Steven Wilson is coming to Pennsylvania in April I believe so I definitely want to check him out live. He has a killer band and after seeing that studio footage, I can't wait.

Originally Posted by peledog

Notice the cover artwork? It's a Spector Euro bridge, square saddles



I'm going to try this out. I'll check in with you and icebox to see how you are doing on this.

Yeah, I think it is a Rebop if I am not mistaken I really do like this book but it was a bit overwhelming to me at first so I put it aside for a while. Now that I have figured out a good way to work with the songs, it is going much better and I am using it much more.

At first, I tried to just follow along with it and the tracks just move too fast and are all over the place since I can't read that fast. Every time I would look at the fret board to find the correct position, it would change or I would lose my place so I was just upsetting myself Now I take it in parts and figure them out and then put them all together which is working much better.

[superdick2112]

Originally Posted by j.kernodle

awesome! are you officially getting it?

Sadly, no...

I will, however, have enough saved by the end of the year to finally order my ultraviolet NS-2. I plan on getting some different options, including 5A tube quilt wings, ebony board, chrome hardware, a Wimbish neck profile and a lighter overall color, with just a bit more pink in the finish.
Most likely this one will be ordered through Todd at Guitar House, as he has been very helpful & clear in my communications with him.

[bunkaroo]

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

I have recently started listening to Porcupine Tree but I will be honest and say I never even heard of them until someone posted a live video from their concert DVD in this club actually.

Steven Wilson is coming to Pennsylvania in April I believe so I definitely want to check him out live. He has a killer band and after seeing that studio footage, I can't wait.

That show will be awesome. I've heard enough of the new album to know it will be something to hear it live and they're playing it all. Too bad I have to miss it - I'll be in Pittsburgh for a wedding.

Let me just say three words to get you into Porcupine Tree: In Absentia and Deadwing (OK that's four words). If you don't like those then you probably won't get into the rest. The SW solo stuff is lot more experimental but very cool in its own way.

[delucajohn2000]

Originally Posted by bunkaroo

That show will be awesome. I've heard enough of the new album to know it will be something to hear it live and they're playing it all. Too bad I have to miss it - I'll be in Pittsburgh for a wedding.

Let me just say three words to get you into Porcupine Tree: In Absentia and Deadwing (OK that's four words). If you don't like those then you probably won't get into the rest. The SW solo stuff is lot more experimental but very cool in its own way.

The wedding isn't in Pittsburg on 4/30 by chance, is it? They are playing in Pittsburgh that day, haha.

Ok, I bought In Absentia and Fear of a Black Planet so I will need to hit iTunes right now and get Deadwing as well.

I am just so psyched by the band Steven Wilson has so I am really looking forward to seeing them. How Dream Theater didn't pick Marco Minnemann after watching those drummer auditions is beyond me but hey, it's good he is with Steven Wilson now. I have always been a huge fan of Nick Beggs too. Say what you want about Kajagoogoo but "Too shy" has an amazing bass line

[tomydacat]

IM gonna have to go look at that book for sure...Thanks Guys..

[awilkie84]

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

Yeah, I think it is a Rebop if I am not mistaken I really do like this book but it was a bit overwhelming to me at first so I put it aside for a while. Now that I have figured out a good way to work with the songs, it is going much better and I am using it much more.

Doesn't look much like a ReBop. the neck doesn't curve down to the pocket like a ReBop neck. The body seems a bit wide for a Woodstock Spector, too. Maybe it's some sort of Bolt-on NS-2000?

[bunkaroo]

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

The wedding isn't in Pittsburg on 4/30 by chance, is it? They are playing in Pittsburgh that day, haha.

Ok, I bought In Absentia and Fear of a Black Planet so I will need to hit iTunes right now and get Deadwing as well.

I am just so psyched by the band Steven Wilson has so I am really looking forward to seeing them. How Dream Theater didn't pick Marco Minnemann after watching those drummer auditions is beyond me but hey, it's good he is with Steven Wilson now. I have always been a huge fan of Nick Beggs too. Say what you want about Kajagoogoo but "Too shy" has an amazing bass line

It's actually the following weekend but I did see that date. I think the 30th is a Tuesday so I won't be out there yet.

Yeah Marco is a beast. I'm actually glad they didn't pick him because it wouldn't have lasted. He's a more interesting drummer than Mangini IMO, but he would have chafed in that band. I knew they'd pick Mangini because he's the most similar to them personality-wise, plus he seemed to kiss some serious butt about the opportunity. Minneman would have been like "yeah, cool" but he wasn't all gaga over it I don't think. Plus he was then free to work with Steven who is IMO the most important prog musician alive at the moment.

Oh and Beggs smokes. I didn't know much about him before Grace For Drowning came out. When I saw the tour I was most impressed. I don't know if he or Wilson wrote the bass parts for "Luminol" but damn do they rock on the Spector.

[loend68]

Originally Posted by peledog

Notice the cover artwork? It's a Spector Euro bridge, square saddles



I'm going to try this out. I'll check in with you and icebox to see how you are doing on this.

Yup looks like an artist's rendition of a Rebop to me! Dot inlays, black hardware, humbuckers, bolt on neck.....

Spector represented!

[ebradfordrich]

Originally Posted by bunkaroo

I come from the school of "if it sounds good, it is good". I might not have the prettiest technique, but I think I get the job done.

I've attended that school too. I tried like hell to be a fingerstyle-only player but eventually I just gave up and reached for a pick. The real culprit besides my mediocre bass chops? Those stupid octaves in My Sharona by the Knack. They're waaaay easier with a pick.

[cjmodulus]

Originally Posted by delucajohn2000

I really need to listen to Dream Theater more. I think the only song I know by them is "Pull me Under" since that was kind of their popular song back in the early 90's but I was never too much of a fan of James Labrie as a vocalist so I couldn't really sit and listen to them as much as I should have since they are all just amazing musicians. Watching them audition the drummers was a cool video to watch and got me to buy Black Clouds and Silver Linings but I haven't listened to it much yet.

I am really strange with vocalists for some strange reason, LOL. Probably one of of my favorite bands of all time is a band from the 80's called Marillion. Their first 4 CD's are just amazing to me and I still listen to them all regularly but once the original singer (Fish) left, I could never get into anything they put out afterwards. I am just odd I guess

I just received these today so this should be very interesting.

Have fun working through those BTBAM books! I wish I had more time to- I got through most of prequel to the sequel when I first got the colors book, but haven't had much time to look at either one since. Each track is a great work out and an interesting lesson in crafting bass lines that work well in such a chaotic setting.

[bunkaroo]

Originally Posted by cjmodulus

Each track is a great work out and an interesting lesson in crafting bass lines that work well in such a chaotic setting.

Quick someone send diechris a copy of these right now!

[cjmodulus]

Originally Posted by bunkaroo

Quick someone send diechris a copy of these right now!

Haha, I watched those videos too, and I agree, Chris has his work cut out for him! I'm a big djent fan, so I plan on checking out more of their stuff.

Just as an aside, during most heavy riffing in djent, the bass usually plays in unison with the guitars, but lays down more of a groove when the music gets more ambient. At least, that's what I've gathered from listening to a lot of Periphery.

Sounds like a fun gig. I really want to get a djent project going, if only there were like-minded musicians nearby!