What is this?! (Fake-n-backer?)

[Exemonium]

http://www.flickr.com/photos/5585057...th/5170294749/



Here's what I know of this bass...It's been in this older woman's closet for at least 12 years. It was owned by her brother in the 70's. I'm trying to figure out if it's legit, what actual model it is, etc.

I'm new to Ricks so for all I know it could be real, but things aren't right here...like the badass II bridge. The lame "thumbrest" the pickups, and the knobs and switches I can't find info for. After market tuners. It has a brass nut too.

If anyone has ANY help it'd be greatly appreciated. Also I'm wondering if it's still possible to restore it to a general Rick look even if it's not a genuine Rickenbacker.

Also...not too sure what these switches even do...seriously any info at all is great haha

Thank you

[hdracer]

It's a modded December 1976 4001
Looks like a DiMarzo Model one pup at the neck & stock bridge pup

[Exemonium]

Well, I know that's what the plate says, but why are the pickups reversed and the knobs/switches different from other 4001's? I can't seem to find any info about a Rick that looks anything like this one.

[hdracer]

It was modded at sometime

[weekend warrior]

Theres nothing fake about it! Its a REAL Rick 4001! A really modded one.But real just the same

[Darkstrike]

Just heavliy modified, is all.

I assume he changed the controls to incorperate that Bartolini just beside the bridge.

[Exemonium]

Somewhat of a bummer, because I love the looks of a regular Rickenbacker. I may have to put it back to normal haha. What would you guys say something like this is worth modded and in this condition? Just a ballpark guess

[Exemonium]

Also, would it be difficult/expensive to make it look like a stock Rickenbacker again?

[kcole4001]

New Pickguard ($50 at Pickguardian), new neck pup ($75 from RIC or a dealer), replacement bridge/tail ($250 from RIC, though currently unavailable, you could try a dealer or an Allparts copy on ebay), control harness ($60 from RIC, again temp. unavailable), and possibly the jacks ($25 from RIC, you guessed it, temp. unavailable) should about cover the resto job.
Looks to be a fairly typical 1970s mod job, the pickguard and tailpiece should cover any extraneous routing which will be found under the plastic pieces.

You could source pots, switch, and jacks from any electronics supplier to be a little cheaper if you care to wire it yourself, the proper diagram is downloadable from the RIC site.

Price wise, maybe $700-800 tops. You could still sell off the extra parts if you don't envision using them on another project.
Shouldn't be hard, someone is always looking for a BA II bridge.

The main thing to look for is a neck crack under or near the nut. A sure sign of improperly adjusted truss rods.
Also check the rods to make sure they're still functioning properly. The neck should be the main concern, all the hardware is easily replaceable.

JoeysBassNotes is an excellent place to get familiar with Rick set up techniques.

I STRONGLY recommend a visit there first.

[kcole4001]

Uh oh!
It seems Joey hasn't been maintaining his site!

Check out the RIC forum and RicResource for technical details.
I can provide some assistance as well.

[cassius987]

A while back Joey told me he was having trouble keeping his server going for some reason or other--I think his friend owns the web space and there was some sort of problem.

I think we all take his web site for granted at this point! We ought to send him a card or something periodically and just say something like, "Hey, we're all still grateful!"

[Exemonium]

Would people still think of this like an actual Rickenbacker for trades and such do you think? To me it's kinda not...but at the same time yes. What are your opinions everyone? Or has it been so far modded that it's the former shell of what was once a Rickenbacker?

I guess to me if someone stuck a musicman pickup in the bridge of a jazz bass...it's no longer a jazz bass, even though it may look and/or sound kinda cool....and essentially be a warwick jazzman >.<

Also, I'm kinda checking up on this for my elderly friend, I'd like to give some money for it, but I'm unsure what it's worth in the "rearranged" condition, no other parts with it, just as is. I surely don't ever wish to rip anyone off, but I can't afford to overpay either. :-/

thanks again for all of your help everyone!

[nato101010]

I think if you played it as is, everyone would think its just a Rick.
It wouldn't sound like one so much, but it sure looks like one.

[Baron Von Vik]

Do all ricks have a brass (or whatever metal) nut? My Dano has an aluminum nut, I think it adds to the sound.

[s_mcsleazy]

who would mod a bass like that

[kcole4001]

Originally Posted by Exemonium

Would people still think of this like an actual Rickenbacker for trades and such do you think? To me it's kinda not...but at the same time yes. What are your opinions everyone? Or has it been so far modded that it's the former shell of what was once a Rickenbacker?

I guess to me if someone stuck a musicman pickup in the bridge of a jazz bass...it's no longer a jazz bass, even though it may look and/or sound kinda cool....and essentially be a warwick jazzman >.<

Also, I'm kinda checking up on this for my elderly friend, I'd like to give some money for it, but I'm unsure what it's worth in the "rearranged" condition, no other parts with it, just as is. I surely don't ever wish to rip anyone off, but I can't afford to overpay either. :-/

thanks again for all of your help everyone!

Like I said, it's pretty easily restored to looking and sounding original if you want, though the routing will still be there even if you won't be able to see it, that's going to keep the value lower than a purely stock bass.

If you've played it and it feels good, it should be worth $800 tops, maybe less depending on other factors (finish condition, truss rods, etc).
It will require a few hundred to return to original configuration, so bear that in mind, and the value can never match an unmodded bass unless it's had it's routs filled and been refinished by a good luthier. Then I feel that the value would be equal or even better than a 'vintage' or just a used old bass.
Rick usually collectors value condition over 'mojo', quite the opposite of Fender collectors.
A modded bass is generally of little or no interest to a Rick collector unless it's quite a rare model or has rare features, and this looks to be a standard run of the mill 1970s 4001.

It should however make a great player's bass.

As far as trades go, again, the value of the modded bass is much less than a stock bass, simply because the mods are unknown factors, most folks interested in a 4001 know what to expect sonically and this configuration is only slightly (original bridge pup) resembles a stock bass.
Once it's back in stock trim, it would make better trade bait, maybe $1000-1200 max, again, depending on the finish condition and rods.

If you're looking to make a little bundle from reselling it, you must be able to get it very cheap, fix it up, then find the right buyer. Too many variables to be a good gamble.

You'll most likely get out of it what you put into it, but probably not much more, certainly not enough to justify all the work purely on a monetary basis.
As a project or learning experience it would be fun if you're into that, though.

The best bet is to buy it to play yourself, or for a modding project of your own.

After all that, I should state that I don't think all mods are necessarily bad, it may sound great as is, you never know.
Personaly, I'd restore it.

[kcole4001]

Originally Posted by Baron Von Vik

Do all ricks have a brass (or whatever metal) nut? My Dano has an aluminum nut, I think it adds to the sound.

The vast majority of Ricks have a bakelite nut, mostly black but some had white.

[Baron Von Vik]

Originally Posted by kcole4001

The vast majority of Ricks have a bakelite nut, mostly black but some had white.

Right on. This guy was a real DIY-er, nice fill in the tuner holes.

[Exemonium]

Yes I'm very much into breathing life into old guitars and basses. It's how I have some of my favorite guitars. But I've not dealt with an old bass before...and I'm still trying to figure out how this monster is wired. As far as I can tell it seems to be switches for each p/u then tone controls for each, with a master volume. regardless it does a have a unique tone that I'm starting to dig. I've always liked a more hollow sound rather than a "tinny/ twangy" sound. The humbucker in the neck gives that, BUT it's got a nice crispness to the sound....and these are 20 yr old flatwounds on it! I'm sure if I used rounds it'd really pop...but I plan on sticking with flats. Knowing it needs work, and what it's worth as-is, and how much it's going to cost to get even the bridge and pickup housing, I'm scared to offer a lot haha. But I'll pass along all of this info, and see what she thinks. She's kind of a family friend so that helps too.

[kesslari]

Originally Posted by s_mcsleazy

who would mod a bass like that

It's not the freakin' Mona Lisa.
It's a bass. And the guy who owned maybe liked the way it played, but wanted a different sound.