What makes a great fretless?

miziomix · #1 06-26-2011, 06:47 AM

Feel free to add what I might have missed

Lambic · #2 06-26-2011, 06:53 AM

What makes a great instrument ?

The musician !

Some luthiers do make great instruments, though, some of them even fretless...

Staunch · #3 06-26-2011, 07:07 AM

What makes a great fretless?....

Why, a complete lack of frets, of course!

**Matthew_84** · #4 06-26-2011, 07:07 AM

I chose great passive sound, touch and inspiration, because it's the closest option to what I think makes a great fretless: the fingerboard.

RedLeg · #5 06-26-2011, 07:08 AM

Epoxy and great ears

miziomix · #6 06-26-2011, 07:24 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew_84

I chose great passive sound, touch and inspiration, because it's the closest option to what I think makes a great fretless: the fingerboard.

Indeed. How could I miss the FB...

What do you expect from a fingerboard? Aside from not disintegrating in 6 months. I like Ebony. But i haven't tried any other wood at the same level as E so far.

Do you think a specific radius makes a difference? I like it almost flat or 17 on fretted. But somehow I feel 12 or less better suits a f-less.

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedLeg

Epoxy and great ears

Is it mainly to protect the wood? I mean, the epoxy

RedLeg · #7 06-26-2011, 07:29 AM

nah, it is to get that jaco/manring tone (it does protect the FB too). after all if you didn't want that tone on a fless, wouldnt you just play upright

lol

miziomix · #8 06-26-2011, 07:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RedLeg

nah, it is to get that jaco/manring tone (it does protect the FB too). after all if you didn't want that tone on a fless, wouldnt you just play upright

lol

I see... then again, one would have to learn how to play upright

You don't think Ebony alone would give you that tone?

Darkstrike · #9 06-26-2011, 07:37 AM

A hard, well made fingerboard for low action and lots of mwah, a stiff neck, and a good set of pickups, especially the bridge pickup.

They're IMHO, the major factors, but of course the total package being top class is best.

spade2you · #10 06-26-2011, 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miziomix

You don't think Ebony alone would give you that tone?

Not as well.

RedLeg · #11 06-26-2011, 07:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miziomix

I see... then again, one would have to learn how to play upright

You don't think Ebony alone would give you that tone?

I do not. my fless has epoxy coated ebony with low action. my old warwick fless just didnt do the "jaco/manring" thing. when I play salsa, I break out the azola EUB. FWIW, learn some upright. last newyears I made 250 euro playing 12 bar all night.

cnltb · #12 06-26-2011, 07:50 AM

Just like any bass, it needs to balance well, not be heavy and be comfortable to play overall.
It should also sound good, with a tone that does not start to get on my nerves all too quickly.
I saw an incredible Fretless instrument at Frankfurt Musikmesse.
The "Diva", by Marleaux. Not sure what woods are used, but I do know that it feels very good.
My next fretless bass will have a rosewood fingerboard as I prefer it to ebony.

Bassmickeyd · #13 06-26-2011, 07:55 AM

I like an ebony fretboard with a heavier alder body.

LowEndMan2112 · #14 06-26-2011, 08:15 AM

Is this undercover work for the Uber Jay Mk III?

But IMO its a mix of some of the options above ... as you can see above fingerboard has an impact for a lot of people with ebony probably being the most widely used. Electronics play a fairly big part, I personally prefer passive when it comes to fretless and a good set of pickups is pretty important, especially the bridge pickup if you want the Jaco-esque sound. Something that hasnt been mentioned yet, flatwounds versus roundwounds, simple but a huge factor in your tone!

conqr · #15 06-26-2011, 08:15 AM

cliche, but no mwah capability no fretless, so great mwah - yeah i'll say it again MMMWWUUUAAAAAARRRRR

**Matthew_84** · #16 06-26-2011, 08:27 AM

When I mentioned fingerboard, I really just meant it in a broad term, but I should have said a "great fingerboard". Which is clearly levelled perfectly but other than that, it's all subjective. Someone may want a lined fretless with a think coat of epoxy to get the Jaco tone, while the other may want a blank sheet of ebony with no finish to get an upright sound.

I think the two major factors in a fretless is the fingerboard construction (the two options I listed and anything in between) and pick-up locations. Having a pick-up near the bridge would lean towards Jaco territory while a pick-up closer to the neck (preferably a bit closer to the neck than usual) would go into upright territory.

It's all want the player wants. Again to me, a great fingerboard is the most important, followed by a killer pick-up or two. But if I only had one pick-up, I'd prefer it at the neck, but that's me and what I'm after.

bass rocks · #17 06-26-2011, 08:29 AM

great bridge pup,just turn thr neck one off

dakpluto · #18 06-26-2011, 08:47 AM

The person standing behind the body of the bass makes a great fretless (or a bad one!)

StyleOverShow · #19 06-26-2011, 09:09 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew_84

I chose great passive sound, touch and inspiration, because it's the closest option to what I think makes a great fretless: the fingerboard.

ditto!

nrssab · #20 06-26-2011, 09:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matthew_84

When I mentioned fingerboard, I really just meant it in a broad term, but I should have said a "great fingerboard". Which is clearly levelled perfectly but other than that, it's all subjective. Someone may want a lined fretless with a think coat of epoxy to get the Jaco tone, while the other may want a blank sheet of ebony with no finish to get an upright sound.

I think the two major factors in a fretless is the fingerboard construction (the two options I listed and anything in between) and pick-up locations. Having a pick-up near the bridge would lean towards Jaco territory while a pick-up closer to the neck (preferably a bit closer to the neck than usual) would go into upright territory.

It's all want the player wants. Again to me, a great fingerboard is the most important, followed by a killer pick-up or two. But if I only had one pick-up, I'd prefer it at the neck, but that's me and what I'm after.

A perfect fingerboard is the biggest need for a good fretless. I have had endless problems with mine, and it's still not over. The minimal bump or unevenness will take the fun out of everything. The buzz on a Fretless is very annoying, specially when looking for a Jaco like sound.
So thats very important. Better take you hands off soft fingerboard woods. The harder the better. An epoxy coating is also not something very easy to apply and level out, also the wood underneath is a factor. It sure protects the wood but it does take the warmth out of the tone. Which of course is a good thing if you are looking for that.

Like said: pickups are also a big influence as usual. To cover all tones the best is to have a JM or PM combination, preferably even a splittable Humbucker at the bridge. As to positioning: for the neck PU, close to the neck and the bridge PU, a bit further from the bridge.
I do not have much experience with Piezo, but I hear it as a great extra if you have a semi-hollow or hollow body. As we can hear nicely from the Rob Allen basses.

Strings are also important. I can recommend, for all purposes the DR HighBeam Flatwounds. They will: protect your fingerboard, reduce your buzzing and give you a full tone with lots of harmony.

At the end it all depends on the player. The technique of each player has a very big influence on the tone. You can do so many things with a fretless bass it should be seen as an instrument for it's self. One shouldn't try to make it sound like an upright or a fretted bass, better is to concentrate on all the variety of beautiful tones one can get out of it.

Enjoy!
Regards.