A few DI questions

Discussion in 'Live Sound [BG]' started by Iheartreverb, Nov 29, 2013.


  1. Iheartreverb

    Iheartreverb

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2013
    So in the practice room I am struggling to be heard over 2 guitarists playing Marshall 900's into 4x10's without pushing the amp more that in would like.

    So I am thinking of using a DI into the pa in the rooms, my questions are,

    Will this work? Dial in my clean sound and then control volume at the desk without adding gain

    Would you run balanced out to desk and unbalanced to amp as well? Would one cancel out the other on the DI? Would there be any advantage to having the amp running as well?

    Does anyone do this as a permanent hogging situation and just not use amps? I'm just thinking about a consistent sound when we get to that point.

    Thanks in advance, any help appreciated
     
  2. timonvh

    timonvh

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2010
    I would look for a band with two guitarists playing no more than say a Princeton during rehearsals.
    Timon
     
  3. vbchaos

    vbchaos

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    Sep 5, 2011
    Location:
    Groningen, The Netherlands
    Disclosures:
    Uncompensated endorsing user: fEARful
    To answer your question: Yes, go bass -> DI -> mixer

    But allow me a sidenote: Your guitarist have to turn down! And you proberly have to roll off some lows and give it a bit more in the mids
     
  4. Robus

    Robus Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 25, 2013
    Location:
    Chicago Area
    Your guitarist have their heads up their
    amps.
     
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  6. slaerts

    slaerts

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    Aug 3, 2006
    I run bass DI then to PA and if needed to amp as well .Having said that if I can't hear anything over the guitarists, I put my bass down and speak very quietly to them. If it is a problem I don't play. My hearing is too important.
     
  7. Iheartreverb

    Iheartreverb

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2013
    Thanks for advice guys. We are using borrowed amps (that is already in the rooms) to save people carrying their gear and getting on trains with them.
    I just can't get a decent clean sound to compete with volume.

    I could get them to to turn down but think DI is a better permanent solution. Just wanted to pick people's brains
     
  8. Downunderwonder

    Downunderwonder

    Joined:
    Aug 26, 2009
    Location:
    New Zealand
    Brains say get the hell out.

    What you are proposing is fighting fire with turpentine.

    The solution is simple, get the guitar amps elevated and pointed directly at heads of player. They will complain, they will say they lost their low end, in reality they are hearing the actual tone of the cab since there are no lows from guitar lost with a 3ft lift off the floor. Simple physics as reliable as apples falling from trees.

    Slamming their skulls with the icepick tone will get them real in short order.
     
  9. Joe Louvar

    Joe Louvar

    Joined:
    Jun 6, 2011
    Location:
    Santa Rosa, CA USA
    Nope - you need to get the guitards to TURN DOWN!!!

    TIP: Invest in good hearing protection (ear plugs).
     
  10. morgansterne

    morgansterne

    Joined:
    Oct 25, 2011
    Location:
    Cleveland Ohio
    To answer your first question you certainly could go to the PA and to your amp. That's what would be happening at a venue, right?

    To your second question, I was playing bass with a group a while back that I thought rehearsed kind of loud. I brought my zoom b3 pedal and plugged into the PA. I flat out told 'em I'm not using an amp and if you have trouble hearing me then turn down. I stood right by one of the PA speakers with earplugs in.

    Everybody can tell you all day that your guitars need to turn down or move amps, but if you're sharing a practice space then moving the amps around doesn't sound practical.
     
  11. Robus

    Robus Supporting Member

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    Aug 25, 2013
    Location:
    Chicago Area
    No. It's NOT a better permanent solution. You're looking for a way to get too loud as well, so that you can compete with them. If you were thinking about permanent solutions, you'd be thinking about your hearing and your ability to keep playing music years from now, not how to compete in a volume war with a pair of Marshall half stacks.

    That is an absurd amount of amplification for a practice space, and probably more than you need for most of the venues where you're likely to play live.
     
  12. David Hayes

    David Hayes Guest

    Some conclusions are being drawn about what is absurd without even the most basic of information. What size is the practice room? What sort of band is this?

    Many people, in fact most professional productions, rehearse the show with the same stuff they play the show with.

    That said, it is a very good possibility your guitar players are too loud and you could use a little help with your EQ.
     
  13. timonvh

    timonvh

    Joined:
    Oct 16, 2010
    "...in fact most professional productions..."
    We're talking TB here, okay? Gimme a break.
    Timon
     
  14. spz8

    spz8

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    Jan 19, 2009
    Location:
    Glen Cove, NY
    IMO, you should NEVER need a PA in a practice room for anything but vocals. :rollno: Completely ridiculous. Turn guitars down or quit while you still have some hearing left.
     
  15. David Hayes

    David Hayes Guest

    Being new here I guess I misunderstood. I'm sorry.

    I suppose other than studios, I have no modern experience playing in garages, basements or other small spaces so I guess I have no relevant input.
     
  16. kikstand454

    kikstand454 Supporting Member

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    Sep 28, 2012
    If either guitar player is up past "2" or 8oclock then they need to turn down. Period.
     
  17. Downunderwonder

    Downunderwonder

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    Aug 26, 2009
    Location:
    New Zealand
    Turning off the reverb would help.
     
  18. chadhargis

    chadhargis Jack of all grooves, master of none Supporting Member

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    Jan 5, 2010
    Location:
    Nashville, TN
    Why do the guitar players need a 410 cab for rehearsal? A small combo would do fine.

    I'm so used to playing with nearly no stage volume. The guitar player amps his cab, but everyone else goes direct. Even the drums are electronic. I gotta say, it's nice, but I do miss feeling the kick drum.
     
  19. Schmorgy

    Schmorgy

    Joined:
    Jul 2, 2012
    Location:
    Canada
    My guitarists did this ALL the time through their 5150 Heads and stacks. Their excuses were "It's already down to '1' on the volume knob (that's what your guitar's volume pot is for numbnuts)" or "It's to hear over the drums (you'd hear better if you didn't insist on playing right next to them)". The resultant sound war between all the other members of the band led to me just not bothering to play half the time. No one could tell anyway.
     
  20. Iheartreverb

    Iheartreverb

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2013

    It's a 5 piece post rock style band. Drums, 2 guitarists and another keys/electronics/guitar and me.

    Because of the style of music my tone need to sound good in the mix but also on its own as there are parts where my playing in more central over some ambient stuff.

    I'm well aware of how practical it would be to practice with the same gear we would play with but it's just not possible.

    I could be accused of under powering my tone. I always (when playing at home) have the gain at less than half the volume and although I understand the pre/post amp/ gain structure thing if I drive the amp anywhere up to the gain peak it is far too distorted for my tastes.

    Thanks for help so far guys
     
  21. molteni

    molteni

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2009
    Location:
    SW Michigan
    if you must compete for sonic space; ear plugs, go direct hopefully you will have some eq control on your bass and crank the mids.... where we practice its a 25ft square room,marshalls for 2 guitars are pointing across stage(4x12's)frontals point out etc.(lotsa sound pressure in there!) drums miked. you can definately feel the kick etc. I don't have to turn my rig up much.... this has helped my situation alot.we get a really nice mix and keep everything undercontrol (most of the time)cheers!
     

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