Bergantino AE112 -vs- Audiokinesis TC112......with Aguilar TH500

Discussion in 'Amps [BG]' started by g4string, Jan 8, 2014.


  1. g4string

    g4string Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2002
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    Guys/girls......need your opinion on how a Berg AE112 will stack up to an AK TC112. Been thinking about pulling the trigger on an AE112, just need some background info before I say yay or nay.

    My only cab at the moment is the Audiokinesis TC112 (4ohm variant). I like the cab very much. It's light, powerful, extremely easy to schlep, brilliant switchology, and I love the room adaptability via the removable ports. It's ugliness/homemade look has grown on me. People look at it like it's some home made POS or possibly something bought from radio shack when the y actually sold stiff beside cell phones....that makes me like it more. Sometimes, I find it too smooth and find myself craving a more aggressive sound. But with all of its advantages, it's smooth character is something I can over look. Prior to me purchasing the TC112, I owned a pair of DB112's. Albeit better looking and better sounding as pair.....I can cover a lot of ground with one TC112. I wish my TC112 had some of the aggressive character of the DB112's. This is where I'm hoping the AE112 can pop in........

    Right now, my plan would be to buy the one and search for another to complete a pair. I'd keep the TC for rehearsals and on the go stuff where portability is key. I'd use the the single AE's separate as needed.....but mainly would be nice to have a pair of 112's on reserve for bigger stuff my TC112 couldn't do.

    So I am curious, how will the single AE112 compare in overall volume to my TC112?

    Could a 4ohm TC112 trump a pair of AE112's?

    Will the AE112 give me that aggressive tone I am missing with my TC112

    What's the weight on a AE112?

    I often thought both DB112's had a somewhat floppy or boomy bottom end. Will a pair of AE112's be tighter on the bottom than my old pair of DB's?

    FWIW, my amp is an Aguilar TH500. How would you predict an AE112 would sound with my amp? Any issues with comparability?

    Thanks for all of your input. Peace.
  2. Eublet

    Eublet Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    I've not had a TC112. I had an AE112, for all of 30 minutes. Ordered one, played with it a bit, and boxed it back up and put it up for sale here. Didn't care for it at all. I wouldn't say it's aggressive necessarily, at least not in the way the DB112 cabinet is (which is one of my favorites). It did have that upper-mid character that so many lightweight neo cabinets seem to have, but not in a good way. I also had that hollowness in the mids, and a fairly dry, non-round bottom end. Totally boring sounding to my ears, but that's just me.

    If you want aggressive and present, check out a Baer ML112. It'll totally bury most any 112 on the market, but in a very aggressive and cool way that is fantastic with the Tone Hammer 500. Seriously...it's exactly what you are describing. By all accounts, it'll have all the wump (and possibly more) of your TC112, not quite as deep, but more round, and then it'll have a mid and presence character that those ultra clean cabinets just can't give you. It's been compared very heavily to the db112 in terms of it's presence in a mix. It's a wonderful cab.
  3. Doug Parent

    Doug Parent Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    May 31, 2004
    Location:
    San Diego, Ca.
    AE112 : my least favorite Berg cab of all. Nuff said.
  4. g4string

    g4string Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2002
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    Thanks for the review. I've owned a pair of ML112's in the past. If flipped them for a pair of DB's. I like both the ML's and DB's for their own respective reasons. I guess the only thing that is remotely holding me back on getting another ML is price. A covered shipped ML is about 7 1/2 Benjamin's. The AE I was looking at was $475, possibly some wiggle room if I made an offer. I guess my choices are wait for a used pair of black DB112's to surface.....which really do sound great IMO -or- just bite the bullet and repurchase another ML. I'm not in a hurry....my gigging band disbanded -AND- the TC112 can handle ANY bar/club gig I throw at it.
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  6. KJung

    KJung

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Location:
    Wisconsin and Upper Michigan
    You would need two AE112's to keep up with your TC112 (two AE's will outperform the TC112, but one won't even be close). However, the tonality might be more to your liking.... very punchy, bright up top, grinds nicely, etc.

    Per the above, to get a cab with most of the output of the TC112, voiced a bit more traditionally (meaning a bit more of that low mid meat and a more organic top end), the Baer ML112 is the best bet. The CN112 is more impressive than the AE112, and will get you probably 75% there, with a quite similar tonality to the Baer ML112.

    A stack of AE112's is pretty killer though, and interestingly, has very little similarity to the deeply voiced, more hi fi AE212.
  7. bucephylus

    bucephylus Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Aug 18, 2002
    Caveat: I have not played the TC112 or the ML112 (I know, deprived child).

    First, I'm not sure what you mean by more aggressive. I see you play a JO. I've heard Ken's clips with the TC; and it sounded pretty killer to me. OK, very balanced; but, I'm pretty sure I could coax what I look for from a J out of it.

    That said, then there is the thing about there being two differently voiced versions of the AE112. Don't know how that might affect what you are looking for. Also, there is the HD112, which is a VERY stout little box that produces some very excellent tones. I do have and use one of those on a regular basis. OK, it is a little more hefty than the AE; but not too bad; and the Baer is also a bit more hefty (though a bit less).

    Of course, the best thing would be to get all these cabs side by side, and then figure out what your are after. I know, perfect world, right? Good luck with the search. At some point, these things make my head hurt, and I have to get back to just playing.:D
  8. RColie

    RColie Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Nov 21, 2007
    Location:
    St. Louis, MO
    Most of the relevant points have already been made, but I can still add my 2 cents.

    I believe your TC112 used to belong to me. I had seller's regret so I'm re-equipping myself with AudioKinesis cabs (I have the TC115v2 and might add a pair of TC112v2 8 ohms).

    All the cabs mentioned in your thread are just different flavors of good. I used a pair of CN112s for a while (and a while back used a pair of AE112s). Both of the Berg cabs have more upper mid grind than the TC112, but the TC112 is significantly louder and deeper than either the CN112 or AE112. The AE112 B version is a bit deeper and smoother than the A version, but it's subtle. The CN112 I believe is a louder, deeper and more balanced cab than either version of the AE112.

    A single TC112 will probably give you about 75 to 80% of a pair of AE112s.

    The Thunderchild series cabs are designed to pretty much put out what is put in without much alteration, so it seems the TH500 could rough up the tone a bit and the TC112 would reproduce that.

    I'm rambling, so I'll stop here. If you have specific questions let me know.

    Good luck!

    Bob
  9. lo-freq

    lo-freq

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2003
    Location:
    Fort Worth -- that's my hood.
    Just curious if you played it enough to break the woofer in?

    Also, IIRC there were two versions of the AE112 (I know there was of the AE210) with the latter version having somewhat different upper midrange voicing.
  10. lo-freq

    lo-freq

    Joined:
    Jan 19, 2003
    Location:
    Fort Worth -- that's my hood.
    The newer TC112 8 ohm has a switch setting for a more agressive midrange (IIRC: one switch for the roll-off point & one for the flat or agressive mid voicing).

    [Same for the TC115 8 ohm & the newer TC212.]

    You can check with Duke for the details.
  11. Eublet

    Eublet Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    Understood on the price, but the ML112 will completely walk away from the AE112 on it's own. It's a very capable unit like your TC112, albeit with a more ballsy character. Why did you flip the ML's? If you had a bad experience with them, it might not be worth the money to reinvest in one.

    I love the DB112's tone myself, but dislike the form factor and weight. The DB is a bit deeper sounding than the ML112 also, so I kind of give the ML112 the nod in the tone department. Unless you disliked the ML, it just sounds like the cabinet for you. You said the TC112 can handle any bar/club you need, then it follows that the ML112 would do the same.

    The CN112 is an option as others have mentioned. Another consideration is just getting a CN212. At 45 lbs, that still very portable, and would sound great with the TH500.

    Another options is find a used Genz Neox 112T or the newer Shuttle 112 cabinets. Both are fantastic cabs, with the former being rounder and more beefy, and the latter being more tightly voiced but still very warm.

    By my casual observation, the AE112 has been received the least amount of ubiquitous praise from owners around here compared to most other Berg's, so I wouldn't encourage you to buy and try unless you can afford it or don't mind the delay if you have to flip it to try something else.
  12. KJung

    KJung

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Location:
    Wisconsin and Upper Michigan

    To your points above:

    +1
    +1
    +1
    +1
    and....

    +1
  13. g4string

    g4string Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2002
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    Yes, it was your. Love the cab. One of the best bass purchases I have ever made!!

    Not shocked to hear the TC will get me 3/4 of the way there vs a pair of AE's
  14. g4string

    g4string Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2002
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    Regarding my flip of the ML pair......a couple of things. Needed some cash at the time -AND- just wasn't that happy [sonically] with them. I do agree that 1 ML is pretty impressive on its own though. I think at the time I had an extremely aggressive bass (Lakland 5595 ash/rosewood with Bassline pups), extremely aggressive cab setup, and a pretty mid fwd amp (TH500). It's not that the rig didn't sound good......it's just that it was too much of a good thing. I've said before, I wish I could replace the too bloomy bottom end of the DB112's and replace it with the sealed like tight bottom end of the ML. I liked the mids a bit more on the DB's as well. However, two different bottom end characters on ea cab....so it's hard to tell if it's the bottom end that makes the mids sound different or if it truly does have a completely different mid character. I never had an issue with top end extension of either cab. They both sounded good to me. Again, one ML could punish one DB, so that's a factor. I'm prob the only one, but I liked the schlep factor of the DB vs the ML. I know, I'm the only one. I know roger has redesigned the mid character of the ML112 (I had SN 1 and 5). I think after box #20 the mids changed to a more "smoother" voice. Perhaps I should check em out again. As mentioned previously, the only thing holding me back is price. $820 for a single 112 shipped w/ cover is steep. Not saying they ain't worth every penny, just saying its an expensive purchase.
  15. wallerdub

    wallerdub

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2013
    Location:
    Fort Collins, CO
    Definitely don't discount Acme sound llc. http://www.acmebass.com/

    They have some awesome sounding speakers I've seen heard and played that are astounding. They've got a great 2x10 3way speaker, and awesome hornless 1x12 and can do custom work as well. Highly engineered. Check em'
  16. Eublet

    Eublet Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2006
    If you liked the DB schlep better, then no reason not to get one of those. I wish the bottom were a little more focused, but it's not a big deal to me. To my ears, the DB112 and DB212 are the best sounding cabinets out there, especially with Aguilar heads on them.
  17. g4string

    g4string Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Sep 19, 2002
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    Agreed. The DB112 pair is a thing of beauty. Trying to get that sound in a lighter box (w tighter low end) for the same cost or cheaper seems to be futile. Was really hoping the AE112's would have been what I was hoping for. Pretty sure the CN112's are close to my goals, but at $750 per box, it's too much $$....espc considering I bought my old pair of DB112's with covers for $800-900 shipped. NTM, Aguilar participates in MF discounts, so it's pretty easy to snag a new one for 15% off when they're running a sale. Looks like DB112's.
  18. chris_b

    chris_b

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2007
    I've had 5 years of compliments playing through my 1 or 2 or 3 x AE112 rigs. They sounded great with my LM2, Thunderfunk 550 and 750 and now TH500 amps.

    I'm now getting even more compliments with my CN212 rig.
  19. LeonD

    LeonD Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 26, 2001
    Location:
    Uxbridge, Massachusetts
    The AE112 was my cab of choice for four+ years. For the last four months, I've been playing a TC115-8.

    The AE112 did have a certain aggressiveness and pronounced upper mids that I liked. But since I've started using the TC, I wouldn't go back.

    1. The sound coming out the of TC is continuous. From the lowest lows to the highest highs, it's just one wall of sound. Hard to describe; easy to hear.

    2. The sound is everywhere. With the TC, it feels like you're enveloped with bass. Plus, if you're on the side of the cab or it's right at your feet, you can still hear it.

    3. With a footprint about the same as the AE112 (but higher) and only a few pounds heavier, it outperforms my AE112/AE210 stack on larger gigs.

    Per Duke, the TC115-8 sounds similar to the TC112-8. I'm not sure where the TC112-4 fits in.

    IMHO, with the nature of the TC cabs, if I wanted more aggression, I'd look to the amp or possibly some pedals. I think the TC cabs have too many positives going for it to replace it.
  20. Musicman20

    Musicman20

    Joined:
    Jan 6, 2002
    Location:
    Newcastle Upon Tyne, UK.
    Have you thought about the DB212? It's a large cab but cheaper, fairly easy to move and comes with casters?

    Fantastic cabinet.
  21. g4string

    g4string Supporting Member

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    Sep 19, 2002
    Location:
    McKinney, TX
    The TC115 (4ohm) has been on my radar as well. Use that for bigger gigs, use the 112 for on the go pick up stuff. IIRC, the old 115-4 and 112-4 have the same tonal DNA, just the 115-4 being louder. Maybe just need to scout for a used 115-4:bassist:

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