Bergantino IP112 vs IP112ER

Discussion in 'Amps [BG]' started by audiorep2, Dec 9, 2012.


  1. audiorep2

    audiorep2

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    Nova Scotia, Canada
    Are there physical differences between these two ? Driver ? Port size ? Or is it a software issue ?
    Can the original be upgraded to an ER ?
  2. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

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    Apr 9, 2005
    Location:
    Wisconsin and Upper Michigan
    Yes. Two totally different boxes. The HT112 was the original, small 12... midrange voiced. The HT112ER (extended range) is the next generation (recently replaced by the HD112), and has a larger box and more low end extension. The IP versions were the same as the 'non powered' versions.

    No way to change one to the other.
  3. chadds

    chadds

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2000
    They are both good. :)

    If I needed it I would have switched but the original has been so wonderful for me and has never lacked enough low end for my needs. I'm fond of the smaller size too.
    To each his own.:)

    When using IP112 with EX112 and you don't change the selection of programs on back for use with second cab you get more bass. Tom B. turned us on to that possibility.
  4. audiorep2

    audiorep2

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    Nova Scotia, Canada
    I recently bought used IP112 and HT112. I got no manual with these and am unable to find one. Can someone explain what the program switch is all about ?
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  6. chadds

    chadds

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2000
    The switch on the IP112 balances the amount of bass present when you've added the second cab. Tom B. found he liked the effect when left in the single IP112 position. Since you have tweeter in second cab there's all the more reason to leave in single cab position. Experiment. You may like it more one way than the other. You can't hurt anything.

    What pre are you using?
  7. audiorep2

    audiorep2

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    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    Nova Scotia, Canada
    I have 2 options for preamp. First is a GK 700RB II useing the XLR out. This works rather well. And, I just got a Phil Jones Bass Buddy which I have not had a chance to experiment with.
    So, the switch on the IPs., when pressed in , is that for 2 cabs ?
  8. Jazz Ad

    Jazz Ad Mi la ré sol Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Mar 16, 2002
    Location:
    Reims, Champagne, France
    The switch is to switch between programs. One sounds at flat as possible, the other behaves more like a regular amp. The differences only shine at loud volume in a band setting.
    If you plug another cab the amp goes down to 4 ohms and 1000w.

    I own an IP112ER. It is unlike anything I had ever heard before.
    We're talking state of the art, culmination of a technology here.

    I am sure these boxes will gain a legendary status, especially if Bergantino doesn't make active cabs again.
    You Bass Buddy will probably sound fantastic on it. Anything does.
  9. audiorep2

    audiorep2

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    Nova Scotia, Canada
    I play electric 4 string, and a Ramirez Caribbean Baby Bass ( active/passive ). I use a Radial Bassbones which is handy for using two such radically different basses.
    At volume, the IPs are having trouble with the standup, especially on low E and G.
    I sent an email to Jim on Friday, and got this response ( very quickly I might ad ),

    Do you know if this noise is coming from the woofer or the port?. Sometimes with upright the low end is so big that it could cause some port chuffing (I'm assuming you have the original IP112 and not the ER version). If it is coming from the ports, a highpass filter would help your situation. Otherwise, if it's the woofers that have been worn or compromised, the cost would be $165 each plus shipping.

    I love everything about these cabs. The concept is perfect for me. But I would like to solve buzzing/rattling issue.
  10. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

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    Location:
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    Just FYI, the switch does different things for the different IP models (which are now all discontinued).

    With the 4ohm IP310 and the IP212, the switch is 'DSP/No DSP', which as you point out, engages limiting and EQ to get the maximum low end and relatively flat performance out of the system, versus a more typical 'cab/power amp' response with no extra EQ or compression.

    With the 8ohm IP112, the switch does a different thing, and is meant to keep the system sounding the same when using the IP112 unit alone or adding a second cab. So, it changes the DSP setting to account for the additional low end, etc. you get when adding a second cab. So, with two cabs, if you keep the switch in the 'one cab' setting, the DPS will act like a bass boost. There is no way to disengage the DSP with the 112 models.

    For the OP, the performance of the IP's is VERY much tied to the matching of the output and noise level of the preamp with the input gain setting of the power amp. This can be tricky but if you get it right, they sound quite good.
  11. audiorep2

    audiorep2

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    Apr 25, 2004
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    Nova Scotia, Canada
    So, when the switch is pressed all the way in,..what setting is that ?
  12. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

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    It has been a while since I messed around with the IP, and don't remember.

    However, the setting with the most low end will be the 'single cab flat' setting, and the setting with less low end will be the 'two cab flat' setting with the IP112. You will do no harm using the switch in either setting with or without the external cab.

    To be sure, use the email address on the Bergantino website. Jim is VERY good about answering questions, and you will most likely hear back within 24 hours.
  13. jsbarber

    jsbarber Supporting Member

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    Jun 7, 2005
    Location:
    San Diego
    Same drivers, different (larger with ER) cabinet. I would think that the DSP programming was changed to tune to the larger cabinet. Clearly it is not possible to upgrade. When I was looking to buy I called Jim Bergantino and asked him about the difference. I was expecting him to say more bass extension (which may be the case), but what he said was most noteworthy is increased headroom with the ER.

    FWIW,

    Jim
  14. chadds

    chadds

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2000
    Your extraneous sounds may be from too much bass eq. The IPs require the reduction of low eq.Before you try to repair the speakers try a dedicated bass pre and reduce the lows. You will end up with plenty of deep bass. DI outs from integrated heads can give pleasant to unpleasant results. DI boxes can sound okay then sound bad as volume goes up. As was said above when you have it right its seamless and incredible. If the pieces you try don't put out an easy .775v they will work but tone suffers. It can sound one way at one volume and another when cranked.

    A car analogy would be putting very low octane in a performance car that was designed for 93 or higher. It will start and run. Put in the proper stuff the car's performance potential becomes quite obvious.
  15. chadds

    chadds

    Joined:
    Mar 18, 2000
    In is with two cabs. Out is just IP112. It should state on decal on back.

    You must turn the IP off for the selection to take place.
  16. Bassflute

    Bassflute

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2006
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Disclosures:
    Endorsing Artist: MTD basses and strings
    On the IP 112ER, you have the DSP/No DSP options. And BTW, you CANNOT and should not push the switch in or out when it's on - nothing will happen, and you can damage it. Jim Bergantino suggests turning the power of for 5-6 seconds, then engage or disengage the switch, then restart.

    Still the best bass amp ever, IMHO, with the right preamp.

    And those Baby Basses have a RIDICULOUS amount of low end, way too much IMHO. And a lot of it is ridiculous sub-sonic stuff that just wreaks havoc with everything, gear AND music. Get a high pass filter. You can't expect ANY 12" speaker to reproduce that, and even if they could, why on earth would you want to?

    Cheers,
    Cameron
  17. SCT1422

    SCT1422 Supporting Member

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    Jan 12, 2001
    Location:
    N. Tonawanda, N.Y. I play in
    I currently have an IP-112ER/HT-112ER thats a custom setup and have owned the original.. Definately a difference in the low end.. Great rig and I use a Monique by Jule preamp and a Kern IP-777... I've also have a Summit Audio TD-100 which is fantastic as well.. The button pushed in is flat and the button out has the DSP engaged... The Monique and the TD-100 sound great with the DSP engaged... And I just discovered yesterday the Kern sounds fantastic with the flat setting...
  18. audiorep2

    audiorep2

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    Nova Scotia, Canada
    Could my Phil Jones Bass Buddy be modded to have a subsonic filter built in to the circuit ?
  19. Bassflute

    Bassflute

    Joined:
    Jun 24, 2006
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Disclosures:
    Endorsing Artist: MTD basses and strings
    a passive sub sonic filter is a very simple circuit, you could even find plans for one on the net and build your own...I've even seen them built into an XLR plug...do a search for

    DIY high pass filter

    you'll get a LOT of hits.

    Youtube:



    Cheers,
    Cameron
  20. KJung

    KJung Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Apr 9, 2005
    Location:
    Wisconsin and Upper Michigan
    TBer FDeck makes a WONDERFUL hi pass filter. The version III is the most useful IMO, and is a bit over $100. Very well made, very transparent, and 12db cut from 35hz to around 125 hz, with a massive 24db cut when set to 35hz (i.e., it always cuts the subsonics under 35hz by 12 'extra' db no matter how you have the filter set.

    Very nice solution if you need to reduce the big low end trying to come out of too small of a box or whatever.
  21. audiorep2

    audiorep2

    Joined:
    Apr 25, 2004
    Location:
    Nova Scotia, Canada
    So the IP has an onboard program with some eq parameters. Why could'nt that be reprogrammed to incorporate the subsonic filter ?

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