Help With PA Speakers/Setup

Discussion in 'Live Sound [BG]' started by gibrangibran, Jan 24, 2013.


  1. gibrangibran

    gibrangibran

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2013
    Greetings all -

    I am new here and to the whole live music setups, please bear with me.

    I have been assigned the task to spec out speakers, monitors and a mixer for small venue. The size of the venue is 40' wide X 75' length and 10' ceiling height, the area accommodates about 150 people. Please see picture for stage location. Mainly soft live music and some dance playbacks.

    Of course there is a budget of $1000-1200, based on the that number I was thinking of the following equipment:

    - Behringer XENYX X1832USB
    - Kustom KPC12MP Powered Speaker Pair (Monitors)
    - Peavey PR 15D 15" Active Main Speakers Pair

    I was wondering if this setup is Ok, would be great to get some feedback.

    Thank you.
  2. seamonkey

    seamonkey

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2004
    I'd skip the Kustoms and get 1 more Peavey to use as a monitor
  3. Mugre

    Mugre

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2011
    Location:
    Large West Coast City
    if you don't know any thing about sound, how can you be in charge of choosing speakers? That snarkiness aside, the Behringer is a copy of a Mackie Onyx. Onyx/Xyenx, get it? It's cheaper because it uses cheaper, lighter grade materials and components. It and the Kustom are poorly constructed junk and are not suited for the semi-commercial applications you intend. Do yourself and the venue a favor and do not go below Mackie, Peavey, Yamaha etc in quality. Yorkville also makes some good things at attractive price points. The next step up in engineering and build quality would be the lower lines of JBL, EV and Community.
  4. Floyd Eye

    Floyd Eye

    Joined:
    Feb 21, 2010
    Location:
    St. Louis
    Ditch the Kustoms and the Behringer.
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  6. joelb79

    joelb79

    Joined:
    Mar 22, 2006
    Location:
    Lansing, Michigan
    I think you are going with too little power (190W a main, and 100w a monitor) and under-designed speakers. I would expect the system you spec'd to be close to pushing it all the time; given my experience with the gear you listed. The peavey speaker get into signal protection quickly and seemed to be buried by a 40watt guitar amp. They had the matching PV-18D subwoofers below them and the DDT light was on all the time on the subs, but we never heard the kick drum. The Kustom monitors were distorting highly throughout the gig; causing feedback and no-vocal intelligibility.

    Try these for your speakers, Get at least 3 of them. use 2 for mains, one for monitor. The room you have is likely small enough to be covered with that few of speakers, but you would want 4 speaker ideally, 2 monitors and 2 mains.

    1000W Class-D, EVS-12K Woofer and DH-1K Tweeter. -3's at 65 Hz - 18 kHz. 36lbs. Those specs alone will TROUNCE the Peavey stuff. I know they are new gear, but the woofer and tweeter are not as they have been a part of EV speakers for a while; They also have close 810 more watts available than Peavey PR-15D's. They list 126db maximum SPL, that should be close to what they would do, all for $400 a speaker. Same Price.

    The mixer is fine; but be aware of the quality issue some have spoken of. With 3 of the speakers above, you could easily go with a Allen& Heath ZED-12FX and be under the budget of $2000 w/ room for microphones and microphone cables for hooking it all up. The Allen & Heath stuff is so much better than the Behringer and has better survivability at a gig where abuse is likely.
  7. DWBass

    DWBass The Funkfather Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2003
    Location:
    Newport News, VA via NYC
    Disclosures:
    Kohlman Bassworks
    Nothing wrong with the Behringer mixer. They have definitely stepped up their quality. I have long term use experience with zero issues. I'd skip the Kustom speakers. Having said that, check out Carvin systems. http://www.carvinguitars.com/group/8_12_channel_pa_systems. You can pick up a couple monitors cheap off your local craigslist and you're good to go.
  8. Adam Harzuf

    Adam Harzuf

    Joined:
    Nov 16, 2004
    Location:
    Israel
    You really should add at least 2 units of dual 15 band graphic equalizer for REASONABLE tunning (especially for cheap loudspeakers) and feedback rejection. One unit is for stereo FOH and the other unit for one or two monitors, which are a must.
    Don't take Behringer EQ, they just sound bad. If going dirt cheap, Alto is more reasonable IMO. DBX is kind of standard.
    Behringer mixers are ok. Actually, the one you mentioned has an onboard 10 band EQ that can be used for one monitor temporarily. Still more accurate sound and better feedback rejection could be achieved with more bands, ideally 31, but you'll do good with 15.

    It's always better to have more options and control with your mixer/rack then to have a small step up in quality. Your loudspeakers and microphones will probably be the limiting factor, weight your investment there.

    Have at least two original Shure SM58 fo vocals, look for recommendations for cheaper mics for other stuff.

    Used is fine as long as you have someone that knows how to test it. Older (wooden box) JBL 15" passive tops is sweet stuff - I don't know for how much they run used in the states, but it's miles ahead of most cr@p they make today and reasonably priced here.
  9. seamonkey

    seamonkey

    Joined:
    Aug 6, 2004
    :rollno:
    "A Moron in a Hurry"
  10. modulusman

    modulusman

    Joined:
    Jan 18, 2004
    Location:
    montana
    So tell me what is a xenyx. Blowinger intentionally named it this to make morons in a hurry buy it.
  11. atomicdog

    atomicdog Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2011
  12. Stumbo

    Stumbo Wherever you go, there you are. Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Feb 11, 2008
    Location:
    Los Angeles
    Who set the budget? For the $1000-$1200, IMO, that's not really enough for a quality system that has enough watts to allow some overhead in the system.

    What about a budget microphones, microphone stands/cables, speaker cables, speaker stands?

    Check out Craigslist in your area. Lots of good PA stuff available at reasonable prices?
  13. Zooberwerx

    Zooberwerx Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2002
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    Oh, yeah! PA gear is, for the most part, heavy and expensive to ship so buyers will frequently cut a deal to keep the sale local. Older technology (e.g. lead sled amps) will work and should be affordable as the advent of newer lighter gear is driving down secondhand values. $300 for a used QSC RMX 1450? Nope! Try $125-150.

    Riis
  14. DWBass

    DWBass The Funkfather Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2003
    Location:
    Newport News, VA via NYC
    Disclosures:
    Kohlman Bassworks
    As I posted above, Carvin has some pretty good small systems that put out decent volume for bars. I just bought a pair of mint condition Carvin LSx cabs from a guy off craigslist and he also has the XP1000L powered mixer (with 3 400w amps). He demo'd the entire system with 2 15" Carvin cabs and the 2 12" Carvin cabs that I bought and that thing was pretty loud and full of bass even without a sub. For what the OP needs, he can get the mixer and 2 mains for less than $1k with money left over to buy mics/stands. He can then buy a couple monitors cheap off craigslist and still be within his budget.
  15. gareth dunster

    gareth dunster

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2009
    I had serious problems with the preamps on my xenyx mixer. There was almost no gain until just before it maxed out , then it went to clipping. If you have less cash buy used equipment, there is very little you can get in this price range that will satisfy you long term.
  16. DWBass

    DWBass The Funkfather Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2003
    Location:
    Newport News, VA via NYC
    Disclosures:
    Kohlman Bassworks
    I agree, the Behringer Xenyx mixers have low gain on the preamps. Nice mixers otherwise.
  17. gareth dunster

    gareth dunster

    Joined:
    Dec 8, 2009
    Sure. The rest of the mixer was absolutely fine and it never failed, but those preamps, awful.
  18. TimmyP

    TimmyP

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2003
    Location:
    Indianapolis, IN
    For a room that deep, it's gonna take a lot more than $2000 - which will get you an amp or two, mics, cables, and a snake.
  19. DWBass

    DWBass The Funkfather Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Jan 24, 2003
    Location:
    Newport News, VA via NYC
    Disclosures:
    Kohlman Bassworks
    Guys, his budget is $1200. Help him out here. Stop suggesting he spend more money than he has to spend!!
  20. Zooberwerx

    Zooberwerx Gold Supporting Member

    Joined:
    Dec 21, 2002
    Location:
    Virginia Beach, VA
    To the OP: where are you located? How many PA / mic channels do you really need to get things up & running? We can turn this into a veritable scavenger hunt via CraigsList, etc, and will probably find some decent secondhand components within driving distance. Let's look at the basics and assigned budget of $1200 but subtracting $150 for the incidentals which are commonly overlooked:

    Mixer: <$250. Something w/ an onboard FX section (reverb, delay) would be optimal but, then again, external FX devices (think Alesis) can be had for under $50. Don't skimp on the mixer...the mic preamp quality will make or break the balance of your system.

    Power amps (2): <$350. Go "old tech / lead sled" on this one. The competitive pricing on new technology is driving down the re-sale of older yet reliable hardware. Personally, I'm a big fan of the QSC RMX series which can be had on the cheap. Local sales rule as the stuff is heavy and expensive to ship...use it to your advantage whilst bargaining.

    Enclosures / Mains (2): <$300. Used Peavey, Carvin, Yamaha, etc. components are your best bet provided they haven't been overdriven or abused. Not necessarily top-shelf but they'll do the trick...upgrade when finances allow. Don't sweat the cosmetics. It's amazing what you can do with some spray paint, glue, and carpet cleaner. Again, don't pay top-dollar: brand new Carvin LS1503's go for $280 apiece...I wouldn't pay any more than 50% especially when dealing on any mid-range gear.

    Monitors (1?): <$125. This is a guess on my part. I've never purchased a monitor but, rather, have a thrown a couple cast-off mains on their sides to serve the purpose. Keep that in mind when choosing.

    You have a few bucks left over for speaker (hint: make your own) and signal cables but far from being able to include quality mics, stands, and the like. A really nice rack box would be nice but a sturdy folding table will serve in a pinch. Don't forget the speaker tripods!

    Riis

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