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Need help figuring out speaker info! Mesa/Boogie Diesel 2x15, EV 15L

Discussion in 'Amps [BG]' started by rp747, Jan 13, 2013.

  1. rp747

    rp747

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    Hey all, I need a little help finding out some info on my Mesa/Boogie Diesel 2x15's speaker requirements. After searching the forums, I haven't quite found enough info for me to go ahead and purchase a reconing kit yet. So here goes...

    From the info that I've gathered: Diesel 2x15's come either as 800 or 400 watts, with 1600 or 800 watt EV EVM 15L speakers respectively; the cabinets have two (or three?) inputs, some for each speaker, one for both, in different impedance levels; the wattage info is printed on the back of the speakers.

    Here's my problem: I don't know the wattage or impedance of the amp, my cabinet has only one input, and after removing the back of the cabinet, there is no wattage information printed on the back of either speaker.

    There's quite a nasty distortion coming out of what I believe to be both speakers, prompted a few days ago by being used for the first time in months. It's very likely that the speakers are damaged, since, without my knowledge, our live sound person has been using the cab as a step stool for the board... A much less possible scenario is that this is a 4 ohm 400 watt cab and I'm giving it too much power with my 600 watt Basis M2000, but I'm pretty sure that's not the case.

    So, I'd like to attempt reconing the speakers myself, but I basically need to know what wattage reconing kits I should buy. Can anybody help me identify what I need?

    Thanks! :)
  2. B-string

    B-string Supporting Member

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    I would be sure they need a re-cone first. If you don't know how to test or ID them what makes you think you can re-cone with great success? EVs are not Black Widows where the whole basket and cone are sold as a unit. Stepping on the cab won't hurt the speakers unless the cab is under water or they step right on the cones!
  3. rp747

    rp747

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    Well, something's wrong with them and I'd like to try fixing it myself. I've read in the forums that you can indeed recone 15L's, so I learned about how to do it with a kit from Sound Speaker Repair, and I'd like to give it a try. Are you saying I should take it in to a shop for repair, or since reconing 15L's is apparently different than other speakers, can you tell me how to recone or repair them properly?
  4. B-string

    B-string Supporting Member

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    Try using a vacuum on the pole vent on the rear (center of magnet) first. You can then check for scraping by gently pushing equally on opposite sides of the cones. If no noise is heard you can try them with a known good amp setup or sweep them with a frequency sweep.
    You can re-cone at home with great care taken, fallow all steps and precautions. It is very easy to ruin a cone kit or have bad results.
  5. rp747

    rp747

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    Thanks, B-string. That does sound like a more complex process than I imagined. Maybe I should just take it in to a shop? I've heard many success stories about reconing at home, but I haven't seen many people talk about the risks. Good points.
  6. B-string

    B-string Supporting Member

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    Try the vacuuming first. If it is not just dirt in the voice coil gap then take them in and have them tested. The hardest parts are removing ALL cements and material from the outer basket and inner basket, cleaning the voice coil gap, centering the new voice coil and maintaining proper alignment during cementing, installing the dust cap with even bead of cement and finally soldering/dressing the new tensile leads to the terminals.
    Wait that is the whole job except removing the old cone ;)
  7. rp747

    rp747

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    Ha, alrighty, thanks for that info, B-string! Much appreciated. I'm an eager beaver with fixing my own stuff, but I think I'll try with something simpler. ;)
  8. gerryjazzman

    gerryjazzman Supporting Member

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    I actually reconed an EVM 15L recently with a kit from http://www.soundspeakerrepair.com. The nice thing about their kits is that the cone/voicecoil/spider is fully assembled which makes it fairly easy IF you follow directions carefully and take your time. I found their video "How to recone / repair a speaker or woofer" very helpful. The kit cost me $70 so I thought what the heck. I really enjoy doing DIY and wanted the satisfaction of being able to do this. Here are a couple of pics from my re-cone:

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]

    [​IMG]
  9. BassmanPaul

    BassmanPaul Gold Supporting Member

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    Re-coning with a kit such as Gerry used is a fairly simple process. It is, however, also fairly simple to screw the job up and ruin a fairly expensive kit. My speaker guy charged me $40 labour on the last unit, a JBL 15, he did for me. At that cost I feel that having him do the work is well worth it.
  10. gerryjazzman

    gerryjazzman Supporting Member

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    That's a really reasonable labor rate Paul. If I had something like a JBL K140 to recone I probably would want it to be professionally reconed, but the EVM kit was cheap enough and I really wanted to try it myself. If I messed it up I wouldn't have been too upset but it actually turned out great. Sounds good too (I tried it out in a test box). If one has the ambition and patience, it can be done.
  11. PawleeP

    PawleeP

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    I have heard that the generic recone materials were not as good as the OEM rebuild kit.. but is much more money?
  12. B-string

    B-string Supporting Member

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    I had once had non-oem cone kits installed on a pair of Altec 421A's. BIG mistake. Wasted cash, have to have them re-coned again so they wound up costing MUCH more. The $80.00 per speaker savings will now cost an additional $120. per speaker plus shipping costs.
  13. PawleeP

    PawleeP

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    Thanx B string!
    Do you know if the speaker parts plus kits for EV are generic or OEM type or quality? PP
  14. pulse

    pulse

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  15. pulse

    pulse

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  16. T-Bird

    T-Bird

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    Hi James.

    I haven't tried the kits that Thomann sells, but if the pic shows the actual kit, that opens a whole new possibilities for a mistake compared with the "soundspeakerrepair"s pre-assembled kit.

    The un-assembled kit gives a bit of adjustment room for a competent re-coner though.

    The Thomann kit doesn't say a thing about the adhesives either, but the "soundspeakerrepair" kit has that as well.

    People have succesfully replaced the old EV's with Eminence speakers for not that much more money. If my slowly but firmly degrading memory serves me correctly this time, the Deltalite is a good match for the 15L in the TL606 cab at least.
    Regular Delta or Kappa IIRC if You're in a tight budget.

    If the shipping and taxes won't kill the deal, I'd probably choose the "soundspeakerrepair" one.

    You shouldn't be needing the "fixture" You linked to.


    Almost all the 15M's & L's I have or have had, have shared a common feature, a chipping magnet, caused by rough handling. If You get any magnet chips into the VC gap, the speaker is pretty much toast, you won't get 'em all cleaned.
    Plus, even the cast basket isn't bulletproof, a chipped magnet quite often means a bent basket as well.
    IMLE anyway

    Regards
    Sam
  17. WretchedExcess

    WretchedExcess

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    There has never been an EVM-15L that's rated for 800 or 1600 watts.

    The EV-branded EVM-15L Series is rated for 200 watts.
    The EV-branded EVM-15L Series II is rated for 400 watts.
    The OEM version of the EVM-15L is rated for 200 watts.

    In reality, these speakers don't have very much Xmax so they are going to be excursion limited.

    I'm not sure that I follow the "much less possible" scenario. Mesa used the OEM version, wiring two of the OEM 200 watt speakers in parallel to make a 400 watt cabinet.

    It sounds like you're pommelling a pair of vintage speakers with a modern amp that's got way too much power for them.
  18. WretchedExcess

    WretchedExcess

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    I've been using the 15L/606 combination since the mid 70s. I've tumbled a Mesa Road Ready 2x15 down a long flight of concrete stairs. I've been lucky in that I've never had magnet chips or bends in the baskets. I'm actually quite surprised to hear people suggest that the EVM baskets will bend. I've never seen one bend, but I've seen them fracture many times.
  19. Old Fart

    Old Fart

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    It is hard for me to imagine those frames being bent. They appear to be wildly over-engineered, cast aluminum frames. Of course, it is theoretically possible, but I'm not sure they wouldn't survive being driven over by my truck.;)

    And BTW, while I recognize that these speakers have low xmax, and that they are arguably not particularly 'deep' sounding speakers, I personally have never heard a 15" speaker that is more 'musical.' Tons of tone. IMHO.

    In an application requiring higher volume, I'd be willing to drag four of them to a venue. That should take care of the Xmax problem.:p
  20. BoomBoomOGTL

    BoomBoomOGTL Supporting Member

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    ...or the baskets break!

    [​IMG]

    I found this when I opened a 70s Ampeg V4B I recently picked up. I was quite surprised.

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