Quad-coil wiring options (Bart or Delano)

Discussion in 'Pickups & Electronics [BG]' started by chapito, Mar 22, 2014.


  1. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    HI
    I've been struggling with a pickup upgrade. Im looking at the Bart P2 Quad XXP26C or the Delano SBC5 HE/S-4 quad.

    I would like a Quad coil that can be wired in the following combinations:

    a) 2 dual coil (humbucker series or parallel)

    b) Single dual coil (front or rear)

    c) Split coil (Pbass or inverted)


    I'm not sure which combinations I'll pick for wiring but it would be nice to have a pickup that is flexible and can be moved to a different bass in the future.

    I thought the Delano would do all of these but after some research it seems that they can only be used in HB or Split-coil (P or inverted P style) but no Split J type front or back (north or south). Being a humbucker-noob, I hope Im mistaken. And looking at the Barts wiring PDF Im still confused as what the possibilities might be.

    If anyone can recommend a P2 sized quad coil blade pickup with these possibilities, I would be grateful!

    Thanks
     
  2. JustForSport

    JustForSport

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    There was a recent thread on this with quad Barts, with diagrams, found info, and results-
    search around a bit.
     
  3. line6man

    line6man

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    What you want is eight conductor wiring. That will allow you to get whatever combination of coils you want, if you choose the appropriate switches to do so.
     
  4. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    HI JustForSport
    Ive burnt a hole in the search engine (there a lot of talk and "well maybes" or "I have no experience with this, but that")

    I have certainly gained a lot of insight but I was hoping for some definitive input from people who have "hands on" with either pickup to tell me what they found, whats possible.

    Ive emailed Delano, but no response… yet, its only been a week.

    Have you used either quad coil? What was your experience trying to wire it as a single Split J? Love to get your insight.

    ...Im looking for the thread now, there was a pic of the bottom of the p'up with 8 contacts. I think it was the delano.


    Thanks Line6man,
    I was hoping that the 8 contacts would be the answer. -But I think in one of the MANY delano/ Bart threads, tubby.twins said you're still only left with split coil (P type) because of the way the p'up was built and if you do set it up as a dual coil its no longer humcanelling. http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f38/q...-barts-different-delanos-918537/#post13216479 (this confused me)

    I found the pic, and there are 8 leads:http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f38/d...nar-3-band-eq-info-thread-440635/#post5818640
     
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  6. NoiseTracker

    NoiseTracker

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    Hey chapito,

    I just happen to have the five string version of the Bartolini you are talking about installed in one of my basses as a neck position pickup. It's wired via a three way toggle switch for P-style, all coils and reverse P-style configurations. I was given the bass in its current configuration -but- I just found this that should set you straight. Honestly I love this pickup so so so very much. If you need to know something else about what i use it for or anything like that let me know and I would be happy to oblige.

    -NT
     
  7. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    Thanks NT
    I keep going back and forth with which one to pick P2 or SBC.
    I've seen that diagram, but it doesn't show and option for a inline split-coil (J type setting)
    (Delano's also only shows the split-coil (p type) tapping)

    Though now I'm guessing from Line6man's comment if all the contacts are visible/accessible it could be wired in any combo. Are all 10 lugs open to the bottom of the p'up?

    I found what i was looking for:
    http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f38/d...s-dualcoil-tonal-options-807115/#post12102994

    tubby.twins did a test of the delanos quad for inline split-coil. Well, I guess that answers the question is it possible. Now Im back to the question of Bart or Delano?:help:
     
  8. JustForSport

    JustForSport

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  9. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    Thanks justforsport
    I actually sub'ed that thread-- liked his idea for the threaded switches. There's a lot of good stuff there following the process. When I was searching I figured that it was a different pickup so I was unsure if the info would apply to the p2 and sbc with different lugs.

    Thanks, bookmarked.
    Learning as I go:)
     
  10. JustForSport

    JustForSport

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    Some of the older Barts had brass plates visible (not epoxy covered) and made terminal identification and usage easier. They factory-jumpered some posts for certain designations,
    but once the coil layout and wiring was determined, jumpers could be cut to re-wire coil combos.
     
  11. Janforth

    Janforth Supporting Member

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    SimS Super Quad pickups might be worth a look (it's from the owner of Enfield Guitars), it's not the P2 size though, I understand it gives you every possible combination - their website states "its like having 15 pickups in one bass", similar to Enfield's Super 8 pickup.
     
  12. Jazz Ad

    Jazz Ad Mi la ré sol Gold Supporting Member

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    The Delano SBC5 HE/S-4 has crossed opposing wires.
    You can wire coils the way you want but to keep the humbucking effect with only 2 coils you will have to wire them as a split. The Bart will have the same issue, you can't have an humbucking effect in both the split and inline modes.
     
  13. JustForSport

    JustForSport

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    If both high-side coils were same polarity/ wind direction, and both low-side coils the opposite, they could be wired as in-line split also.
    But maybe the magnet, coil structure inside is not like that and staggered 'P' or reverse 'P' would only be possible to retain humbucking effect.
    Posts #11 and #12 here:
    http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f38/strange-volume-loss-p-j-pickups-853616/
    explain how to find out.
     
  14. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    thanks guys

    I was going to open a new thread about different wiring schemes but maybe just continue on here after I get the p'ups.

    … About hum-cancelling, is it an issue of how the polarity/wind is placed in the pickup? (I'm new to this so bare with me.) I was under the impression that if all lead are available for wiring, any combo could be achieved and the humcancelling would be available.

    (JustForSport: great link too about polarity check thanks)

    I was about to pull the trigger on the SBCs but the lead-time is 8-10 wks. I may just go for the P2s and rethink it in the future if needed.
     
  15. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    Since I couldn't be patient enough for the 10 week wait, I got the Barts.

    Now that I have them "in hand" Im even more confused. SOme of it is that I've never had a HB pup and the other is because the wiring doesn't match up with Bart pdfs.

    I was under the impression these were new but now I don't know, maybe Bart owners could enlighten me to packaging—or lack of—and stock wiring. Also, it has 2 screw mount hole not the 3 I've seen online. (I'm starting to feel like these came off a stock bass—though they look pristine.) Anyway...

    Heres what I got: See pic below

    it looks like both Neck and Bridge were wired for HB series. the pic show how they were sent to me already paired/soldered at the ends. Also both the p'ups use black as hot? The Bart pdf shows Neck red = hot, Bridge black = hot.

    After some reading, confusion, and second guessing myself I wired them this way into a Pope flexcore Pre:

    Neck: Red hot/ G+Blk tap/ W+shld grd
    Brdg: Blk hot/ W+Red tap/ G+shld grd

    Goal was HB series switched to outside inline J coils.
    I got that but... the inline Js hum when soloed, not a lot but enough that is noticeable. Since I have 10 contact points showing on the Barts, how can I (or can't I ) re-wire/re-jumper the pickup for inline J hum-cancelling when soloed?


    Ultimately, I d like to wire this bass up as:

    Neck: HB series switched to P-type Split-coil
    Bridge: HB series switched to J-type inline split-coil

    Im not sure how Id wire up the coil tap on the neck P-type. But I believe it relates to the 6-conductor Bart PDF.

    Any help, direction would be appreciated.
    Thanks!
     

    Attached Files:

  16. JustForSport

    JustForSport

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    Check the polarity of the individual coils as in prev link.
    If 'P' and reverse 'P' are hum-cancelling, I'd think that in-line 'J' should be also-
    but you need to check the polarity first to see if that's the case.
    Did you re-wire the coil jumpers since getting them?
     
  17. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    I tried to check the polarity with my MM (its digital) and the screw driver method of "pulling away" but I couldn't get it/didnt know how to read the results. I set the blend to center, it aways read -.01 or 2 then returned to 0. Im positive (pun intended) that I m not doing it correctly. (BTW I assumed from the other post that the pickup was installed since the description read "clip to the tip and sleeve" of the cord.) I'll have to read up over the weekend on the polarity test. Any suggestions for doing the test?

    The pic is how I received the pups- no changes. the jumpers were/are soldered in the "inline" position. the only change I made was to the end of the leads—I de-soldered the pair of the Neck to match the Bart pdf. Everything at the pup belly is the same as I recvd it.

    Last night the bass sounded great, such a difference in clarity from the MK1s. But today playing all day I feel like something isn't right with wiring/ coil tapping. The tapped outer coils have no body (not the out-of-phase tone), nice tone, just no punch. Even in HB soloing each pickup loses something. It sounds best in series HB blended to center.
     
  18. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    I just re-read the link to the test and it "seems" that both pups are the same polarity.
    both would read –.01 or .02. I did this to both pup as well as both N/S coils of each.

    So maybe the polarity is ok?
     
  19. chapito

    chapito Supporting Member

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    Well, after playing a show today I HAD to come back and switch something.

    Heres a nice link for polarity testing: http://www.talkbass.com/forum/f38/quad-coil-wiring-993740/#post14504141

    I just switched the Neck paired leads back to the way it was when I got it:

    Neck: Blk hot/ W+Red tap/ G+shld grd
    Brdg: Blk hot/ W+Red tap/ G+shld grd


    The sound is better. Now when tapping the coil the soloed pup are almost silent. With the Pre flat, it is as silent as the HB series, and the only noise is if you boost the mids/high all the way.

    FWIW, Im confused by the red=hot for the neck pup on the Bart PDF.
     

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