$150,000 (£100,000) per song downloaded!

Discussion in 'Off Topic [BG]' started by Bruce Lindfield, Sep 9, 2003.

  1. Bruce Lindfield

    Bruce Lindfield Unprofessional TalkBass Contributor Gold Supporting Member

    So - the fightback has started....:meh:

    "Exactly 261 people received lawsuits on Monday on behalf of Universal Music Group, BMG, EMI, Sony Music and Warner Music, following the RIAA's announcement in June that individual file-sharers would be targeted.

    RIAA president Cary Sherman said he hoped the legal action would prompt parents to pay more attention to potentially illegal activities by their children.

    "We expect people to say 'It isn't me, it was my kid,' but someone has to take responsibility," Sherman said.

    More lawsuits are expected to follow after Monday's initial set. "

  2. wulf


    Apr 11, 2002
    Oxford, UK
    I'm glad I've kept it legal - if my Emusic.com was gleaned from Kazaa or similar instead I need a lot of zeroes to express the 'value' of my collection :eek:


    ps. latest download was Stanton Moore - All Kooked Out, excellent stuff, although probably not quite worth £1,300,000 ;)
  3. Bruce Lindfield

    Bruce Lindfield Unprofessional TalkBass Contributor Gold Supporting Member

    Yes - your chosen option is looking better all the time! ;)

    It'll be interesting to see how succesful they are - both in prosecuting and in changing attitudes?

    I wonder if any TBers or their children are in line to be targeted or will get a lawsuit?
  4. Bruce Lindfield

    Bruce Lindfield Unprofessional TalkBass Contributor Gold Supporting Member

    The BBC website also has a Q&A or FAQ on this :

    "I have downloaded music over the internet. Have I broken the law?

    Not if you have downloaded the songs from one of the many sanctioned sites, which include retailers such as HMV and Virgin and OD2. These sites pay royalties to labels and artists.

    If you download songs from a site that is not sanctioned - whether it is one song or a million - you are infringing copyright and breaking the law.

    Could I be sued for swapping a few songs?

    Theoretically, you could. But the RIAA says it is suing file swappers who have consistently trade large amounts.

    It recently took action against a college student in Michigan who ran a network offering more than 650,000 files - the equivalent of more than 43,000 albums. They have chased other users who have again uploaded thousands of files.

    Can children be sued for uploading or downloading songs?

    The RIAA says it could prosecute anyone, including children.

    Why are record companies so worried?

    Global music sales are falling, with sales down by 13% in the UK alone in the first quarter of this year.

    The music industry, which has suffered massive redundancies and restructuring in the last decade, says the swapping of music files over the internet is one of the major parts of music piracy. It has sued online song-swapping services like Napster and Kazaa.

    I live in the UK, but US computer users will be able to access the songs I share on file-swapping networks. Will the RIAA sue me?

    No. The RIAA's UK equivalent, the British Phonographic Industry (BPI), says this is a US action that is affecting only music downloaders in the US because international laws are different. The RIAA cannot take action against people outside the US.

    Is the BPI planning to sue UK users?

    It has said it will not rule out suing individual users, but that it would be a "last resort". The BPI says it is currently trying to educate people - including sending out leaflets to colleges and large business - to tell people where they can download music legally.

    It also says using peer-to-peer services risks downloading viruses. But if the RIAA's actions are successful, a similar system could be on the cards for the UK.

    Why is the RIAA chasing individual users?

    The music industry has had mixed fortunes in its court actions against the companies that support file-swapping on the internet. Some have been successful - like the action which forced Napster to close - and some have not.

    Last month a US judge ruled that two file-swapping networks, Grokster and Morpheus, were not responsible for what was traded on their systems.

    However, the RIAA was successful in getting telecommunications giant Verizon to hand over details of customers who swap files. This has allowed them to begin the process of gathering evidence against individuals.

    Are other music industry groups going to take similar action?

    Four countries in Europe have already taken action - Germany, Switzerland, Denmark and Italy, says the International Federation for the Phonographic Industry (IFPI). German police impounded computer equipment in April in the town of Furth that had been used to upload up to one million files. In Italy at least 75 actions have been taken.

    Will legitimate online services ever rival the peer-to-peer sites?

    The launch of the Apple system iTunes, where US users can choose from 200,000 songs at 99 cents a song has been a huge success, with more than five million songs downloaded in the first month. The system will be launched in Europe later this year. Microsoft are also in discussion with Universal, the world's biggest music group, about a similar system. "
  5. Bruce, this was the first story I heard on the radio when the alarm went off this morning. This is where it gets crazy: One of the 261 people named in their lawsuit is a 12 year old girl from the upper west side of Manhattan! :eek: :confused:

    It should prove very interesting to say the least in following its progress and ultimate outcome.


  6. Wow, thats $37,950,000 if they catch me...but they never will! :ninja:
  7. Bruce Lindfield

    Bruce Lindfield Unprofessional TalkBass Contributor Gold Supporting Member

    Well, I imagine this is deliberate - they have said they will prosecute children - but they have also said in their publicity output that they want parents to take responsibility for what their children are doing - they want a test case like this.

    I hope her parents have good lawyers or lots of money - I suppose that's the same thing in New York!!?? ;)
  8. Not all of New York, but, it's pretty much synonymous with living on the upper west side of Manhattan. ;) If they knew her zip(postal)code, I'd wager that this was a big factor in choosing her.

  9. wulf


    Apr 11, 2002
    Oxford, UK
    How are you defining 'good' there, Bruce?

    Reminds me of a joke I heard recently about a couple who died in a crash a couple of days before their wedding day. Up in heaven, they ask St Peter if it's possible to get married up there. He says it will be tricky but he'll see what he can do and, a few weeks later, they are happily married.

    However, things don't turn out so well, and a couple of years down the line they're back asking for a divorce. St Peter rolls his eyes and says, "It was hard enough finding a clergy man up here and now you want me to track down a laywer!" ;)


    ps. I know the joke is theologically dodgy on a number of counts... that makes it an opportunity to exercise mercy, forbearance and other commendable traits :)
  10. Bruce Lindfield

    Bruce Lindfield Unprofessional TalkBass Contributor Gold Supporting Member

    Actually, thinking again and taking into account what Michael said - I hope the parents have a very unsuccessful lawyer and that they end up having to pay out millions - might do something to rescue a few flagging musical careers!! ;)
  11. john turner

    john turner You don't want to do that. Trust me. Staff Member Administrator

    Mar 14, 2000
    atlanta ga
    yeah, all we need is another poison/ratt/cinderella reunion tour :p
  12. BaroqueBass


    Jul 8, 2000
    Salem, OR
    you might be saying that in jest, but alot of people (myself included) would LOVE to follow a tour like that. :p
  13. Thor

    Thor Moderator Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

    That's interesting! Are you suggesting that the attorneys that filed these individual lawsuits
    keyed on these individuals because of their specific demographics?

    That they may have intentionally chosen a pre-teen on the West side for who she was and where she lived, to the exclusion of other file-sharers?

  14. Figjam


    Aug 5, 2003
    Boston, MA
    Id be screwed.. lets see, 150,000 times about 40,000...
  15. Like I said earlier,if they "catch" me(I have less than 1,000 songs) They mine as well shoot me,I don't have that kind of money.

    Plus,there's people with litterly 5 times as much as me...why not go after them? all well...

    RIAA is lame,IMO.
  16. Can they catch up with Kazaa lite users?

    And also, since I took all my files out of K Lite, and put them in a different folder, can they find out then?
  17. BaroqueBass


    Jul 8, 2000
    Salem, OR
    methinks they're going after the uploaders first.
  18. Thor, I'm suggesting that it's possible. ;)

  19. Thor

    Thor Moderator Staff Member Gold Supporting Member

    That's big, brother!

    I suppose a clever and high priced NY lawyer will have some fun in equal protection and so forth, with it. Too bad it will take so long to resolve.

    My liability right now= $0.00.

    I buy all my stuff, but I will never ever buy a SheetMetallica, Sony, EMI etc. album again if I can help it.

    And, personally, I think CD sales are down for a few reasons.

    1} Prices are too high. So demand is down.

    2} Quality of the music is deteriorating in the mainstream production world. I won't pay for shoot. Sorry.

    3} High price and low quality = Poor value.
    I'll spend my hard earned kronas somewhere else.

    I'm buying more stuff from small independent producers and sites with interesting ideas. Sony et al, have lost sight of the market segment I am in. As the market fragments, if you focus on the totally mainstream, the fringes and niches get carved out by someone else. Usually at your expense.

    Kind of like the Hollywood Studio with that one blockbuster Kevin Costner summer movie, the marketplace is sounding compressed, homogenized and totally predictable. I've seen it and heard it before.

    It is easy for the execs there to blame downloading, but it is the producers lack of value that is the underlying root disease in the recording industry today.