# 2-5-1s

Discussion in 'General Instruction [BG]' started by afromoose, Apr 22, 2009.

1. ### afromooseGuest

Does anybody know a good resource for ii-V-I progressions, examples of different types and discussion etc?

Thanks

2. ### LowBSixCommercial User

Mar 25, 2008
818 ~ 805 ~ L.A.
Endorsing Artist: GHS Strings
Let's use the key of C
II - Dm7
V = G7
I = Cma7...

Transpose and do the same for all keys...
Does that make sense?

3. ### afromooseGuest

Yeah that makes sense sure, but I was thinking about one's involving half diminished etc, 7+9 and stuff like that. I thought there were more types than the basic ii7, V7, I7.

Like for example minor key 251s

4. ### LowBSixCommercial User

Mar 25, 2008
818 ~ 805 ~ L.A.
Endorsing Artist: GHS Strings
If you write out a C scale and then add the 3rd and then the 5th and then the 7th, you'll see how to put it together...

It's an involved learning process, which takes time and application of to really understand it...

Look for Dick Grove Theory & Harmony Books and my former instructor from Dick Grove is a Joel Di Bartolo from Arizona State... just 'google' his name and he's written some great books!!!

Feb 11, 2007
Finland
6. ### BananaKing

May 15, 2008
Vancouver, B.C.
Some already mentioned Aebersold, so my work here is done

7. ### ac1710

May 12, 2008
If you want to go cheesy (and I'm talking baroque cheese ) remember that the classic ii - v - i is a ii7b - v - 1

The b refers to a first inversion so in the key of C....

D7/f*- (ii7b)
G - (v)
C - (1)

I would stress that the ii-v-i progression often takes place at the end of a progression as some kind of turnaround or ending. Therefore the bass players role is absolutely critical and must be solid as a rock. There is very little need to try something clever here as this progression is usually crucial to the structure of a piece.

Sure if your soloing then thats a different matter...

8. ### afromooseGuest

Yeah this is all cool - I understand what a basic ii V I is, and why it's used as a final cadence. I'm talking more about pieces where there's long successions of ii V Is, and in particular, ones with fruity harmonies.

A good example would be that type of 2 5 1 where you have to use melodic minor parent to make it work, that came up in the melodic minor mode thread. I thought there might be a list of ii V I chord progressions with more complex harmonies (not just the basic one for diatonic harmony in a major key).

9. ### Bruce LindfieldUnprofessional TalkBass ContributorGold Supporting MemberIn Memoriam

There are Major and Minor .....

10. ### afromooseGuest

Yeah, that's what I thought, for starters.

11. ### Deacon_Blues

Feb 11, 2007
Finland
For something non-jazzy, listen to the song "we're all alone" by for instance Rita Coolidge or Boz Scaggs. There's a few 2-5-1's in it to check out. Here's Rita's version:

12. ### Bruce LindfieldUnprofessional TalkBass ContributorGold Supporting MemberIn Memoriam

But in a Minor version - the I chord is a minor and the ii chord is Minor with b5 - different to a Major ii-V-I !

13. ### afromooseGuest

Yeah major, minor, any others?

14. ### Treybass

Mar 2, 2008
Norfolk, VA
playjazznow.com is an excellent resource. download in every key, and transpose starting with the key of Bb, then Eb, and all the way around the circle of fifths.

in the key of Bb, the progression goes like this...

II - Cm7
V - F7
I - Bbmaj
VI - G7b9 (the 6th is used to go back to Cm7)

15. ### ugly_bassplayerSupporting Member

Jan 21, 2009
Québec
Charlie Parker Omnibook.
It will take you a lifetime to get threw that thing.

16. ### Bruce LindfieldUnprofessional TalkBass ContributorGold Supporting MemberIn Memoriam

Major or Minor ....

People seem to be ignoring this choice!!

17. ### middlebit

Sep 10, 2005
København
I think that unless otherwise stated, the given key is Major. That seems to be consistent with everything I've read and heard about it, anyway.

18. ### Bruce LindfieldUnprofessional TalkBass ContributorGold Supporting MemberIn Memoriam

But you are missing my point - in that these are a possibility that everybody seems to be ignoring!!

So - the original question was about examples of different types!

19. ### middlebit

Sep 10, 2005
København
That was not clear from your last post, including Treybass' quote. Sorry. But didn't you already point out that there are such a thing as minor ii-V-i's?

20. ### Bruce LindfieldUnprofessional TalkBass ContributorGold Supporting MemberIn Memoriam

I was just pointing out that in this thread people are talking about keys as if there is no such thing as major and minor - that just saying Bb, totally defines what you are talking about - when it is only half the story.